1964/65 SBB 4 speed information

Discussion in 'U-shift em' started by 64G-lark, Oct 30, 2008.

  1. Brian

    Brian Displaced VA Hillbilly

    Re: 1964 Four Speed Information Thread

    One more note on the shifter handle--it has fine thread on the end for the knob to screw onto--later ones had coarse threads.
    The bracket that mounts the shifter to the tail housing is 3/16" piece of steel bent and then threaded for the shifter to mount to. The newer ones had a stamped piece that was thiner and looks completely different.
    Manual transmission cars had a solid driveshaft tube whereas the automatics had a rubber insert (tube-in-tube) design.
    As for the Z-bar, I got some insite into that years ago from the guy I bought my '64 4-speed car from. He bought it new and it had the 3-piece z-bar design. It was cast and actually broke on him. The replacement was an improvement--the one piece design. Apparantly Buick had problems with the 3-piece design and updated the design and sold the new design as replacement part. My '65 Special that I recently sold still had the original 3-piece design on it when I got it. I found a NOS replacement one in kit form (back in 1994) that I put on my '64 when I restored it, so I put the one off my '64 onto the '65. I still have the original 3-piece one off the '65 in the closet at the house. I also have the broken 3-piece one from my '64 that the original owner kept all those years.
    The one piece design is superior, plus it has more mechanical advantage due to a longer leg, so it is much easier to press the clutch in with it.
     
  2. PGBuick

    PGBuick Well-Known Member

    Re: 1964 Four Speed Information Thread

    Back in 1980 I bought a 65 Special Deluxe 4 door with four on the floor, no consolette, just a boot. It was a 2bbl motor originally. Floor hump was different. I have pics somewhere. That had the 1 piece z-bar. The GM shifter they switched to early in 65 sucked. Best upgrade I ever made was a Hurst Comp Plus! Rear was 3.23. Driveshaft was solid. She ran 15.80 in the 1/4 and never got to 4th gear.

    Also had a 64 'Lark coupe with 4 speed, consolette, AC, 3.23 rear, but was a 2bbl motor originally also. Now a BBB TH400 car, soon to be a 4 speed BBB car.

    Also, have a family owned 65 'Lark coupe, automatic that is coded as a 4 bbl motor but when I took ownership was a 2bbl. Apparently my grandfather thought the car was too powerful for his teenagers so he sent it back to the dealership and they converted it to a 2 bbl!!! Every piece was correct, even the choke hot air tube, but interestingly the throttle link at the carb was the one with the offset for the wider 4 bbl carb. That car is a treasure of originality - has 44k on it now and has neat things like original ball joints, truck mat, all front end parts, some inspection marks survived, etc. Nice thread. If you need specific pics let me know.
    Pat
     
  3. Joe65SkylarkGS

    Joe65SkylarkGS 462 ina 65 Lark / GN

    Re: 1964 Four Speed Information Thread

    So I can't use this thread for reference on my 65 4 speed GS Big Block?
     
  4. Brian

    Brian Displaced VA Hillbilly

    Re: 1964 Four Speed Information Thread

    '65 GS 4-speed stuff is completely different--not one single piece is the same.
    A good point was just brought up--in Jan of '65 when Buick introduced the GS, they switched the regular skylark 4-speed setup over to the same GM shifter, floor hump and boot that was used in the GS--I guess that was all for commonization of parts. The Hurst Comp plus shifter went away in the Buick A-body sometime in Dec. of 1964 (it did return in the late '60s).
     
  5. 64G-lark

    64G-lark Well-Known Member

    Re: 1964 Four Speed Information Thread

    Pat (PGBuick),
    I hope you saved all of those 4 speed parts if you are converting back. Neat to hear of a 65 Special 4dr. with a 4 speed. That has to be a rare bird. Brian sold one several months back but I believe his was a 3 speed orginally. Makes me wonder if there were any 4 speed wagons.

    Brian,
    Glad to see jump in. You probably know more on these cars than anyone. Can you give any details or pictures on the impossible to find shifter boots and rings, or back up light switch and mounting?

    Has anyone found any way to distinguish these cars short of a build sheet or orginal paper work. I havent found any thing on the cowl tag or vin that will identify a car as a 4spd.
     
  6. Brian

    Brian Displaced VA Hillbilly

    I don't have an pictures of an original boot (other than in my mind). I saw one on Ebay about 5 years ago that went really high, and I have seen one in a car before. There is technically no trim ring--there was a metal ring molded into the original boot along the edge for the screws to go through. My '64 still has the ring with the remains of the original boot cut away from it and still has the rubber molded around it. I glued it to the Camaro boot I used, then trimmed the excess of the Camaro boot out from around it.
     
  7. skylark64fishy3

    skylark64fishy3 Well-Known Member

    love the post, i am going to be needing this info for my 64 skylark 4speed when i get to the ol t-10 however my car is all stripped down and at the body shop getting new floor and trunk pans in her!!!

    +1 for the sticky
     
  8. 64G-lark

    64G-lark Well-Known Member

    Thanks for jumping in Skylark64fishy3. I saw your post and pictures when you first started working on it. I love the red with black interior. Share some pics when you get it back.

    So far we have
    1. Brian- 1964 Skylark white with dark blue int. 300/355 4 speed.
    2. Pat (PGBuick)- 1964 Skylark ?? 300/310 4 speed. Do you still own it ?
    3. Tom (65GS76Limited) 1965 Skylark convert. ?? 300/??? 4 speed.
    4. Skylark64fishy3- 1964 Skylark red with black int. 300/355 4 speed.
    5. Most of my parts came from a 1964 Skylark red with black int. 300/355 4 speed no console in Calif. that got crushed. RIP.
    6. I know of one more 1964 Skylark white with red interior 300/355 4 speed Oregon car now in Fla.

    I have seen more 65 cars and most where convertables.

    Who's next?
     
  9. 64G-lark

    64G-lark Well-Known Member

    Picture of NOS Rod that threads into Z-bar and actuates the clutch fork or yoke. Part number 1363431
     

    Attached Files:

  10. trisheildfan

    trisheildfan Well-Known Member

    Great thread!!
    sure wish my 64 Lark Conv was the four speed....would be great to convert it collecting the parts...but it's original w/ST300....only original once..:ball:
     
  11. trisheildfan

    trisheildfan Well-Known Member

    Great thread!! Mark
    sure wish my 64 Lark Conv was the four speed....would be great to convert it n collecting the parts...but it's original w/ST300....only original once..:ball:
    but with this great info...yaa never know...lolol
    Mark
    TSF
     
  12. 64G-lark

    64G-lark Well-Known Member

    Thanks Trisheildfan. Glad you enjoyed. Nice looking car too.
     
  13. trisheildfan

    trisheildfan Well-Known Member

    Mark
    Thx for the compliments....
    I'm feel I'm pretty lucky as I bought it on Ebay 3 years ago sight unseen (other than pics) Hasnt needed much to get it in tiptop shape.
    I guess no pleading, begging, praying ..lol...on my part would make anyone sell any of there extra 4 speed parts...eh??
    I still could be convinced to convert it to a 4 speed...
    White ragtop w/red interior & a 4 speed....sigh...guess I can only dream..
    Mark
    TSF
     

    Attached Files:

  14. 64G-lark

    64G-lark Well-Known Member

    Love the red interior. I know of one such car in Fl. White with red interior 4 spd and 300/355. One of my favorite combo's. Brian has the most beautifully restored 64' 4 spd car a white with a med. blue interior.
    I dont have any spare parts at the moment. The parts are getting very hard to find. The bell housings show up on E-bay fairly frequently. The pedals are not to bad to find. The correct transmissions can be found with some effort. The shifter, z-bar and linkage are very hard. Start collecting the pieces slowly and enjoy your car until you have them all.
     
  15. 64G-lark

    64G-lark Well-Known Member

    I have been doing some more research on 1964 four speed cars. Working with the Sloan Museum I was able to get the actual production numbers.

    There was a total of 2764 Skylarks (Includes all possible 4200 and 4300 series cars) equipped with four speed transmissions. Of those 1954 were two door sport coupes(4337), 752 convertables (4367), and 58 four door sedans (4369). No Station Wagons. In comparison there were 70352 Automatic (300ST) cars. So it looks like only about 3.2%

    There were 694 Specials (4000 and 4100 series cars) equipped with 4 speed transmissions. 74 were two door coupes (4027), 24 were four door two seat station wagons (4035), 231 were two door convertables (4067), 69 were four door two seat station wagons (4135), and 51 four door sedans (4169)

    Interesting to see there were a few 4 doors and wagons. I am continuing to research 1964 cars. If you are looking for information or have something drop me a PM.
     
  16. 64G-lark

    64G-lark Well-Known Member

    Thanks to Chris (Skylark64fishy3) Here are some pictures of what was left of his orginal shifter boot with some reference measurments. Finding these boots is near impossible. Thanks for the pics. Chris.
     

    Attached Files:

  17. 64G-lark

    64G-lark Well-Known Member

    Pictures of a black four speed console thanks to Chris (Skylark64fishy3).
     

    Attached Files:

  18. 64G-lark

    64G-lark Well-Known Member

    Interior pictures of a 1964 Skylark green convertable with four speed, console, and ironing board console. Car sold on e-bay a while back. Anyone here buy it?
     

    Attached Files:

  19. kcombs

    kcombs Well-Known Member

    So there is a market for the complete clutch linkage setup for a 65? In the future I may be removing a complete clutch setup from a 65 shorty wagon with a three on the tree behind a 300.
     
  20. 64G-lark

    64G-lark Well-Known Member

    Kurt,
    Seems to be plenty of intrest. I get a number of inquireys for parts just not alot out there. With so few manuel cars built and no one offering many reproduction parts they are hard to find.
     

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