Car is stuck on the street again :-( need some engine mechanics figured out..

I'll take a peek down the hole, but can you really see that through the hole?

Something else that I discovered a while back after taking off the driver's sie valve cover was that those little nylon buttons on top of the springs that help keep things in place were all off but one. Five were found laying lose in there, two were missing.. Any ideas on this? Could this be an indication of something?

uzzled:

 

s i g h..

 

get a flashlight and look...

trust me...you'll be able to see the marks plain as day if they're lined up correctly....

 

Very common. Not an indication of anything else amiss. NAPA has those buttons. Replace them.

 

Tow the car home

Definitly, Tow the car home. That will make the situation better.
now as for the timing gears ect. You do need to get the crud out of the oil pan if possible. Now how possible?????? First drain the oil over night and then I would try to get a 3/4 in heater hose or a 5/8 heater hose would probably be better. about 5 or 6 ft long and tape it with good old duck tape onto the suction hose of a good strong shop vac. Then work around the openings you have in the front of the pan and try to suck the junk out with that set up. If that doesnt work then you will have to drop the pan. :Brow:
What you are doing here is at best a patch job. An engine that has worn out the timing chain and gears enough that it jumps time is basicly worn out. It really needs to be rebuilt. But this action will buy you some more time so you can do it at a more convinent time and place. :laugh: The timing marks on the cam gear and the crank gear must be lined up TOGETHER in between the cam and the crank on the center line. This is the most important part of the operation. :Smarty: If it isnt done right you will have to do it all over again. :Smarty: The timing mark is a small dot on the crank gear that is on the face of the gear.
On the cam gear it can be a dot or an arrow depending on the manufacturer. use a straight edge like a 12 in. ruler to ck the alignment. remember "center line of the engine", both marks to the inside. or another way of putting it , as close together as you can get them, with the crank gear mark to the top and the cam gear mark to the bottom. And both marks on the center line of the engine. The center line of the engine is when you draw an imiganary line from the center of the crank up thru the center of the cam.
Now that all said dont put a plastic covered gear back in there. they are junk, use only all steel stuff. Be sure to put a new front seal in the timing gear cover. Grease the harmonic balancer hub to keep from burning the new seal up. hope this helps. p

 

basic timing

1 bring no 1 cyl up to top dead center. 2 install the gears and chain like I described in my previous post.
Rotate the crank 2 times to ck the installation. Note that the cam will come into proper timing every 2 revs of the crank. if it doesnt then you are off. ck it and change it untill it does.
Bring no 1 cyl back up to tdc.
look at the rotor to see where it points. Wire no 1 spark plug to the rotor pointer. The engine should start. then sett the timing with the vac disconected. then connect the vac advance.

 

Check your firing order... sounds like it is off.

 

Time to go and babysit for three hours while street cleaning takes place; wish me luck with the white chevy cavalier that circles the neighborhood..

 

Good luck, don't give up!

 

Thanks, but the little white cavalier stopped and I was told that he'd give me one more week and I can't push it around the corner any more etc etc..

I went out there and turned the key and it started, but I had to keep it floored to keep it from dying, it was barely idling. I popped it into gear and the car drove half a car length and the died. I managed to restart it and reverse the process so I was atleast back in the same spot again.

I couldn't see down the timing cover hole to see how the chain was aligned.

---------------------------------------

I have three options as I see it.

1. Give it one more shot and take off the timing cover and double check that the chain is on correctly (which I'm 99.5% sure it is correctly on anyway).

2. Try to sell the car as it is for a few hundred and see if someone wants to continue on the project.

3. Order a tow to the yard and take the pieces I think could be useful or sold.

I don't see it as an option to take the car to a shop, cause it's unknown why it isn't running, and I don't want to pay for a shop to try to figure it out and then charge me alot of $$$.

At some point you just have to bite the bullet, I can't keep it on the street and I can't put more $ into it..

 

It's my opinion that you owe it to yourself, after all the work, to take a peek once more under the timing cover.You have all the parts and only need a cover gasket and some time.See if you can take the car to a neighbor or relative so you eliminate the sweeping crew's hassle.Once you find a place to work you can do the job in a day and then know for sure if your timing is right or off a little(that's what it sounds like to me).If that doesn't fix the car then I'll bite the bullet and file it under the valuable lessons learned folder,you should learn something from it no matter the outcome :beer .

 

To bad you did not take a picture of the new timing gears on the car with the marks lined up. I'd hate to tell you to take it back apart again for no reason.

So I guess I vote for option number 1, but before you tear into it again I can only think of one more thing to look at.

You mentioned that the little plastic rocker arm retainers had fallen off on the driver side of the engine. Those little plastic retainers keep the rocker arms in the right place, so without them it is possible for the rocker arm to move out of position. Check to make sure all of the rocker arms are lined up with the valve and pushrod. Also check to make sure the pushrods are not bent. you can do this by watching each valve to see if they all open and close about the same amount. It is helpful if you can get someone to crank it for you while you watch the valves one at a time.

I'd say this is a long shot, but it is all I can think of.

 

So we're back in there digging again.. The status on the placement of the chain seems as good as it gets as far as I can tell, but please take a second look. First I lined up the balancer to confirm that we are in the right position, so it's sitting at dead "0" as we take the cover off.

 

Taking the cover off, it all looks good.

 

So we all can see.. Any ideas on this??? What's next to go after?

 

I don't have access to a crank timing gear, and I can't recall off the top of my head. Can someone post a pic of the mark on another crank gear? Am I missing something or do I not see a mark on this crank gear? Is it that faint ZERO looking mark?

 

Melling timing chain and gears.

 

What's that? I can't tell if its just a play on light or is that a mark of some sort?

 

I might be whistling up the Khyber Pass here, but looking at the keyway tells me that the timing marks are the same in each pic.

Haven't read the entire thread for several days, but couldn't a broken camshaft be a possible cause here??

 

I believe that the "0" mark is the one we're looking for. Look at the comparison in position of the mark in relation to the ridge (keyway?) on mine and Rob's, it must be the "0". Also, when the "0" mark is pointing straight up, the timing mark on the balancer is at 0 on the scale. In the haynes manual, the ridge is also pointing at "2" clockwise, with a mark straight up.