**Overdrive auto info for those looking to do a trans swap**

ps.
The lexus Isf ran a 26in tire on a 20 inch rim

 

Well I think its awesome that you are taking this on, and doing a great job too. The controlling would be the hardest part, newer trannies are pretty touchy with clutch to clutch shifting, skipping gears as needed, etc.

6 or 8 speeds seems to be about right really, I hear 10 and 12's are in the works but can you say "diminishing returns"?? The thing is most use about the same first gear and the same top gear (you can only lug an engine so much after all) so I don't see the gains other than bragging rights but you are right on the money with the 2 and 3 speed comments. If my GS's had one more gear (just one) they would be much, much nicer to drive on the highway.

The CVT in my wifes Altima coupe 3.5 is pretty neat, eventually if they keep slitting gears that is where they will all end up I guess...:laugh:

 

Im not an expert by any means. but im new on the forum. Im currently building a 462 stage 2 motor. im going to doing enough highway driving where i could really use an overdrive. i currently have a th400 that was just rebuilt (learning mistake) what are my overdrive options. 4l80e is out of the question i dont wanna start messing with all that electronics. ive considered a GV but unsure. From what ive read 700r4's never came with a buick bolt pattern. also im running a ta 310455 cam which likes a 2500 stall does that mean i have to be revvn past 2500 on the highway for the converter to be fully engaged. it would be nice to keep it around 2000 on the highway... is this dooable or am i asking for 2 different things.
can a 200r4 be built to handle 500+ hp? if so what kinda parts would i need to change to handle it?o No:

 

Yes the 200r4 can handle the power. It just has to be built correctly. I have one and I run Nitrous on it and have ran 11.90 with it. All on a little 350 engine. Call Janis Transmission in Akron, Ohio he is the man on this. They have been there for way over 30+ years 330-753-6609 Vince Janis.

 

Tim, just noticed what you added about the Reid Buick bellhousing. You didn't get out of the TCI info what I did. The TCI 6X uses the Reid bellhousing to connect to whatever engine you want. The 6X uses the Reid Superglide bellhousings therefore the Buick Superglide bellhousing will adopt the 6X to a Buick engine. Look at the bolt patterns. It made sense for TCI to use currently available bellhousings when developing the trans. All I'm pointing out is there IS a 6 speed trans that WILL bolt up to a Buick block.

Still an expensive way to go but it is a 6 speed.

 

Mike - have you heard anything about the 6x other than advertising babble ?

 

No I haven't Alan. Just what they have in the magazine ads and on their internet site. Very interesting transmission but you'd really want to have it for that kind of money until it is all said and done. It based on a 4L80E and somehow they are splitting the gears.

I'd think with BBB torque a 4 speed auto should do fine but those 6 speeds would be interesting.

 

Some more good info:

 

Bump. good thread.
I have the opportunity to buy a th2004 r locally.
Having read this and other threads on the same topic a few questions remain.
Is this tranny more prone to overheat? I read that slippage is bad but I would think other trannies also have slip?
Why this emphasize on the lock-up converter?

What would happen if I stick with my current rear of 2.78?
now I have a 2speed that goes from 0-120mph. With the new tranny (not changing anything else) I would expect a better launch of the line and lower rpms at high speed.
I have a totally stock 300, I never race but I sometimes go for hours at speeds between 80-100mph.

Am I missing something here?

Secondly they claim the tranny is redone but not using any performance parts. Is this still sufficient for a stock 300 or would you recommend a professional build? The "weakest" ones From ck and the like I see are good for 500hps....
has anyone installed a stock th2004r?? Experience?

Thanks

Patrick

 

I dont know about any overheat/slippage..more so if its a lockup converter theirs less slippage then any non lockup trans..

2.78 gear you'll lug engine
you'd want to do a rear gear swap
Think you should be around 1700 rpms at 60 to make a 2004r combo happy
Me personally I always gear my ride to be just under or over 3000 rpms at 70-75...not factoring in converter slippage

 

please sent me a private message and I will fill u in

 

From what I hear, the 200-4r's 'weaknesses' are:

1. that it can tend to overheat, so best used with a good trans cooler. This can cause fluid to spew out of the tube, which can result in low fluid levels.

2. NEVER let the fluid level get low. If the pickup tube sucks air, it will fry the clutches.

3. The TV cable MUST be attached and set up properly, or you WILL fry the trans. This is because the TV cable serves as both the kickdown and the pressure regulator, which also controls how and when the trans will shift depending on its position. If you open up the throttle with low pressure, clutch slippage will occur which can fry the clutches.

4. There's complications involving setting up a lock-up converter, if one is so installed.

5. Its internal components have to be significantly reinforced/upgraded in order to handle large power levels.

6. It's expensive. Or at least it is when built properly with a proper converter and electrical setup. More expensive than your typical TH350 or TH400.

While these issues may not be a big deal for some or most who are considering an 'upgrade', they are still nonetheless issues that must be acknowledged and properly addressed. Failure to do so will result in a most unsatisfactory experience with the 200-4r transmission. When properly set up and installed (and maintained), they will serve as excellent overdrive transmissions that can give you an extra 2-3 more MPG or so, and have a good gear ratio progression.



Gary

 

Good job Gary on the info above!

Yes you are right... Getting a 2004R to handle 600 foot pounds of TQ is like trying to make a midget look 7 feet tall..... There are only about 5 people in the world that understand what to do to make the 2004R live under high TQ conditions... They are great trans if built by the right guy but 99% of builders just THINK they know what tricks to use... I am busy at work but:

1. Art Carr
2. Janis
3. Some other dude but I forget him name.... jake I think...

 

I think our "standard" cruise #'s aren't going to work for considering the posters location is in Germany. He may actually need the freeway gears and OD. He did say:

 

Here is a means to calculate RPMs @ speed based on rear end ratio, final drive (whether 1:1 or overdrive) and tire size:

RPM = 336 x Diff Gear ratio x Trans Gear Ratio x MPH / Tire Diameter in inches

Example: 336 times 2.73 x (whichever gear) x MPH. Take this number and divide it by the tire diameter in inches to get your RPM@MPH.

so 336 x 2.73 = 917.28. 917.28 x 1 (for standard non-overdrive trans) = 917.28 (you can also skip this step since X x 1 = X). Take this 917.28 and multiply it by MPH (say 100) to get 91728. Take 91728 and divide it by tire diameter in inches, say 26". So 91728 / 26 = 3528 RPM @ 100 MPH with a 2.73:1 rear with no O.D.

The 200-4r trans has an overdrive ratio of .67:1. So with the same gear ratio of 2.73, you take 336 x 2.73 x .67 x 100 = 61457.76. Then take 61457.76 and divide it by 26 (or whatever tire size) to come up with 2363.76 RPM @ 100 MPH.

If he's going to be cruising for hours on end at 80-100, the highway gear should be fine for him.


Gary

 

Thanks Tim & Gary,
from your posts I take it, I should keep the gear to have acceptable highway rpms. On the downside the off-take is not as much improved as it coul with a lower gear. That was what I thought.
Really looking forward to this swap.

Patrick

 

Add a higher stall convertor . Depending on tire size I would suggest a 3 series gear. Mine seems decent with 75 mph running around 2500 .3.42 gear

 

A 700R4 would give you a better first gear take off and still give you a .70:1 overdrive.

3.06 first gear,1.67 second gear,1.00 third gear,and a .70 O/D gear for the 700R4 vs 2.74 first,1.57 second,1.00 third,.067 O/D for the 200R4. First gear muliplication for the 700R4 is 8.5068:1 vs a 7.6172:1 first gear multiplication for a 200R4. A 700R4 wouldn't lug the engine down as much as the 200R4 would in slower driving with the 2.78 rear gear as a 200R4 would.

The downside is that the driveshaft would need to be shortened slightly and you'll need an adapter to bolt it to your Buick engine.GL

Derek

 

Anyone near Chicago I have a Gn D5 2004r convertor and a rebuilt 700 with adapter and Cadillac tail shaft(was told that it brings mount to 400 spot).that I'm not going to use.

 

Andy (Alec?), interested in your 700 outfit, Pmail sent.

Steve in Mpls.