Post your 11/12 second 455 combos!

Ahhhh.. I don't think we need to beat that to death... this is just an interesting side light when discussing 11-12 second combos.

The torque converter is the single most important component, when it comes to both ET and driveability, and does that in more or less of an inverse relationship.. more stall, less ET and diminished "feel" when driving. Plenty of variations for sure, and plenty of opinions on what is ok or not, but certainly a relevant topic for this thread.

Like I said before, no such thing as a 10, 11, or 12 second engine.

It's all about the combo. While the ET gains are noted with high stall, less street oriented converters, the driving manners are often not noted, but that aspect is often the most important thing to the end user.

Very few customer's ask me "how much will this drop my 60' time, in their street car.. simply because most of them rarely ever race it. But every one asks "how will it feel".

If I'm building a wild beast like John is doing with Steve S's car, to go 10.50's with iron heads, driveablity and feel are secondary concerns, for sure.

But the average GSJoe looking in on this, needs to understand that. Converters are not inexpensive, and a bad choice often sours the whole project.

One's goals and priorities need to be clearly defined. This conversation and "bickering", as some may put it, brings that aspect to light.

JW

 

Not even close, but keep dreaming about it.

 

I was going to leave this alone but since Norm brought it up ...

...you again - conveniently - forget the trip to Cecil when it poured like a hurricane. I think most of the group went down Fri and was rained out of the day program .. I drove down Fri after work (left early) drove through torential rain but the storm was moving north and the track had opened for the night program. When I got there at about 8:30p Yardley was the only one left and was packing up. I bolted on the DR's and ripped off 5 passes with the Tuner/Ricer crowd - ALL IN THE 11's. The next day (Sat) I ran another two or three 11 second passes

 

Well.................This thread sure has some "entertaining reading"

My entry into this will be on the slower side with a best of 12.18 @ 112mph, with 12.20's being the norm. The car was my old Stage 1 4-speed affectionately known as the "TURD" (No offense Larry):TU: It was almost a twin to Larry's in it was a '70 triple brown GS.

1970 Buick GS Stage 1, originally a 4-speed
All steel body (3875# with driver)
Stock full interior with buckets & auto console

Motor:

.030 over 455 cu.in. Buick
Speed Pro forged pistons, no block decking w/"felpro blue" head gaskets
Cast Iron Stage-1 Heads, MINOR Bowl work by Finishline motorsports
stock TA Intake
KB 107 Cam w/.490" lift
Holley 830 (circle track carb)
M/T headers w/2" "club exhaust" Flowmaster 3 chamber mufflers
Note: The short block was originally assembled in the 1980's, and had in excess of 20K miles on it. I swapped in the 107 cam, & heads in the late 1990's.

Drivetrain:

Stock T-400 (governor shifted) w/shift kit
Off the shelve 10" TCI conv.
GM 12 bolt w/ 3.90 gear
Stock front suspension w/urethane bushings,
Stock lower rear cont. arms, home made adj. uppers with ?Mr. Gasket? lift bars
Stock used Springs Ft. & Rr.
Monroe gas shocks Ft. & Rr.
1.25" Ft. swaybar, stock GS rear bar
M/T drag radials (20psi)

Performance:

Best of 12.18 @ 112mph, 12.20's was the norm
Best ever 1.799 60ft
Foot brake launch at 1500-1700rpm
Pump Gas 92 octane

Obviously with the larger ft sway bar, gas shocks, tight converter and low compression this car was far from being strip optimized. With the slower 60' times it would hook damn near anywhere & was VERY street friendly,(other then fuel mileage). While I choose to trailer it to most Buick events that was more due to the family and luggage. I did regularly drive it to the Muncie track 20 miles away & won a few Wed. night trophy's, I also drove it to Indy for the Buick Horsepower Nationals(everyday) and the wife won the "Powder Puff" race.

There are many ways to reach a goal of a 11/12sec. street Buick even some with out spending enough to build a 9-second Buick! BUT building a street/strip car will ALWAYS be a compromise.

 

Hey everyone,

I know you folks are interested in the spreadsheet that John Zerucha http://www.v8buick.com/member.php?245-Staged70Lark created, I think this is great to see so many people giving input and that John put it into one place and I am happy to help! Don't beat us up too badly about the spreadsheet, when he sends it to me I put it up so people can see it.

John is busy, I am busy, please be patient.

For updates, please send info to John, he can send the file to me at his convenience. I'm in the middle of writing a book with a deadline and I use you folks on V8Buick as a welcome distraction, but sometimes I'm buried and can't reply to the private messages in a timely manner.

Carry on and go quicker!

Devon

 

Larry, whats wrong or right with your combo isn't what was asked and he didn't ask what torque converter to use. He didn't break it down to street or strip, as a matter a fact he asked for track performance "Post your 11/12 second 455 combos!" I read your e-mail and I understand why you are pissed at me for saying that you were taking over the thread. Its not you its the discussion over your car that has. I am sorry for the mis understanding.

John, great idea on the spread sheet. :TU:

 

I don't want to become the new punching bag in this thread, so don't attack or take this personal, but although I agree that the question just asked for 11/12 second combos, I believe the fact it was posted in the STREET/STRIP section and not the RACE section implies it was street car oriented since that's typically what's found in this part of the board. Yes, a sharp left turn into in depth discussion on converters was taken, but that is an integral part of a combo. Also, Larry's car is often discussed with street/strip combos because he was an early adopter of the roller can setup in a street car and he does epitomize street/strip with as much as he drives the car and flogs it as well (as does Alan!!! Can't forget him!!!). So, yes, his car/combo has been a big part of this thread, but due to the massive amount of excellent info he shares with us on here on a routine basis, it typically does get discussed a lot.

There's more than one way to go fast and many different approaches/philosophies to do so. No need to get worked up if somebody likes a tighter converter/different setup/different feel as everybody has different goals/ priorities.

Again, don't get bent outta shape and start shooting, just my view on the whole thing. You guys are both faster than I'll ever be...

 

Tom,

Sorry, I do not have the cam specs for Steve's engine.

I have updated the spreadsheet and sent to to Devon.

Thanks

 

I took that picture from my stock Grand National (MostOptioned).....right after I kicked the crap outta both those GSs at the last light !!! :laugh:

 

Then how come they are in front of you Moon??!!:sly:

 

ahhhhhh......cause they did the usual ricer fly by after they lost, yeah that was it !!! :Brow::Brow::Brow:

 

Yeeeaaahhhh.... That's the ticket!!

 

The spreadsheet is still at

http://home.comcast.net/~shinzan/11-12-sec-combos.pdf

http://home.comcast.net/~shinzan/11-12-sec-combos.xls

If folks would like to see updates, please send info to John below.

Devon

 

And here we go all over again because of people deleting their comments, thus making things a little more difficult to follow.

If anyone would like to see the original input, let me know.

Devon

 

Sunoco 94 when it was still available...

---------- Post added at 12:45 PM ---------- Previous post was at 12:24 PM ----------

My info has bin updated !! :TU:

 

ou:ou:

you know, I often look at a post where someone quotes someone else's very long post and wonder o No: why do you need to do that - I just read it all in the post above yours ?!?!?


... but its when people delete their posts that is screws up continuity even more and that is when the quoted post is a good thing


Thanks for keeping the spreadsheet updated.

What observations do you think can be drawn from out sample base ?

 

My “Grandma Green” `72 Skylark...been a while, I needed to look back at some old posts

`73 464 with iron heads, stage 1 valves and home porting raised ports slightly and filled floor (270 int./175 exh.), TA 1.6 roller rockers, 233/248 @ 0.050 on 112 LSA Scott Brown cam with .537/.530 lift, installed at 108 ICL, 10.43:1 CR w/7.9 DCR, Wiseco 0.038 over dished pistons, quench is 0.039", lightened factory rods, Holley 850 DP , gear reduction starter, old SP-1 intake, homemade ram air, 6AL, main studs, TA 7qt. pan, MT scavenger headers, Dr. Gas X-pipe and 3" full exhaust with Walker large case mufflers

TH400 with PTC converter (3200 stall), shifting at ~5900 rpm automatically with correct springs/weights, 3.42 posi. gear 10.5 10 bolt. Air shocks in rear, MT Drag Radials 275/60R-15’s. Race weight 3750 lbs. with me in it.


Engine dyno, 525HP @ 5700 and 550 TQ at 4500 rpm with 850 DP
Best corrected run 11.36 @ 119.2 mph but 11.5 – 11.6 more typical at 117 mph, best 60’ 1.698 but 1.720 more typical

Then...upper adjustable control arms (for 2.5 deg. down pinion angle and preload), 950 DP (for smoother warm ups on cool days), air bags

Chassis dyno, 432 HP and 432 TQ with 950 DP

New upgrades coming: fiberglass hood with 1 1/2" cowl, rear support braces, disc brakes all around and a small nitrous plate system, adjust trans. governor weights for 5700 rpm shift points, Digital 6 box, adjustable shocks rear, maybe front too.

Why upgrades? Grudge race with best friend, he has a 670HP `67 Chevelle...late May, just before Hot Rod Power Tour in Charlotte. It's going to be a close one!

 

Man Craig, you give me hope! I was really hoping to crack the 11's, and your build specs/power numbers are very close to mine, the only major difference being I'm running a 4 speed. Here's keeping my fingers crossed....