thanks for all the great info here is what i plan to do: 1. weiand intake ( for emmisions) part #7541 2. carter carb electric 500cfm (for emissions) part #9504 (or if you guys think i should use something else let me know) 3. edelbrock cam part #5487 4. msd 6al 5. msd blaster 2 6. port and polish heads so let me kow what you guys think about this setup. i hope to hear from you today because i want to order the parts tonight. again thanks a lot.
231 power-up Omar, This looks like a good plan to me. The dual exhaust set-up will help substantially, particularly if you can install an X-pipe or H-pipe between the pipes. One thing I forgot to mention is the timing chain. The V6 is notoriously tough on timing sets, particularly when you're dealing with an engine that has more power than stock. Invest in a quality timing set like a Cloyes or Edelbrock. It won't give you a big power boost like some of the other parts you're upgrading, but it is a good piece of insurance to help the mill live longer. Good luck. Mark
231 power-up Excellent question. If I recall my V6s correctly, you can use a screw-in postive bumper on the '61-'76 engines buecause the nose of the cam is threaded. On the later engines, you have to use a press-on style that fits over the nose of the cam because of the integral gear design. Cam grinders like Crane, Isky, etc. may have started to drill and thread the nose of the later cams so the postive stop style bumper can be used, but I'm not 100% certain that all do it. I believe Kenne-Bell sells both style bumpers. They were far ahead of the pack on V6-stuff when I did my motor, so it may be worth buying one of their catalogs. Don't know if they have a website yet. I made the mistake of leaving the tensioner off my motor when I first assembled it. Heck, who needed a tensioner when you're using s double roller chain. Wrong. I put the stock tensioner back on the engine and had no timing or chain problems. Don't know if somebody like Duttweiler makes a better unit. Mark
hey guys i finally got the engine back form the machine shop. i had the heads ported and polished and installed new cam bearings, edelbrock cam and lifters and and edelbrock timing chain. i put most of the engine back together but i have a big problem.... i don't know how to put in the distributor. i have the #1 cylinder at TDC but which way do i insert the distributor? also how badly scored does the oil pump cover need to be for me to want to install a new thrust plate? thanks
231 power up Hello Omar, Man, that is fast work you're doing. With the timing mark for #1 @ TDC rotate the shaft so that the rotor points to the terminal for the #1 cylinder. It should drop in with minor rotation of the shaft. Be sure to lubricate the distributor gear with assembly grease. If you don't have any, you can probably get some at the machine shop or most parts stores. Once the distributor is in and you're ready to start it up, you may have to rotate the distributor in very small increments to hit the spot where it fires right up. From there you can use a timing light to set the timing. Buicks seem to be fairly sensitive to oil pressure, so if there's any scoring at all, replace the thrust plate. It's small money for big insurance. Mark
thanks for the info ok, i replaced the thrust plate but i am not sure about the distributor still. i have the #1 @ TDC and i point the rotor towards the #1 terminal but what is the #1 terminal? also if i point the rotor at the #1 termianl how do i position the shaft of the distributor? i also got a kenne bell intake and wasn't sure about the best carb for this setup. i hope you guys have some suggestions. i got a used 4bbl quadrajet from the guy who sold me the intake. it is from a 86 307 motor(computer controlled). is there any difference between computer controlled and not? thanks
As my V-6 is still apart, I hope this is right!!..... Before you install the distributor, you may want to 'pre lube' the engine by spinning your oil pump. Did you pack the oil pump gears with vasoline? This would insure the pump will pump oil immediatly, and not just air...And hopefully, you checked oil-pump-gear end clearance! ...If it's insufficiant, you'll be circulating aluminum scrapings thru your oil system... TDC occurs twice during the 4 stroke cycle: after the exhaust stroke, and after the compression stroke. Make sure you are at the right one. Rotate your engine, watch the valves, use the TDC that occurs after the intake valve closes. You want the distributor's final position so it can be rotated slightly in each direction so minor timing adjustments can be made. So it may take a few attempts to get it right. Look at your dist cap and wires. install on dist body, make a mark on the body where #1 is. Remove cap. The distributor also drives the oil pump shaft. The slot in the pump shaft needs to line up with the pin in the dist shaft. With the rotor lined up in the housing, see which direction it goes, and determine where the oil pump shaft slot needs to go. Just rotate the op shaft with a screwdriver till it lines up. The rotor will rotate as the dist is installed, so start with the rotor positioned about an inch(?) to the right of your mark. Drop the dist in, you'll see rotor rotate as it engages the drive gear. If the oil pump shaft is lined up, dist will drop all the way down. If not, it won't! If it doesn't line up, remove dist, turn oil pump shaft with screwdriver a bit, and try again. It may take a few tries, be patient... When it finally drops all the way in, line up your rotor with the #1 mark on the housing. Hopefully you'll be able to turn the dist a bit each direction to make minor timing adjustments. If not, remove dist, turn op shaft, and install dist rotated a few degrees from last try. You'll get it, may take a few tries! BTW, what did you use for a chain tensioner, and cam button? I'll check back later....hope all goes well!
thanks for the info. i think that clears it up but i will try it tommorrow and let you know. i used original tensioner and cam button. should i not have done that? i put in a new edelbrock cam, lifters, and timing chain. i put in new stock pushrods and rocker arms. anyway let me know about the tensioner and the cam button. thanks
Missed this post...Haven't been online in a while... For the tensioner and the cam button, just go to your local parts store and get a new tensioner and spring and the upgraded roller bearing cam button... Is the Edelbrock timing chain a double roller??? If so, DO NOT use the tensioner!!! The double roller chain will eat the rubber in the tensioner and clog up your oil pump pickup screen...I've done a few of the turbo motors and have used the double rollers and the stock replacement timing chain sets(they use a steel cam gear) that you can buy at the local parts stores for less than $20...The double rollers for the V6s are overkill...You won't need it...Just get the stock replacement set from the parts store and use a new tensioner/spring, and the roller bearing cam button and you will be fine... I would wait until the motor is in the car and just about ready to fire up before you pre-lube the motor and put the distributor in...Do everything else first and then pre-lube and drop the distributor in... As for the intakes, the 80-4 4.1L Buick V6s used a factory alum 4 bbl intake...Or go with the Edelbrock 4 bbl and run no bigger than a 500 cfm...A Carter(or Edelbrock) AFB will work great on the Edelbrock intake, but the factory intake is set up for the Rochester Quadrajets... If you have anymore questions, I'll try to help you out some more...
ok, the motor is in the car. it has a edelbrock cam, kenne bell intake, and a holley 390cfm electric choke carb. do you guys think 390 is not enough? i was going to put a 4bbl computer carb quadrajet but forget about all those wires. so i am going non computer. i got an msd 6al ignition, msd gm hei cap without coil in it. msd blaster 2 coil. 3.73 gears with posi. no more smog pump. msd wires. 160 degree thermostat. just a couple of ? what do u think for a torque conveter for a th350 trans? which carb should i go with? 390cfm or 500cfm? if you guys have any other ideas please let me know. thanks for all the great info so far. it has really helped. omar
231 Qs Looks like you're doing all the right stuff. I used the Holley 390 on a well-modified 231 and had plenty o' gas. However, I had to change the power valve cam to get the off-idle stumble out because I had too much cam for a street motor. Nice thing about Holley carbs is that you can easily tune them to your specific needs. There's a great Holley handbook by a writer name Urich that gives simple descriptions of Holley operation and how to tune them. All the parts are readily available through retail or mailorder. For a street car I wouldn't go smaller than a 10" converter. A "street fighter" or "weekend warrior" category is more than adequate. You don't want a wicked loose converter on the street. 2000-2500 stall is plenty for a street V6.
ok i just heard that the stock distributor won't work with my setup. is that true? i hope it isn't thanks
:beer the carbed 231 is a waste of metal.save yourself time,money and disappointment and swap in ANY other b.o.p V-8 or if u have an O.D. 200-4r tranny then u have a double bolt pattern and even a chevy 305 4bbl would go better than a 231 mildly built and would cost less and hold up better.the 231 excluding the sfi's and turbos is good for nothing but a boat anchor.:grin:
well i know it has been quite a while, but i finally got the engine together and running. i am getting that "off idle stumble" but only until the engine heats up after driving for about 15-20 minutes. i used the stock hei cap and msd 6al ignition box. Pinhead64US, you said you changed your power valve cam? did that fix the prob? also i have the timimg at 30 degrees advanced. one more thing, on the street my engine runs about 180-210 degrees, but the other day when i got on the highway and was doing about 65-70 and about 2500-3000 rpms(3.73 gears), the temp jumped up to 235 degrees. it never boiled over and there was no change in engine performance. does that seem too hot for anyone? i put in a 160 degree thermostat. where should i connect the pcv to? anyway, with all that aside, the engine makes some good power. let me know what you guys think is the problem for the off idle stumble and the high temps. TIA omar
231 power-up Hello Omar; Yes, I purchased a Holley kit that included several different cams. The cams determine when, how long and how much fuel is pumped when the engine transitions from idle to part-throttle operation. It's been a while so I don't remember which color cam I used to replace the original one, but it definitely solved the problem. Mark
I hate heat in engines, so I installed a remote oil cooler to keep the oil temp down. I ran a 160-degree thermostat, oversized water pump pulley, a flex-fan, 3-row cross-flow radiator that was in the 18" x 22" size range, and a thermostatic electric in front of the radiator. The car didn't have A/C. The hot trans fluid ran through a remote cooler not through the cooler in the radiator. The engine was swapped into a '63 Special, which didn't come from the factory with either a cross-flow radiator or fan shroud. I fabricated one from sheet aluminum and had brackets welded on at a local race car fab shop. Of this kept it in normal range, except on 90-100 degree days in city traffic. Then it would be up in the 220-degree range. Using synthetic oil will definitely help save the engine when it runs hot.
two words: Bu350 swap.. Just kidding :grin: There are a ton of parts out there for 231s, and as time goes on, you could always find a turbo 3.8 (231) to put in there (which, IMO, is a better idea for those in emissions states... since I know here that if I put my 350 in anything newer than 74 that it will no longer pass inspection)
