Need some advice for rebuilding 77 350 please

Its ok to re-use the stock rod bolts, IF you were to use NEW ARP bolts, you SHOULD have the big end of the rods re-sized, and that would add to the cost.

 

Thanks for the info on the rod bolts. I am guessing it is a must to replace head bolts though?

So this head gasket set should work fine with the early heads whether the heads are from 68 or 70? And they will work fine with the 77 block?

http://www.ebay.com/itm/330987079023?ssPageName=STRK:MEWAX:IT&_trksid=p3984.m1423.l2649

Thanks!

 

Head bolts can be reused just make sure threads are clean both in block and on bolt . You can use a drop of oil on threads while installing. that will give a better torque reading. Those gaskets should work but I would find out more about using them and sealant usage before buying. They require a clean and straight surface.

 

NEVER EVER DO ANYTHING TO A HEAD GASKET! :shock:Just lay it on clean matting surfaces and torque.
FeelPro stock replacement is all you ever need unless your racing.

:idea2:I'm to new to Buick to give advise, but i do know to never mess with a head gasket.

 

He want to use steel shim gasket not felpros

 

I received the heads, one is a 68 head and one is a 70. I'll post pictures soon.

I imagine the pistons sit at the stock height in the cylinder hole in this engine. I will confirm this when I pull the old heads off this weekend. Does anyone know how far they sit in the hole on a stock 77 and how deep the piston dish is?

I want to get the heads shaved down to achieve a compression ratio as close to 9.0:1 - 9.5:1 as possible.
I'd rather use the .040 Fel-pro gasket to avoid any issues down the road since I will not be touching the deck of the block. What do you guys recommend?

Also I have read that there are differences in the oiling systems. Am I able to reuse the pushrods, and rocker arm assemblies from the 77 engine on the 68 and 70 heads?


Thanks for all the help!:3gears:

 

i believe when brian posted his 72 rebuild with stock replacement pistons . his pistons where .090 down.Taulbee has a modified motor and his are .078 down hole. add about 24 cc to piston dish and .043 felpro gasket you can. i would think your pistons are close to the .090 down hole or more in which you would need a 48 cc head to get 8.5 .thats like .070 off head just to get that. brian changed his pistons to 3.0 v6 flattops .use pushrods,lifters and rockers from 77 everything will work fine.

 

Thanks, that is good news I can reuse the rockers. I will however have to get different length pushrods after having the heads shaved down.

.070 off the heads? Were his heads stock? These earlier heads I have now should have a similar starting CC to his, before I have them shaved down. I figure if I shave off .050 it should get me around 9.0:1 depending on what head gasket I use. If I can get the combustion chamber as small as his is, 43 cc, I should be able to achieve this with the stock pistons and deck height. 9.5:1 is probably out of the question but that is fine, as this will be for street use and the headers and cam should help produce power in place of just a high compression engine.

The Kenne-Bell testing from '84 said these engines respond well to large headers and porting....

Measuring the deck height, piston dish, and combustion chambers, are the next step I guess

Thanks for all the help so far, I will need much more as this build progresses. This should be an interesting build for anyone who is looking to produce more power out of a smog engine, without modifying the bottom end at all (only reason mine is coming apart may be due to changing the cam bearing but everything will go back together the way it came apart) The only machining here will be to the heads. Everything else will be bolted on and the TA-212 Cam.

Thanks again.

 

Once you measure piston depth at TDC then you can figure out something from there.I am expecting to see at least .090 down hole which estimates about 7.71 compression. So figure .050 might get you around 8.3. My opinion is still consider pistons.

 

X2 if your motor is already out. Taking into consideration new push rods, milling the combustion chamber side and intake side, composite intake gaskets and valley pan, shipping all of these parts.. I have more $$ in it then a set of V6 flat top pistons cost if I went that route from the start. If I kept every variable of my motor (sits .078 in the hole) and got flat tops instead of dish (-10.18cc) I would be at 9.8:1 vs the 8.8:1 I had with the dish. Just something to think about, but I had a rather fresh motor and was chasing compression after the build which is why I milled the heads.

 

Hey Andy,

Sent you a PM abut your 10.1 pistons. Taking into consideration everything you guys are saying along with costs. If I can get a set of pistons pressed onto my rods and my block honed for under $300 I think that will be a better option then getting the heads shaved down.


I took the rotating assembly apart this past weekend to make it easy to get to the cam bearings. Maybe it can be done with the crank in but I did not feel confident in installing them with minimal room to move my hands around. The pistons and rods are sitting in the cylinders. Everything looked good on the bottom end, so that was a relieve. :TU:

I will post pictures. Thanks.

 

Well don't remember where I left this off at but here is an update:

I got a set of Hooker Headers, a new stock timing chain, intake gasket, new water pump, new oil pump with booster plate, and the set of earlier heads.

I am going to leave the heads alone. Clean them up and bolt them on with the stock .043 Fel Pro head gaskets. As for the camshaft, a fellow board member helped me take the old ones out and installs he new ones. I got the TA 212 in the new bearings with no issues now. When I tried with the old bearings it wouldn't go past the second journal.

I had to take the crank out and I am also going to buy a set of the 3.0 flat top pistons and rings. A seller on ebay will sell me two extra pistons for $13 a piece. Not a bad deal. To me that is part of a performance budget build. Overall cheaper than having the heads cut down. And will get me a decent but street able compression ratio.

Once I get the pistons installed everything is ready to go back together!

 

Here's some pictures! And the car that will be housing this 350!

 

Cool,good stuff,but who painted that car with Pepto-Bismo though?

Or was that a May Kay cosmetics car form the 70s?

Don't get me wrong,I think its a cool car,but that color has got to go.LOL(unless YOU like it that color? to each their own)


Derek

 

i would get a new pickup tube for oil which should be 5/8 and drill out sump passage and round corner with a carbide bit. 1/2 inch should be good but i think it can be drilled to 9/16. i drill out passages in oil pump housing also to 1/2.put a oil pump plate on it too. should have good oil supply then.and with the pistons you will have a decent bottom end so if you port/big valve heads you will have the setup for it.

 

No I agree, I am not a fan of the color. The primer area was just so surface rust or bubbling under the paint that I got rid of and just wanted to protect the metal. I don't know what the original color is. The paint on the inside on the deck lid looks like a fire glow red / orange but I don't know the actual color. I know that color was not available on a 73. The car is a real 350 gran sport.

I think if the paint was not faded it might look alright but I am either going to paint it white, black, or maybe harvest gold.
Any suggestions?

---------- Post added at 11:45 PM ---------- Previous post was at 11:39 PM ----------

Great thanks for the tips. And yes I figured I mine as well do an easy piston swap with new rings. Honing the cylinders won't cost me anything and I can reuse all the rest of the bottom end parts. Raising the compression ratio will increase low end torque which will be good for the street and it's not costly, plus I don't need to modify anything (like when the heads are cut, you change that "V")

I will add up the total cost of this build but I still have kept it fairly low so this might help people in the future if they are looking to make a reliable, mild, but well performing 350 even with the higher deck height on this 77 engine.

 

I vote for midnight blue metallic.(but I'm not sure if that will go good with the interier because you didn't say what color that is) Will look black metallic in the shade and at night and dark blue metallic in direct sunlight.:TU:


Derek

 

I agree, midnight blue would look great on a 73 GS! Let us know how far the pistons site below the deck when you get them in.

 

I love midnight blue on these cars...but my 73 Stage1 is that color, with a black interior.

This "orange" car has a black interior as well, bucket seats and will have a 4-speed. I could go with two midnight blue cars but I kind of want another color. Guess I can figure that out after the car is running.:3gears:

 

Candy apple red is very cool also. White is for people that aren't very good with body work.(one night white,LOL But,pearl white metallic isn't bad though,except fot the price and its a 3 stage paint)

Black is sweet,but the body work needs to be spot on or it won't look good,and is a bitch to get the swirl marks out.Black metalllic would be cooler than just a gloss black.

Charcoal grey metallic would look good,and would be lower maintainance. Sometime silver looks good,but I don't like that one to much because its to close to the color of faded blacktop and other drivers like to smash into that color.(charcaol grey is in that same catagory as silver)

Forest green metallic is a cool color too,if you like green.(forest green metallic is the only green I like,its a dark green metalllic)

Gold even new paint looks like old paint.


Heres a cool red;




If you have a midnight blue car,the oppisite would be a red,and the one above looks great!(and would go great with a black interior) I hope this helps,and I vote for the above red.(candy apple red!)

Derek

---------- Post added at 07:20 PM ---------- Previous post was at 07:14 PM ----------

Heres a few more;




---------- Post added at 07:29 PM ---------- Previous post was at 07:20 PM ----------

Can't go wrong with this color;