:Comp: I figured this might be one of the best possible places to post this. I`ve been contacted by Hot Rod magazine and they are looking to do a full bore "Hemi vs Buick Shoot-Out". It will be a Hot Rod magazine Exclusive including private track rental ect. This will truly be a chance of a life time given the sheer number of subscribers and news stand sales Hot Rod has. More than likely the shoot-out will take place in the month of Sept, so there`s plenty of prep time. Basically the F.A.S.T. rules will apply and the shoot-out will take place on slicks. :3gears: The mopar running will be my 69 Hemi Road Runner. (Dads old car) and were looking for anybody with a Buick who would like a shot at one of these shoot-outs. This was gonna be huss-huss until it hit the news stands but after we contacted a few Buick guy`s we have had no luck trying to locate somebody. This is our last ditch effort. Please e-mail me if your instrested: hemidave1@aol.com THANKS!
Darn, if only hot rod did a test of buick bang for buck vs hemi bang for buck . . . i may have had a chance. 11 second car for 2000 bucks on slicks, hard to beat huh. Wrong car, wrong era, not what your lookin for, but just thought id throw it out there. Oh and thats with working A/C, power everything, etc. Dave I really have enjoyed reading about you in the magzines over the past few years, your purple challenger is awesome. Do you still have it as well? Maybe some stage 1 guys will step up to the plate on this one, but from what Ive heard many are getting annoyed with the criticism they get for "cheating" and such, and the whole deal about how grandma cars cant be fast. Just talk, but over time it does start to pick at you. Best of luck to you guys.
Hi Jacob, The Challenger has been sold and thanks for the kind comments. I think the Buick Cheating thing has been over since the F.A.S.T. class started. Any time it`s brought up now it`s kind of a "fun" thing and besides that all the FAST cars are called cheaters, i kind of like it and everybody including the Buick guy`s who run with us play with that word all weekend. It`s a different time. If this shoot-out offer in the pages of Hot Rod Magazine goes unanswered. o No: I think this Buick vs Hemi thing might finally be laid to rest or at least put to bed for a VERY long time. Hot Rod of all magazines doesn`t usally get involved in this type of stuff and now they are jumping in with both feet. We have probably 5 FAST HEMI cars that would give their right arm to be the car in this shoot-out. Were loking for ONE kick ass Buick and the shoot-out will be on slicks. Safty equipment is legal, roll bars,ect. Can you guy`s pull something togeather?
Mr Gessler I am surprised that Mr. Gessler hasn't stepped seeing in my eyes he has the fastest stock appearing Buick out there? Has he been challenged? Bill
Does anybody belong to the GSCA site? I can`t log on there? Can somebody PLEASE copy and paste my 1st post on that site? THANKS!
I think in this format and on slicks, the Buicks are a sure loser. All you have to look at is the MPH difference between Dave's and Greg's cars. Let's not forget that the original contention was that the Stage 1 is competitive with a Hemi. It has defended that reputation well in all of the previous races. At this level of racing and on slicks, the Buick is purely outclassed in terms of factory engine parts, performance options, and so-on. But all that has been debated before too. Now if at the very least the Stage 2 package were allowed, there might be a chance.
welp... Your not going to get a legit Stage 2 taker on this, unless headers are allowed for the Buicks. The Hempi's already have superior factory exhaust manifolds and 2 carbs... the only two documented Stage 2 car's currently in the world circulation, would be Parquette's or Rix's, and they both would need full exhaust behind their headers. A Stage 1 car run 132 with cast exhaust manifolds??... not in our lifetime... Soooo, I predict this idea will die soon, unfortunately. I believe Lasseter had headers in his infamous Bady confrontation. JH
So, are we talking STOCK engines? Or is this a "throw as much money at it as you can" event? If that is the case, then isn't this a bit rediculous? After all, once you drop 20 grand into an engine is it really marque against marque at that point? Heck, if that is the case, why can't we put Rod Hendrickson's car up there? Is there a limit to cam specs? Is it strictly factory grind vs factory grind? Is porting allowed? How will we verify the CI of each motor?
The engine has to follow the FAST rules. I`m just throwing this out there... If the Buick was allowed headers would we have a taker? What`s engine mods does the Stage 2 consist of? That could be instresting..
double welp.. DD, the Stage 2 option was over the counter, and involved a different exhaust port configuration cast iron head(s), Edlebrock dual plane intake, Holley carb, generic cam, and headers. There are no cast exhaust manifolds for the Stage 2. F.A.S.T. would require a cast iron intake/Qjet, on top of cast iron Stage 2 heads and headers, and I don't know anybody, anywhere, that has done this... my Stage 1 car is a painted alum head stage 2 setup, painted dual plane, Qjet, with headers, capped up.... i'll provide my car, if someone (Rix) wants to provide the guts... :Smarty: JH
Looking at some old books stage 2 consisted of: Stage II heads which had raised round exhaust ports and standard style intake ports. 11:1 CR with forged pistons w/valve reliefs Stage II camshaft 2 piece headers designed by Kustom Headers of Flint, MI. for Stage II exhaust ports. 2 1/8 primaries. B4B edelbrock intake. Something along those lines, problem is given the limited production of the parts your going to have a hard time finding anyone with original stage II iron heads and the rest of the package. Most are going to be the aluminum versions now cast and sold by TA performance.
As part of the Stage 2 "package," wouldn't the B4B and Holley carb be included? I suppose it would be fair to allow the hemi-car headers since the stage 2 requires them. Wouldn't the Buick only have to sound like a "stock" Stage 2? Getting an iron head stage 2 might not be as hard as one thinks as most of them are owned by old-school hard-core Buick racers and not collectors or parts hoarders. Also remember that anything under the tin of the engine is wide-open for whatever the builder wants to do. "Must look and sound stock, except for safety items." Dave, I would label the Stage 2 as Buick's only serious attempt at a race-program; therefore a befitting competitor to its Mopar counterpart, the Hemi. That is, if parts designed on the engineer's lunch-hour are a company sponsored program (no kidding, ask Mr. Dennis Manner). Certainly less R&D than the Mopar program. It sure would be a Hell of a fun contest to see and fuel a new dabate for those that are bored with the old one.
I`d be OK with headers on a FAST Buick, but if a shoot-out were to go down with all those other parts added? People reading would probably be thinking "why does the HEMI have to look stock and the Buick has race car parts on it" I don`t think that will go over well. Win or lose it may not look right.. Even though I`m OK with headers everybody reading would be asking WHY? I`d love for this to go down, but if we have just come to the point where the Buick in stock appearing form has to many limitations? It may be time to move on from this Buick vs Hemi. Really kind of a sad day . Is the famous rivalry over after all these years? We have 8 months to get ready, but we need somebody to step up now and commit.
DD, then you need mine or Greg's car, with Rix's longblock and headers, Greg's intake and carb, and your all set. Considering the vast superiority of the Hempi factory exhaust headers, I don't see an issue... look at the lack of disparity of the Stage III 426 Max wedge manifolds... JH
Who is RIX? Just as long as his long block is F.A.S.T. legal, I personally don`t have a problem with the headers. (I`ll have to check with Hot Rod) All other FAST rules will apply except slicks, of course. Make some calls and try to pull it togeather.
