Matt, Here is another scenario, What if a car is wrecked very early, while it was still under complete coverage. The insurance company may have opted to pay to clip a car rather then total it. (This is done every day.) Then later the car gets sold as a collectable, and the red flags go up. In the past, while checking out cars for prospective buyers, I have seen this same type of thing before, where cars have gone through multiple repairs. Again, not to toot my own horn or increase book sales :laugh:, but you would be amazed at the history you can discover about a car if you look at all the date codes. Plus, until you do, you are just buying a car from pictures, which is something I will not do. Duane
In this world, anything is possible. I won't speculate. I will add that not many insurance companies would have done that, though. These cars were not that valuable. I hope the general concession here is not to flame the seller or the car, but, to inform the unsuspecting. The car in question is still a nice looking car and may be a blast to drive around. It's also complete (mostly) and driveable. Wether ir not it is worth more than 23K is up to a buyer. It would be tough to put a car like that together in this day for less. I wouldn't mind owning it - correct or not.
how much does it hurt the car if it was a rebody and what does the buick community think about it? Could a car like this realy bring the big bucks and be judged like a non rebodied car? o No:
Problem is, it may not even be a real "X". Anybody with about $180 can have a cowl tag reproduced to any color combo they desire. As far as we can tell by looking at the photos the car is titled as a '70 GS 455. Beyond that you would need documentation to prove it was ever an "X". If I were selling a high dollar "numbers matching" car with documentation on ebay, I would at least show some pictures of some numbers and said documents. It just smells fishy to me, plus he is a new ebay member.
I'm sympathetic as long as the history is disclosed. There's a difference to me between sticking a cowl tag on a good car and putting the engine and trans in. In my case, we are redoing the entire frame and drive train of the original car but due to rust there is no choice but to put another body on it. Even the upper and lower cowl are too rusted to use. So there you go. What's the alternative? To put the frame in the crusher and sell parts. I don't think that is the best answer. Flame away, but I prefer to put a new body on it and rebuild it back to what it was as a GS in my case. All this hoopla about saving one inch of metal around the tag to make it a legitimate car. Come on, who are we fooling with that?
I agree with Mike on that..I myself am re-boding a gs...not planning to sell it ..but if I ever do it will be disclosed with pics as well... and if that gsx is a real one ...he is better off diclosing a re-shell imo
Well, I askeded him for some under car pictures at the frame/body mounts and the key codes. Still no response. I saw a 67 Electra 225 that was outstanding shape for Minot, ND, but one look underneath and I'd be afraid to push this car over a speed bump. Anyone else got any questions answered from him today?
You just described my convertible to a "T". The car was originaly from New York and the body was rusted beyond salvage. The trunk floor and most of the floor pan were replaced with Yield signs that had been pop rivited in place, and on the out side there was practicaly no metal left from the body line on down... all bondo! To fix the car correctly I replaced all the rusted metal... I just didn't cut it apart first. That's one of the major reasons I made an X out of it rather that restore it. I know it's a rebody, and I don't pretend it's not. The only factory part of metal visible from the outside is the right side quarter panel extention... and yes, there's bondo in it! To further agree with you, there is a "restorer" living down the street that has about half the firewall of a 1969 Camaro Pace Car. He feels his car will be more legit than mine because "the rivits haven't been touched". He just took delivery of one of those replacement bodies... At least mine is all 1970 sheetmetal!
I have myself disassembled several GS/Skylark cars and have found the VIN stamped on just over half the cars, maybe two-thirds. I'm assuming it's supposed to be on all the cars, but in some cases a VIN was never found, by myself or others. The plant it was built in seems to make little difference. Wonder why?
Duane wrote/created a new book that shows date codes and what to look for when determing what parts are original to the car. I think the book is $35-40. Just email him direct and he will reply....be patient.
See this thread. Everybody needs one of these. http://www.v8buick.com/showthread.php?t=93673&page=3&highlight=date+code+book
He emailed me back before the auction ended and said he didnt know what I meant by the key code letter on the side of the keys! Bet they were A and B
Rebody or re vin?? whats the diff?? I gotta ask, Mike you mentioned your OK with revins or rebody's as long as the history is disclosed, so is there some where you have to register a rebody or revin to protect future buyers from getting sucked in to thinking they just bought a nice rust free car that was driven by an old lady most of its life when really it was a rusted hunk of crap that sat in some field for the last 15 years because the frame was broken from driving it in the salty winters back east for the 21 years before that, where do you guys register your info? I can't believe the differents between US and Canada. Up here it is a federal offence to revin or rebody any car and chances are you will get jail time, record etc . If you guys sell your cars down the road and disclose it what makes you think the next guy will do the same. When it comes to making money people tend to turn a blind eye. I Know someone that paid big $$$ for a car that he thought was original and when he got it home it was rebody. He was very sick about it. I guess until it happens to you its hard to understand. Like every thing else in life history is history and you can't change that and you shouldn't try. I know you guys are great guys and are open about this but its not you guys I'm worried about its the next guy that could be the problem. Chris
What is a rebody,what is the difference between taking a rusted out hulk and replacing the floor pans,trunk pans,quarters,doors ,fenders, core support,inner fenders,bumpers,etc, or taking a clean shell and placing it on the frame.Is it any less of a car ,or because the roof and firewall wasn't replaced that it makes a difference.?Or if you kept the firewall with asspciated vin and cowl tag and just back halfed it,is it still less of a restoration?Whats the learned opinion here?
If anyone has a rebodied '70 GSX Stage 1 4-speed they want to sell to me real cheap I'm interested, since no one else will want it.
The Law is usually very specific about what constitutes "Vin Tampering"... It all revolves around the Vin Tag. It has nothing to do with a re-body. You don't have to touch the vin on either car to do a re-body. If you remove or or tamper with the Vin Tag...You have likely broken the law and could face prosecution and jail time. The Title and legal ownership of the vehicle is tied to the Vin. In the end it's up to you. But I wouldn't want to try it until I had read my State Specific Laws and knew exactly what I was risking. o No:
