Head and cam swap, guidance for a newbie?

I think you should measure your actual compression being that it is a older block and go forward from there..

 

Ok, how would i go about doing that? Im new to this

 

You will need to measure how far the piston is down hole or its depth. With piston at top dead center get A straight edge across cylinder and feeler gauge can do that if you don't have a depth micrometer. If engine is original you could be at about .058 . next yo need to measure thickness of headgasket . crushed would be more accurate fel pros are about .043-045. . next you need to cc head with a liquid measuring device. And determine the cc of piston dish . can do liquid or measure depth and dish size for an estimate. If its original there are basically only 2 piston designs available. Then the are compression calculaters online . if you do a search for compression calculater. I like summit racings but its basic. There is Wallace and one from a Pontiac site that does dynamic compression with your cam specs. You could check your machine shop if they can cc head for you.

 

Did you get the dial indicator with a magnetic base?

 

Yes it showed up yesterday. It didnt come with a long extension tip though. It came with about 20 or so smaller tips but not the long one ive seen used when measuring lifter lift.

 

Oh and scratch the cam thing. I found it. The damn thing was in a box in a box of old baseball cards that I had from the 80s-90s . I have no clue how it got in there. So 212 cam it is.

 

Good. I gots to go now but we will use it later figure out your compression ratio.
We can improvise on the long extension by using a length of heavy gauge coat hanger.

 

I got the block cleaned up, and painted what i could. Got my dial indicator, and a tube of Joe Gibbs assembly lube, I think im ready to slide the cam and lifters in. I have a few questions about the process here...
Ive read that the lube go on all the lobes and lifter bases only, What about the cam bearing faces? Should i do anything with the lifters themselves and their bore? Should I get a specific type of break in oil to pour over the lifters and cam after its,in?
Just want to make sure i get everything prepped correctly.

Thanks

 

Since you will be running the engine soon you can coat the cam bearing surface with the engine oil.
The lifters can be fully coated with the Gibbs break-in lube.

After the font cover is on, before you install the distributor, prime the oil pump with an electric drill and pump oil till it comes out the rocker arms.

 

You mentioned stock rockers. New stock replacements, or worn out old ones? That can make a big difference in how well that engine runs.

 

Worn out old ones. I have both sets of original rocker shafts/rockers, one from the rebuilt heads, and the ones from my driver. Thats the only thing thats not new in the head. I dont have the experiences eye for what is good or not but the ones from my car looked really clean and good when I removed them. Hopefully ok? Is it a given that they woukd not really be reusable?

 

Ok, update, I found a degree wheel to borrow. Following the instructions posted earlier I used my dial indicator and found true TDC best i could. Cam is installed and installed the chain gears dot to dot. Heres where im losing it, along with the few hairs left on my head. Following instructions again (attempting to) I set the Dial indicator on lifter lip and zeroed it with the lifter on the heel of the lobe. When I rotate crank and read .050 on the dial indicator as the lifter rises I get 5* ATDC?? on the wheel (see pic). And when I continue to the other side of the lobe as the lifter falls (again reading .050 on dial) i get 139* BTDC?? (see pic) Basically I am lost and sure ive done something assbackards because these numbers dont look anything like the Instructions posted earlier. am i reading something wrong or install the cam wrong? need to use a different keyway?
Please bear with me here, as confused as I am with all these #s, im trying.

 

Dot to dot

Lifter rising to .050

With lifter rising to .050 on dial indicator
Lifter at .050 on backside of cam lobe

 

What are the .050 specs on cam card?.

 

Alec, unfortunately I dont have it. Im referencing the numbers Paul put up earlier on where it should be.

 

Your cranking clockwise? Looks like 139 before bottom dead center. And I believe Paul said 3 before top and your at 5 after. That 8 below spec. But you don't have cam bolt in place . Tighten cam and fuel encentric and distributed gear down reset and try again. Looks as though you have a double roller with a 4 advance and 4 retard option. Should be right for zero . A triangle would be advanced and a square would be retard.

 

Yes clockwise. Ok, i wasnt sure if I was reading the wheel correctly. I'll throw the eccentric, gear and bolt on the cam and try again tomorrow after work. Thanks.

 

Matt

You are doing good. The 212 cam has a 218 degree .050" intake duration.
You have 5* ATDC and 138* BTDC which is 41* ABDC.
From 5* ATDC it is 175* to BDC then you traveled another 41* ABDC.
175 + 41 = 216* intake duration

The center of the lobe = 216/2 or 108*

If you add the 5* ATDC where the lobe begins you get 108 + 5 = 113 ATDC which is where the lobe center is located.
The lobe center should be at 106 degrees ATDC so the cam is 7 degrees retarded.

If you have a 3 key crank gear Advance the cam by moving the crank gear to the triangle slot and use the tringle marked tooth to line up with the cam gear tooth.
Then try again and see what you get.

After you do the intake lobe set up on the exhaust lobe and get the readings so we can verify the cam specs.

When you set the pointer for zero on the degree wheel did you have any problems getting 11.5 degrees before and after TDC with the piston .050" in the hole?

Paul

 

X2 on getting all the other parts on the cam bolted down to make this more accurate. However you are on the right track and in the ballpark. I would suggest you change the timing chain set from "0" to the "+4" setup before you bolt her down.

The cam is 218/230 on a 110 LSA which means the timing numbers come in at 3 BTDC/35 ABDC intake and 51 BBDC/ -1 ATDC exhaust assuming you want 4* advance(106* ICL) which is a "normal" installation procedure. -1/39 I, 45/5 E would be the numbers for straight up.

You are getting -5 BTDC(5 ATDC)/41 ABDC(you're just reading it wrong as 139 BTDC). So at this point you are retarded about 8* going by the intake opening and you have less intake duration at .050", 216*. Going by those numbers you need to get the timing chain set up to the +4 position to get you into the straight up ballpark. That should change your reading numbers to -1 BTDC/37 ABDC.

Setting the timing set to +4 is pretty much normal with TA cams because for some reason they like to grind some of their cams straight up but then they want you to install them at +4. It boggles my mind.

If I was you I'd like to confirm that I actually have TDC correctly marked with the degree wheel. This is how I'd confirm that I was close. Bring the engine around to TDC with the degree wheel. You're going to be changing the timing chain position so that is what you should be doing anyway. Pull the degree wheel and marker. Temporarily install the timing chain cover with only a bolt or two. Slide the balancer onto the crankshaft. The "0" mark on the balancer should be lining up very, very close to the "0" mark on the timing chain cover. If it is not then either you miscalculated TDC with the degree wheel or the balancer ring has slipped. After confirming that the balancer didn't slip I'd assume my degree wheel TDC position was off. There may be some play in the balancer but it should be less than a degree. If the alignment is off then that may account for your cam being indicated in a retarded position. Generally speaking I'd assume the factory got the markings right(or very close) especially if this was the first time I was degreeing a cam. I always do this to check myself and also to confirm that the balancer/timing chain cover markings are aligned correctly.`