I think alot of Buick owners can't support the repro guys because they are busy supporting there children. Not all of us hear have have incomes that can put our car on the top of the priority list. $250 is a good sum of money, and most people have other uses for it. Personally, I'm 21, no kids, and living with my parents, and making some nice money. But, I know when I was a kid my family couldn't spend $250 on tailights for the car... so before you call people cheap, know where they are coming from. If there were repro 72 tailights I'd buy them right now. I think the repro guys should have done more market research. The reason there is no repro parts, is because there is no market to make it profitable. Most people are to busy buying other parts. I know I'd buy a intake manifold before I replaced my tailights that work, but have a small crack in them.
Rennee,I am not trying to flame anyone.But if you are a 70 GS/Skylark owner then at some point your car will need the lens.You said your car has a cracked one now but at this time you have other items to buy ahead of the lens;what if when you are ready they are $250.00 each and impossible to find?Someone stated that they would join the BPG if they were getting something reproduced,well without members there are no funds to reproduce anything.We all can't spend money we do not have and I understand that,but I believe a lot of poeple could support the lens project and they are not thinking that when the time comes that they want to get lens they will be availible aftermarket at maybe even a better price[like vcr's or camcorders]I am saying maybe if we delay now there may not be other oppurtunities.
As for my opinion I dont think some are cheap. I feel that myself personally I definately dont need any tail lights (I have 2 sets NOS) but I ordered 2 sets of the repros even if i dont use them right away maybe I will have a friend that needs some later. Also I Have about $10K in inventory setting here now!!:eek2: I had countless people ask me about flywheel inspection covers, which I spent a ton of cash out to makeand I have only sold about 20 so the other 80 I had made are just setting now. I know not everyone has 2 70 model cars around there are other years but as a group we can do something that the chevelle geeks cant do!!! Being that we are a VERY close nit group we can help market parts to the ones who dont have v8buick.com on the brain or arent a member of any of the 3 or 4 buick clubs. Dont be afraid to call on someone you know needs parts when you see a car that we know needs parts going down the street. Heres my list of parts below I make. start by looking thru them and seeing what you can do for selling these then we can get Duane or Alan to do the same see what WE can do to help each other. I know I cant do it so Im sure the others cant either BUT setting on a pile of inventory because noone is buying takes away any motivation to make other items. (steps off soapbox) Here you go !! This is a complete list of all the parts I have on hand and the ones below are the ones in the works TH400 Console Shifter Cable Brackets $20 Th350-400 Console Cable Shifter Lever $20 4 Speed Lockout Bracket $35 4 Speed Reverse Lockout Bracket Stud $12 4 Speed Reverse Lever $14 69-70 Fanshroud Hosehook $20 70-72 Skylark/GS Coresupport Repair Kit Left Side $99 70-72 Skylark/GS Coresupport Repair Kit Right Side $99 70-76 Console U-Shape Shift Handle Clip (Polished Aluminum) $40 70-76 Console U-Shape Shift Handle Clip Springs $2.50 68-72 Transmission Crossmember Repair Kit $15 69-74 4 Speed Reverse Lockout Rod $29. 67-74 4 Speed Dust / Inspection cover $69 67-74 BB Z-Bar Block Stud $18 Coming soon!! 68-9 core support patch panels L & R side 68-72 BB throttle cables and maybe SB too 70-74 auto shifter pull up bar (polished aluminum)
This question is not up to me to answer Make parts? Being a non-profit, *your money* is best spent working with individuals who have the time, contacts and drive to get these repro parts done. Why don't I want the club to actively do these parts? ... vs. working with vendors to show them a market for the parts.. simple.. once running the club gets turned into a full time job, then a portion of your money gets spent on compensation for time spent by individual(s) to make these parts.. it's a whole lot of time and effort to get this stuff done... Even with a lot of members, a number of us can, and will, devote a portion of our free time, to make this a reality.. we already do! I have said it before, and will say it again. If the BPG had 1000 members, and not 340, we would have been in a position to work with Allan, negotiate a deal for the club to purchase X amount of his product for X price. Then, BPG members could purchase those lenses at a reduced price, vs the retail price. Non BPG members would have to get them at retail, from Allan. And there are a great many talented individuals in this community.. Besides Allan Faircloth, there is Mike Garrision, Duane Heckman, and a few other folks that can get high-quality repro parts done. And all the major vendors. Upside for BPG members.. The ability to buy these parts, at a price less than retail when they are ready to buy them.. The club will inventory and sell these parts, and over time, we will sell them out.. since we are not a profit driven operation, and we took *your money* to buy these, it does not cost us anything to stick them on a shelf, and sell them to club members down the road at some date. When that individual decides that it's time for him/her to pick up a set. Everyone has different priorities. I commend those folks who have purchased a set or two of Al's '70 lenses, even if they don't need them.. but that won't be enough, as there simply is not enough of those folks in a small group such as ours. You, as the individual BPG member, have enabled the community to produce low volume, year specific parts. You *WILL NOT* see expensive projects like Grills, Fan shrouds, correct Sheet Metal, and other high cost/low volume parts be reproduced by individuals or Vendors... if that was going to happen, it already would have. Look at the YO Chevy book, if you have any doubts about that statement.. you can start with the "SS" grill emblem, and build an entire Chevelle, any year you want. It's numbers folks. Big Vendors got to that level of sucess in the resto parts business, by investing their money in products that there was a substantial market for, to get their investment back, and realize a profit. No individual is going to build a viable business by doing parts that will not repay the investments, for a very long time.. read that Buick, year specific, parts. The only way that could happen, is if one of us hits the lottery, and money is no longer an issue, and that person just wanted to leave their "mark" on the community. But I am not sitting around, waiting for that to happen. ------------------------------------------------------------------ But let's change the Buick Landscape now.... Vendor "A" can be convinced they can produce one of these parts, because a strong international organization is in place, to both help finance, and market the product, and can carry a portion of the financial end of the ball.. The BPG can tie up a percentage of it's assets in parts that it's members will eventually need. That's a HUGE piece of the repro puzzel. And *YOU* the non BPG Member, control the outcome.. will you believe in this vision for our future? And the whole time, you get all the other benefits of belonging to a good, member run club. Newsletters, Events, Vendor Discounts, and comradary with fellow owners. Upside for the Vendors This organization has opened up new markets, for their time, talents, and investment capital. Bottom line gang.. if there is money to be made, these companies will invest in our parts.. if they know they will sell them.. to either indivduals, or a "holding company" which would be the club. Most of these outfits have exhausted the high volume parts, and the market is pretty saturated with Chevy and Mopar Restorartion Parts Suppliers.. they need new markets, to sustain growth. We are that market! Upside for the community as a whole Because parts are available to restore these cars, at less than astronomical prices, more of these cars get saved.. more folks are drawn into the hobby, and we all benefit. Too many of these cars are sacrificed now, and sold for parts, because the parts value of the car is greater than the value of the car as a whole. Those of you who own pristine cars, will see the value of those cars INCREASE, because of the fact that more guys will see "Joe's" car, built with BPG sponsored restoration parts, and want one. Some of these folks will have the cash to buy a completely finished car, while others will buy a project, or less than perfect car. And then, after finding a suitible resto candidate, that very well may have been kept as a whole, due to the availablity and reasonable price of the parts to restore it in the first place, will be pleasantly surprised that a community exists, in which they have the ability to get the informantion they need, and the parts they need. The information part of the puzzel already exists.... Your reading it. For the V-8 guys -- So many folks have joined this board, and offered tremendous amounts of good info, we now have built a tremendous data base.. imagine if you just stumbled across this site, after you just purchased your first GS... WOW.. I see that reaction all from time to time already. Now imagine if their first post on this board was "Where can I get a perfect resto fan shroud for my GS".. and the answer was "Call the BPG.. they should still have a bunch left.. WE did a run of them a few years ago. We need to follow thru on the second piece of this puzzel. Let me tell you why the BPG exists in the first place... About this time last year, I laid awake in bed one night, pondering the future of this hobby. I *was not* thinking "How can we hurt the GSCA" or anything along that line. Richard has built himself a good business down in Georgia, and kept many of his customers very happy over the years. And that's great.. I have no problem with that, or with anyone involved in the GSCA. I don't hold grudges, and what may have seemed important to me at one time, is about as important now, as the temp was last July 17th... The temp that day meant something *on that day*, but means nothing on January 4th. This line of reasoning applies to the little disputes with indivduals in all our lives.. they may mean a lot at the time, but as time goes by, what was once a "big issue" is no longer meaniful. I touched on that, because I want everyone to understand that althought I am about to use the GSCA as an example, I have no problem with that organization, nor do I wish Richard any ill will. But let's do the math folks: 5200 members, at $35/head = $182,000. in yearly dues collected. Newsletter pays for it's printing and distribution, via the advertising... And then some... I know what exactly it cost to print and deliver a newsletter. Events.. Requires up front money, but sucessful events are money makers. Now, if we, as BPG members,had 150K (after the expenses to run the club) a year to play with, no one would be asking any questions, except.. what parts are you doing next?? So I composed and email that night.. and sent it to some folks that I personally knew, to see if I just had been inhaling too many fumes in the shop, or if there was some merit to the idea. And the overwhelming answer was YES!!!! The more well-heeled amoung us, have stepped up big time, in not only verbal support and participation, but also financial support, to get this effort off the ground. And we are doing well, both financially, in regards to paying back that initial investment, and in membership numbers. I have been able to convice some of the biggest Vendors in this business, their involvement in this effort is in their best interest. Folks, we do this now... or in 10 years, everyone is going to be paranoid about driving one of these cars, due to the fact that if some teen-ager, with their attention focused on the touch screen in the dash of their Daddies 2013 Suburban, may crash into their "pefect" GS/TR and the costs to repair that vehicle, if we continue on our present course, will be astronimical. And forget about the enjoyment of restoing one of these cars in your garage. Parts prices will prohibit that, for the vast majority of the owners of these cars. But this does not have to be the future.. With your support, the BPG will continue to grow, to the point that we can change the future, for not only you, but the generations of GS lovers that will follow us. ----------------------------------------------------------------------------- So, in answer to your question Jeff, Will we make any parts?.. No probably not.. But will we help support those individuals/companies who want to do these parts? Will we begin to inventory them in 2003? The answer to that question is exactly the same as the answer to this question: Will YOU, the non-BPG member reading this, support this effort? Yes or No As non-BPG members reading this, your answer to that question, will determine the outcome of our hobby. In 10, 20, or 30 years from now. Think it over... ask yourself... Is my involvement in this effort worth the cost of a tank of gas? I would hope so. We as individuals, can band together, to become a strong force in the industry, and control our own destiny. But as indivdual consumers, we are at the mercy of Ebay, and "convential business wisdom". The choice is yours.. your fellow enthusiasts have build the bandwagon.. Jump on, and let's go for a ride! JW
Roger That, Jim! C'mon non-BPG members on this board, we take PayPal!!! http://www.paypal.com email address to send $35 to is: mb@buickperformancegroup.com Here is a link to the BPG registration page: http://www.buickperformancegroup.com/2003_renewal.htm
Dr Weise: I do not think it can be overemphasized that the cost of BPG membership is offset by the 10% discount offered to BPG members by major vendors like Year One and TA. So anyone that buys $350 worth of parts each year gets their yearly dues back plus the Build Sheet newsletter free. Any more spent actually saves a person money. So if you just looked at it from the viewpoint of personal economics joining the BPG in addition to using the V8 Board makes sense.
Very True Jim, and that is the "down and dirty" of it.. Clubmembers have the potential to "take" much more than they "give". Several folks have taken advantage of the deals offered by TA to BPG members only, and in some cases, have paid for their membership dues to the club many times over. But I wanted to expound a little bit on the philosophy of the club, and the repro parts market in general. I fear many folks have a "US against Them" attitude regarding the GSCA and the BPG.. and that is a misconception. There is no division going on here, just two organizations with different goals in mind. We are still one big "family". And yes, as soon as the dust settles on the year end work, we will be contacting numerous vendors, to work out the details of discounts available to members of the BPG, and will advertise them. JW
Hi all! Make that 341 for the BPG Btw, I'm going to seriously look into buying a set of taillights from Alan in order to help out (you have to sacrifice in order to gain, right?) Thanks, Rob
Sheesh, I can do that by just not turning on the lights! Seriously though: I don't think there's any real animosity here (I need to write a resume soon, so I'm brushing up on my vocab). I think there's just some members who are bristling at the thought that some folks are working real hard to make certain things available, but not getting the response they had expected. I can understand that, beleive me. Some of this could be engendered (vocab again) because I think that many Buick guys have had to "make do" for so long. We're almost the baldheaded stepchild of GM. I can recall being told that "Buick never made no 455! You must be Mickey Mousin' that thing, kid" after I went looking for motor mount pads back in the early '90s. So what did I do? I welded in the Riv pads until I found original Buick 455 A body pads. How much would I have paid for the repros back then? Anyone care to guess? If you guessed "a lot" you'd be right.
HEY im cheap Hello... I'm cheap! I also live off of Ramen noodles for weeks. its called a College Student and there are a few others on here who are in the same boat that I am. Yes I graduate in a few months. May to be exact. but then i also get to find a job in this crappy economy. I also need to have a place to work on a car so either i buy a house and have a mortgage off the bat or start paying off $44,000 in student loan payments. along with retireing my car that i had since i was 16 yrs old with 185k miles on it and its 4 inches shorter and the hood is inside out. with another car prolly 4 years old instead of 20 so I can leave my buick up on jack stands for a few days at a time. and get some serious work done on it. I also didnt know mike made some other parts I know I need that are a few dollars less (actually about 1:10 the price of tail lights) (a few interior parts) the alumimunm U-clip insert (I've seen the plastic repo one) along with the lower button lever I also will need the radiator core support on the pass side. so some other means of who is doing what. would be benifical I admit that i need tail lights I have one in fine shape and the other has a crack in the middle of it. but I can't afford 250 now let alone dinner some nights. my buick now is a back-up vehicle to my pos honda.. that also needs a full exaust system (250 bucks farm and fleet i do all the work) for that price id much rather dump the money into an exaust sys for my buick. but the honda is my winter daily driver. Here is the other thing the economy does suck right now and everyone knows it and everyone is spending a lil less because they don't know what is going to happen in the next few months let alone year. I am single so that helps me in the financial situation. and i have no ties here in milwaukee I can go anywhere. for any job im qualified for and the girl better scratch that WILL understand that I do need to put some money into the baby in the garage err whatever baby that is going to be even if it isn't a buick when that time does come. but that time is not right now. Nate
Nate - Here Here:beer I just graduated in December...just bought my first real project car:grin: :grin: I am in the ramen noodle boat just like you. I'll be dumping every penny I can spare into the car so I'll still be eating soup for a while... Oh well...all for the love of Buicks Adam
I knew you'd say that!!! However I should be able to give your race car a run for the money (I hope) this year!!
I'll be rootin' for ya'...... I'm always happy to see a fast Buick. What's this "RACECAR" implication? It's registered,insured,and logged a few street miles the past 2 summers.o No:
Lisc and insurance does not a street car make... No... no.. nevermind.. let's not go there :laugh: :beer JW
street LEGAL car..yes. But in reality,A race driveline in a race chassis,in a car that still has street equipment. It all adds up to FUN. It's a 9 second ego trip,but I wouldn't try to pass it off as a daily driver. I'll stop there so as not to get you goin J-dub.:beer
Or maybe we could call it a RACE CAR with lisc plates and blinkers/wipers...:laugh: NO problem Gary... old Joke between me and MG.. :spank: JW
