Folks in GS Nationals FB Page Wanting LSx Allowed?

I've turned off notifications for the post as it is turning into "one of those" but there is a contingent that wants to "expand" the event to attract more cars, sponsors and spectators by allowing Buick bodies to run non-Buick engines. AKA, LSx engines.

First, I have nothing against a good LSx swap but they are not rare, not interesting and they still make them today. They have their events, LS Fest among the bigger ones. I've been to it and it was cool. I even saw a 70 GS with an LS swap. It doesn't do anything for me. There is no challenge to getting an LS in something. They put them in everything. It's been done before. Nothing new under the sun in that regard. I saw a slick Honda S2000 with an LS, T-56 that was awesome.

But why would a Buick-minded group of folks go to an event to watch bellybutton cars with junkyard truck engines and turbos run? Let alone the potential for them to overrun any event they are allowed into.

Thoughts, comments, snide remarks?

 

Lack of Buick parts,no inovation,waiting for parts.just to name a few reasons

 

No.

Patrick

 

No.

When the GN's came out we had an invasion of sorts and it was a totally different crowd there for awhile. Even though they were Buick powered there was a lot of talk back then about them "getting their own event." The ones who've stuck w/'em are Buick guys & I love seeing the Turbo cars there now!

 

The LS swap is the CSB swap of yesterday.

Back in the 70s, I was a young GI and could not find an affordable Buick engine for my 64 Special, so I did a complete driveline swap from a 66 F-85, engine to rear wheels. (including auto to manual and disc brakes up front from a 70 Cutlass).

I heard nothing but crap from all the Chevy folks and how I should have put a Chevy small block in it, (that "you can't put an Olds engine in a Buick") and a lot of guff from the FoMoCo and MoPar guys. (no one I knew had a Buick).

Until I put it on the road.

It was a little beast, and other than one 427 'vette, a turbo Caddy and a 67 Olds 442 with a big block, nothing else could catch it.

It was just a "miracle" build. Everything came together and worked.

Even spanked a guy on a Suzuki GS 1100, and he caught me at a light and told me he had never been beat by a car.

If you cut me, I bleed Tri-Shield red, white and blue.

 

Sorry- I would go the other way on this. The current trend is LS engines and modern drive lines. I have seen quite a few tastefully executed Buick’s with LS platforms in them (I would refer you to Todd Miller’s former GSX clone). There should be no reason for them to be excluded from any Buick event. A completely separate race class and/or show class is fair...

Guys, fewer people are joining the “ranks” of the classic car hobby. We need to support what we love (and the brand we love) any way we can.

 

No
For me it's about the Buick big block motor that came out in 1967. How cool is it that the "father" of that motor was at the event? How many other brands can claim that?!

 

Don’t get me wrong I love having a big block Buick car there’s nothing like it! There’s just a lack of parts and blocks are getting so scarce it won’t be too much longer before you won’t be able to find one. We need a cast-iron replacement block.

 

Technically speaking the “LS” platform is not exclusive to Chevrolet. There was even a Buick that had an LS variant. That said, I’m not a fan of an engine swap in a real GS car. If it’s a run of the mill Skylark or Regal then go for it...

 

I want to avoid the latest trend guys. The same guys that had a GN in 86-87, then jumped to supercharged Cobra Mustangs, on and on and then on to Hellcats. Those guys have nothing for brand affinity, they are looking for the next fast car to thrash. I compare them to seagulls; they swoop in, make a lot of noise, crap all over everything and are gone when the next hot car emerges. I wouldn't be surprised if half of them don't own Teslas by now.

Ken Betts has your back on that. I talked to him at the GS Nats and progress has slowed due to the madness of the last year but it is coming.

 

Yeah OK

 

There's a tasteful/acceptable way to do an LS swap and Justin's Skylark (Green GSX at this year's event) is an example of that. That car had a BB Buick for years,He's a "Buick Guy", but their program outgrew the aftermarket for the 455.

As Buick as I am, I accept that.

Too many people do it as an "easy way out"...that's the reason not to allow LS power at your event because those "builds" would pollute the event in an unfavorable way.

 

Buick engines are becoming more and more difficult to find, especially the 400-455 engines. Eventually it will become near impossible to find or afford a 455. Do you think a weekend hobbyist type guy is going to be willing to spend 5 grand for a new block just to keep his Buick pure? More and more folks are going with what's readily available for their Buick. If you want attendance numbers up at the Nationals you're going to have to make some concessions.

 

That’s the truth right there. I believe and this is just my opinion the aluminum block was a big mistake. If it were a cast-iron block you could feed both markets the race and the hobbyist. Even Oldsmobile has a awesome aftermarket iron block for under five grand and I can’t believe the market there is much bigger or bigger at all then the Buick market

 

I was talking to Denny Manner

I was standing there when Ken was discussing it w/someone & he said had the foundry they were going to use not raised the price they'd be done and that they're very close w/a different foundry and should be finalized this week.

 

I think it would be a big mistake to allow the LSX as an accepted modification to the event. I have noting against the swap in the creation of a hot rod, but there are plenty of events for these configurations. I understand that the Buick crowd is a small one and will likely never get an opportunity to grow (nothing new coming out of GM), but the 2021 nationals was pretty impressive in my view. I think getting more participation for existing Buick enthusiasts is where the focus should be, I mean I'm guilty as I haven't been since 2004 until this year (life gets in the way you know), but I plan on making it a bigger priority in the future and hope others do the same. Yes, true 400-455 engines are getting more scarce and it would certainly be beneficial to have a new iron option.

 

Back in my racing days I almost caved and went with a BBC, it would have been so easy, I had a friend who ran a 64 Cutlass with a LS7 big block, He ran mid 10s with very little done to the engine outside of a little head work and a cam, He ran it for 5 years without doing anything but tune it and change the oil, when he tore it down the valve spring retainers were getting little hairline cracks in them, that's it. Anyway that little voice in my head kept saying are you a Buick guy or not? I had to concede I am a Buick guy, besides about that time I acquired my STG-2 heads and couldn't get them on and running fast enough. lets keep it pure guys there is no reason to muddy the waters!

Bob H.

 

What would the big deal be if they had their own class? I don't have a dog in the fight so it doesn't really matter to me.

 

That should never be allowed, ever. Swapping to an LS is admitting you can't compete or lack the imagination to be innovative. TA has given us real options for more than 20 years. Kenn-Bell before that. Now, Ken Betts is bringing new innovation to the game. Did you see that head he was showing off?

If they want to allow non-Buick power, I say they have to qualify first by owning a Buick-powered car. AKA, no LS-swapped car unless they also bring a Buick-powered car. I refuse to give in to the latest fad because that is what it is.

I'm not a purist or a engine bigot. I've owned a lot of non-Buicks but we are talking about the Buick GS Nationals, not LS Fest Lite!

Shoot, lets all swap electric motors and batteries and be done with it!

To put it another way, I'm not willing to have a dozen White Castle meals instead of one filet mignon steak dinner.

 

Whether you want it or not sooner or later track owners, sponsors/coordinators will cave in.

Why?

Think of how many tracks have already closed, are in the process of closing or struggling to stay open.

Everyone knows how a business works. X amount of people must attend for the event to be profitable or at the least break even. Or why even hold it unless you plan on footing the bill yourself.