Powerjection III Install and Review

Its probably a little too late but if you want I have a set of hard lines that I had made up at a local shop. This allowed me to drop the PJ3 a good 1"-1.5". The lines come out and bend up wards and towards the pass. side. I originally had to run a 2" carb spacer to get the fuel pressure regulator to clear on my 351C then with these lines made up i was able to drop down to just the supplied PJ3 carb spacer/insulator.

I recently removed my PJ3 and swapped it to my 428cj powered Mach 1. In order to get it the FPR to clear the stock air cleaner I had to go back to the stock PJ3 fuel line setup which cleared on my mustang. :beer If you want I'd sell you the lines cheap as I have no need for them now. By the way my PJ3 is doing an excellent job of managing the 428cj and I'm very happy with it at the moment.

 

Hey, I tried ordering 2 70029 kits with 73001 upgrade kits from my distributor and was was told the profession products had none and had no eta on getting more. Whats up. Discontinued already.o No:

 

Hello again this is Michael from Denmark
i have just installed a new PJIII with FOD
on a crate ZZ383 sbc (MSD 6AL) when i turn the key on (engine NOT running) the tach in the car and on the computer is all over the place and the PJ is fueling the engine the tach go's from 1500-4000rpm engine still not running ? if i hit the key and start the engine it has a lompy ilde around 1200rpm tach still swings from 1200-2500rpm
i put it in drive and took it for a cruise after 2500rpm everythings if fine super fast trottle response AFR target is spot on tach is correct if i do a dragrace start it stomples and go wired ontil it gets to 2500rpm then the tires starts smoking. i can't turn the key on this will fill the engine with fuel ??? any ideas ?? sorry my english
MSD 6AL
MSD pro billit dist.
MSD Blaster 2 coil
MSD sparkplug wires

 

Put the phenolic spacer in. With the aluminum spacer my engine temp was 177 and my ECU temp was 144. With the phenolic spacer my engine temp was 179 and my ECU temp was 137. Both after long drives. Is it worth worrying over 7 degrees, I don't think so. I am going to put the aluminum spacer with the EGR on it back in and not worry about it.

 

Michael, I'd check the following things:

1. Make sure the black wire in the PJ harness labeled "SP" is not connected to anything and that the end is insulated so it cannot touch ground.
2. Make sure the green wire labeled "CP" is connected to the TACH output line on you MSD 6AL box, not the coil.
3. Make sure that in your main setup the coil input is set to "6A TACH". It comes setup to "Coil" like below from the factory.

You will need to also connect your tachometer to the TACH output on the 6AL box. If using a factory tach you may need a tach adapter from MSD for it to operate properly.

 

Hi Steiner99
when i load a new file the red marker is like you posted the second i put it in 6a tach it starts to go crazy i have check'ed all grounds just to make sure. I have the green wire and a aftermarket tach in the car both mounted to the 6a box, i tried without the tach in the car same thing happend. But i think i have a problem with the MSD box i treid to turn the key to ACC without the box got any power and the promblem was gone the second i put power to the box it got crazy again.
My buddy that owns the car has a MSD BMT box so we will try to mount that insted and see what happens i'll get back

 

Michael,
You can check the TACH output of the MSD box if you have a meter. With they key on but the car off you should see no voltage from the TACH output. The output is a 12V DC square wave so on your meter it would show up as about 8.5V AC if it is sending a signal.

 

chevy502dk

With the PJ3 unplugged does the tach in the car jump around. Is that a HEI distributor, if so put the Module back in and use the tach out on it and see if it does it thing.

 

hi schum before if the PJ3 was install'd the tach was normal it is not a HEI distributor

 

If you unplug all the wires from the PJ3 and turn the key on does the tach still jump around.

 

I have had a little issue arise on my car that I could use some help with. I removed the PJ3 from my first car and installed it on a 69 mustang 428cj with manual transmission. For the most part the car is bone stock with Long tube headers and pulls 16-18" of vacuum. The car had been running great with the PP pump, PP prefilter and probably had almost 75 miles on it.

I installed a new Walbro pump in order to get rid of the loud PP pump supplied with the kit. I also swapped out my PP prefilter with a clear one from the parts house because the PP one would always leak.

After installing the new parts I took the car out on some WOT runs and mid way through one the car began to stall out and only had about 25% power. I got her pulled over and saw that the clear fuel filter was 1. Full of rust and dry; 2. I also saw that I had installed the filter backwards. :spank:

I limped the car home and replaced the filter and fired the car up and let it run for about 20 mins in the driveway. It was running ok and when I came outside to hook the laptop up just to see where the ADL was after the filter running it out of fuel I saw that the car was at 210 degrees, the ECM was 170 and my AFR was 18.8 with no movement, my O2 light wasn't on and the ADL said it was at -35% WTF? So I shut the car off and decided to retry it again.

This time when I started the car up everything was reading fine and the car was idling fine. Since it had been stalling out because of fuel I rev'ed the motor up a little to see if it would happen again. Upon letting off of the throttle the car began to idle down and would begin to stall. When looking at the real time data the injector mode would say cranking while it was stumbling, then it would shift to After-start PW and would run great, then when it went to Idle mode it would almost stall out and the cycle would repeat. The car did this for about 5 mins while I tried every combination of more fuel, less fuel etc and nothing fixed the problem.

After messing with it long enough I finally decided to just make a new tune. I started with the base big block and began to copy in all my old cold start info. This time I could only get the car to start for a few seconds then die. What I found out was the the PJ3 was only priming the pump for cranking but wouldn't do anything after that. I finally put my old tune back on and got the car running long enough to get it back inside. Does anyone have ideas where to look. When it was running fine the AFR's were correct its just this idle surging thing was very weird and new.

I have the butterflys set to have the car idle about 800 rpms and the PJ3 warm idle set at 850, so the IAC is out of the equation in any of the idle surging. Does anyone have any idea where to look? I did splice my tach back into the PJ3 as well but when it was idling earlier I didn't have a problem one with ignition noise. I'm planning to order a new tank and fuel line (I'm running the stock fuel line as my return) so rust won't be an issue. Whats hard to believe is I only have maybe 5 miles on the car now and the filter has already plugged once. When I installed the EFI fuel system on the car I completely drained the tank and put in new gas as well. Currently the prefilter is clean and I'm still having issues. I've checked the post filter and its fine.

When i get home from work I'll post my log and my tune so people can see what its doing. I should of left well enough alone as it was running great with the loud PP pump and with out the tach. Now I have a quiet pump, a tach and a car that runs like crap. :spank:

 

Been studying this thread for some time, props to those that have so willing to help out. I am requesting some help getting my PJIII running.

I can get her to start, running 10 seconds tops and then she dies. If I retard the timing a good bit she will chug for 20-30 seconds with a surging idle then die. She will idle from 800 down to 350, catch and then go back up, repeat. She only starts when I wait to hear the priming shot..pffft.

Here are my specs so far: Car is set up for SCCA ITE road racing, not drag.
98* Florida heat so it should not be cold start?
383 SBC Dart SHP black all forged internals. 11:1 compression.
Solid Roller Cam 250*@.050" / .604" lift. Full roller rockers, girdles, 7500rpm redline.
220CC fully CNC'd heads (DRJ's Airwolfs)
Heavily worked Crosswind intake.
1 7/8" long tube headers.
HEI with MSD 6al
Bosch 044 pump at 60psi with stock 60# injectors

Just over 600HP at the crank with a manual 5 speed tranny. No A/C, smog etc.. E-water pump and E-fan.
Torque is over 520ftlbs from 3500 to 6500rpms
Vacuum at idle with the carb was 8" at 950rpms and 21* initial.

Any suggestions on a quick fix? I was going to load in the cold start, IAC and torque parameters from Stiener99's screen shots but thought I would check in first. His 400 should be close enough to my 383 to get things going, right?

What other information would you need to get me going? I have verified the simple stuff like vacuum leaks, timing, valve adjustments etc..

Thanks!!

 

CJ428mach,

It sounds like you might've cooked the fuel pump.

Have you measured fuel pressure?

Is it an external pump? or in-tank? If external, is the pump located lower than the bottom of the tank?

I have an external pump and used to go through a pump every 2-3 months (kept a spare on-hand at all times). Now I removed the inlet filter and only run a filter on the outlet side (to protect the engine), I've been using the same pump for about 4 years now. These pumps are great at pushing fuel, but horrible at sucking fuel. I still carry a spare but haven't needed it.

-BC

 

I would start with Steiner's cold start and IAC settings and I bet it'll get you close.

 

BC, I appreciate the response, and when i was having issues I did check the fuel pressure gauge at the PJ3 and at the time it was still 43 PSI. I do plan on keeping the PP pump on hand as a spare. If I knew this thing was going to work good, I'd put an in tank pump in my brand new tank. Although I'm not going to keep throwing good money after bad on this thing if I can't ever make it work.

 

Have you had it running long enough for the O2 sensor to come on and see what the AFR is doing. Can you keep it running by playing with the throttle. Can you make a log of you trying to start it and post it along with you cal. setup. I have a 383 also but a little less than you have. Here is the cal. file for the last time I had it out and a log file.

 

cj428mach
"I limped the car home and replaced the filter and fired the car up and let it run for about 20 mins in the driveway. It was running ok and when I came outside to hook the laptop up just to see where the ADL was after the filter running it out of fuel I saw that the car was at 210 degrees, the ECM was 170 and my AFR was 18.8 with no movement, my O2 light wasn't on and the ADL said it was at -35% WTF? So I shut the car off and decided to retry it again."

Did you go into your ADL table and remove the -35%. I would clear the whole table and start over. I like to copy the Cal. file after I take it out so I can go back to any file and load it in and start over from that point on instead of going right back to the beginning. Do you have a previous Cal. file to compare the ADL tables to see how much fuel it pulled out or add when it went down on you.

 

I just tried Steiner's calibration and it made a huge difference. Got her to somewhat idle now. Still getting up to 950rpms. Still surges up and down a little for about 30 seconds, then jumps up about 400 rpms quickly and dies. If I get on the throttle I can rev her up fine, scarry how quickt he throttle response is over the carb.

From Steiner's numbers I had to add more cold fuel enrichment due to the large cam. Vacuum was only 7-8" at 850rpm. Got her running long enough to set initial timing.

I'll make a video now to show what it's doing at post it up. I'll also make a data log.

Thanks for the help!!

 

Video:

youtube.com/watch?v=cGqA0ATME5U&feature=player_embedded

No data log yet, lightening just took out my internet and can't load files to my phone.

 

I actually went and reflashed the original calibration file onto the car. When I got home tonight from work I was playing with the car and blipping the throttle up to 3k+ when the RPMs would come back down they'd hit the 800 rpm's its supposed to idle at then drop down to about 4-500 then come back up again. It had never done this before and it has begun to try to stall out when pushing in the clutch while coming to a stop.

Here is my log of it surging at idle and a copy of my calibration file if anyone wants to look.
calibration file
http://www.filefactory.com/file/ccdc36e/n/428_cj_1_runs_decent.rsc
Log
http://www.filefactory.com/file/ccdc36d/n/StageIII_Log_File7.S3L