On another note that has been discussed many times already, the "Buick Community" is much smaller than we all thought.
"On another note that has been discussed many times already, the "Buick Community" is much smaller than we all thought." Yes that is true, however the majority of the parts in question either fit 3 popular years worth of vehicles, or were for the most popular year car, and have not been available for something like 10-20 years. There is no way anyone can say there are enough original parts out there to fill everyone's needs. Plus the fact that the initial runs of these parts were very small and still didn't sell out says a lot doesn't it. Duane
This is exactly why it is soooooo important to support those buick vendors that go out on a limb to make parts for us.
Guys,the maker of the Buick sheetmetal is AMD and they are not going out of business just the BUICK business because the parts didn't sell well.AMD retooled most of the Camaro ,chevelle parts and they are selling well even though there are others who have tooling on camaro and chevelle parts as well[DYRACORN,Goodmark,ect] Most likely because AMD parts fit as good or better than OEM from several different installers i've talked to THEY SELL HIGH QUANTIES OF THESE CAMARO AND CHEVELLE PIECES AND THEY ARE ONLY GETTING A % OF THAT BUSINESS!!!!!!! That is what is so upsetting if you are a Buick guy we had a chance to get the parts everyone needs and says they want and will buy but there was not but 60 set of 1970-1972 GS quarters sold in 2 years. AMD tooled up for Dart parts and are selling them???? I will say the Buick parts are priced quite a bit higher than the chevy parts and that has to come into play a little in this.
This discussion has gotten focused on stampings. Don't let this thread lose sight of all aftermarket parts, and what's involved for a small shop to produce parts. That being said, durable, precise stamping tools (we usually call them stamping dies) for big sheetmetal parts like fenders, quarter panels and inner fenders are hugely expensive. It takes a big company to supply big stamped parts for a low volume demand, and I dare say if the decision was made in the good economy to buy the tools, it was still a roll of the dice even then. But, the tools are paid for now, and if demand is small, they will sit on the shelf (by the way, that is a REALLY big shelf for a panel that big). The company's goal is to sell parts off the tools so that the cost of the tools is paid for within a few years since the tooling purchase. Otherwise, there's no financial reason to make the investment in the first place. The only way those tools will get set up in the big press again is if there is an indication of demand, and that will happen depending on the results of the company's marketing tactics. If and when the company decides to market the low volume product, the price will be higher if the perceived demand is low. And even if the low demand market is spiking, they're only going to squeeze that tool into a press (which is about the size of a small one car garage) because of a high volume product's tool coming out for repair, or some other reason one of the presses that's sized for that tool becomes free for a day or two. Then, they'll have to decide how much it costs to get it out of mothballs and prep it for setup, how long to run it based on that machine's availability, the demand, the selling price, and the cost of storing the inventory. So, '70-'72 Skylark/GS folks are at the mercy of the company or companies that have the tools and the presses. The demand, affected by the economy, will affect the price if and when the parts are run again. If the demand gets too low and the company is sacrificing space to survive, some tools get RECYCLED, and then no more parts. The rest of us like me, with INCREDIBLY low demand for sheet metal like my '67 Wildcat, will never see stuff produced, nor would I ever expect someone to spend the money tooling and running a part that would never sell. If some company tooled quarter panels for a '67 Wildcat I'd first call them stupid behind their backs, then ask for a charitable contribution. Again, don't let this thread lose sight of all aftermarket parts, and what's involved for a small shop to produce parts. Devon
Does AMD intend to discontinue their entire Buick line? I understood the core supports and inner fenders were selling.
As it was explained to me they currently plan to continue making the core supports, tulip panels, and right front inner fenders. The parts being discontinued are the 70-72 rear quarters, 70-72 rear outer wheel houses, and the 70 GS Hood chromes. ...but if sales start going flat you will probably see some of these pieces getting the ax in the future. I bought a set of quarters/rear wheel houses and a hood chrome, for our local "Buick family", so we could repair one of our cars in case it ever got hit. I will also probably add a tulip panel at a later date. The last thing I need is to pay $1500 a side for a quarter if a car gets damaged a few years from now, and I would bet both the repro AND originals will be at that price in a couple of years. It sure seemed like cheap insurance to me. Devon brings up a good point about the small shops making parts. What everyone fails to think about is the fact that us small manufacturers run into other problems as well. Molds/dies wear from pulling part after part out of them. When this happens you get to a point where parts don't come out as well as you want. For the companies that want to produce high quality parts this means making another set of tooling and tossing the old set away. At this point the manufacturer has to decide if they want to make the new mold or discontinue the part. I myself have decided to discontinue some parts and my 70-72 front spoilers are on that path as well. We are babying it as much as possible but once the mold cracks all the way, then that's it. I will not make another die to replace it. The show people will have to do what they can to find what they need, I will no longer be able to help them. The public often perceives we can re-make parts again whenever there are enough orders, but this is often not the case. I am still getting calls/letters asking for parts I discontinued over 20 years ago. The thought that a manufacturer still has some obscure part available 20+ years after it was originally reproduced is just plain stupid. Ask GM how that works. Duane PS. Again none of this discussion is worth a damn. The people that understand how these things work will buy the parts they need while they are available, and get their cars done. I went over all this time after time in the resto clinics, and explained how the prices would continue to climb and how much better off you were getting parts now. Everyone else will simply bitch about not having any parts, and their cars will remain in piles while we will continue to build ours.
Well if they did away with full quarters,what would the market be for just the lower sections of each quarter.I realize people doing full on restorations would probably be in the need for full quarters as would people that have been hit in the rear but what about if they just produced the lower sections of the quarters for people that just had rust problems?I would be willing to bet there are a lot of cars out there that could use the lower sections as opposed to a full quarter.They would take up less room to store,cost less to sell and ship.I am not on the production side of this so i do not see what it costs for the R&D and actual making of the part.It seems that if you had the dies for the whole quarter you could modify it for just the lowers.I appreciate all of the vendors and manufacturers that put forth an effort to make these parts but I do not need parts for those years.Also most of what I need I have anyways.If it is not available when I go to finish my car,I will either refurbish what I have or make it myself.If those options are not around,then I have an excuse to hit more swap meets.:TU:
Well i got to chime in here, and sorry for it being so long.... Its unfortunate for sure, prior to me finding the v8 board...i was a guy that bought NOS front fenders back in 2006 from california..$2500 for the set...$600 shipping to Mn:ball:. When i picked them up the fenders where sticking out of the box:af:...I couldnt look inside for a week scared to see what i had ( my wife never found out what i paid )...luckily only minor damage but too many hands touched the boxes from California to Mn. so i got screwed by somebody? I also bought some partial rear quarters available from a local parts supplier which i ended up giving away and was told only a portion of the rear quarters could be salvagable cause they were made all wrong? Over the course of my build i found a 71 skylark with a clear title for $1500. in Mn. I quickly abandoned my rusty 72 gs in favour for the 71 rust free skylark complete with fenders, i am not a body man so went the easy route. Moral of my story is nobody can ship items that big to me in Canada (where most of the rust cars are that need these) If these parts where available in our local Canadian parts stores, possibly the manufacture would sell more? Alot of great ideas and great products never make it...timing is everything of course, but in this economy the realitiy is that there have been and will be some more great cars for sale for a fraction of what it costs to build one. Like me at the start of my buick building/collecting (before my knowledge of v8) I am betting majority of people (other than V8 followers) do not know all these parts even exist at a reasonable costs? I just called "Parts Source" which is well known parts supplier and owned by the "Canadian Tire" empire and asked if front fenders or rear quarters are available for 70-72 skylarks and i was told NO only partial rear quarters ( the junk ones) are available. So...one of the largest auto parts retailers in Canada has no knowledge of these parts being available? Being one guy, that restored one car over 6 years i don't know if i have it in me to do anouther car, and based on what i see coming for sale it really is hard to justifiy it... :gp: Gord ps..nos front fenders for sale $3,000.00! get em while available!:laugh:
I'm a little confused. AMD has the rear quarters at $769.95 on their website while Then & Now has them on their site at $699. While I have not contacted either by phone, are either or both of them having a fire sale? Who is selling them for $400 and for how long? Was this a GS Nats special price? I would agree that lower patch sections might have a higher/faster turnover and be a more reasonable expense but I did not find them at either site. I do see both sides of this discussion but how many of us can afford to get a pair of these and hold them for that "just in case" moment, much less have the room to store them safely where they won't get damaged? Like most people (and the merchants that sell the items), I cannot do this and I would get them when/if I need them. I understand that by doing so I may have to pay a premium, but if I don't need them and I'm not hoarding them I've got money for other projects. If the day comes that I do need full quarters I hope someone is selling them at a reasonable price but, as it's been said, this is a small community and because of that, it is understandable that things are going to be a little more pricey.
AMD was blowing out some stock at the nats thru Then N Now. They are an AMD distributor and helped them with the nats sale. As a distributor they get a discounted price and can sell below the mfgr's retail pricing. This is not an uncommon scenario. I believe the $400 price was at the nats only. Make some calls to verify.
can anyone really be shocked by this? We are a really small market. it is what it is. Business is business. this is a hobby market. when money is tight- the hobby is the first to suffer. Its a mix of bad timing in a poor market with too much stock. I bet the guy who owns the stamping plant doesn't give a damn about buicks, and why should he?
As an experiment i went to EBAY looking for buick parts, i could not find new fenders, quarters, core supports etc on my search, maybe retailers of the parts should ebay them so the world can find them? my 2 bits...over and out.
Re-read your post and think about it for a second or 2, your own post says it all. "I have several nos and repro core supports I have several 1:4s too along with everything else I bought one or two items serve real times a year to stockpile" maybe there is a bunch of people out there in the same boat as you? By the way, do you sell BBB throttle brakets and cables? Chris
Ive used several pair of 1/4s per year already. Ive sold and or help sell a dozen radiator supports and wheel houses too.. plus what I bought to store. and this weekend I bought another set too. I want these to stay available but anyway Yes on the bracket no on the cable. I call Frank mcIntyre for the cable.
