I was recently scrounging a salvage yard for some better heads than my '74 455's...Long story short...I came across three complete Big Block engines, two still in their cars and one in a shop with a multitude of other engines. The one in the shop is a '73 455, the other two are a '70 455 and a 400 or 430 not sure what year. Don't remember vehicle models either, I WAS just looking for heads. I can get the '70 heads for $100. He also said he could part with the '73 motor for $200, this was before I knew about the other two engines. I didn't have time to pull the heads that day, so I'm going back this Saturday. The more I thought about it the more I thought that I should get one of the complete engines. I know the heads on the '70 are better and the block (oiling system) is better on the '73 and that the heads on the 430 have some cracking issues. I have a limited budget or I would probably get all three. But it seems that probably my best move would be to pull the '70 motor out and take that baby home. I checked the '73...and it rotates. I did not check the other two. Any input, advise, or suggestions will be appreciated.
Get all 3 then part them out. Good timing covers $100, distributors $25, carb $25, keeper sets $10, ... just a quick estimate of what I would give for ok parts.
At $200 bucks a pop, I can't afford to get all three...Unless I take out a loan. Very limited budget..
heads If all you want are the heads, go with the 70's. you did not say what you are building, if its just a street motor that should be fine. You need to get some casting numbers on the 400/430 to see if they are any better. Then you will still run the risk of the cracks although they can be fixed. With out other mods (cam, headers, etc) they would not make much difference anyway. my 2 cents - Bill :TU:
I have a steet/strip 455 that I was looking to upgrade the heads. I plan on doing a mild port/polish to improve flow over my untouched '74 heads. But if I have to pay $100 for heads, I might as well pay $200 for a complete engine and get all the spare parts that come with it. But which one?? '70 or '73??
heads port/polish/deck should give you a big improvement for your 74 heads. The 70 heads will be higher compression. But, you may be better off putting the money into your heads and get better results! Give Jim Weise a call and see what he thinks. - Bill
That was my original intent. Then I thought I would spend one day looking for better heads--before I pulled mine off and started porting/polishing--just to see what might be around. And if I found some, I could work on them while still driving the Skylark around a little. Then this curve-ball was thrown at me.
70 heads have 68cc combustion chambers,71-74 have 71cc chambers, 75-76 (junk heads) have 78cc chambers, the pistons also have more dish in the later blocks. you gain .1 compression ratio per cc, if you went to the 70 heads you would gain about .3 commpression, i would guess only about a 10 hp difference. if you want more commpression you need to change pistons, and or have your block shaved. just my 2 cents
Port my current heads=more HP & more down time. Just get heads and modify them=more HP & little down time. Get one of complete engines=spare block (plus other parts) & heads that can be modified...etc..etc.. What would you guys do???? C'mon...I need input. In other words, I need you guys to justify my leaning toward getting a complete engine....But which one???
i would buy the 70, you get the best heads and a good block, you can just put a oil pump rebuild kit with a booster plate and that will give you all the oil pressure you will need, there are other oil mods you can do to the block and crank for very little money. the 5/8 pick up tube on the later blocks can be bought for about $50 new, so i would see if you could get that from the 73 say $10. also if its a good enough block you could rering it. then you would have 70 commpression. just my 2 cents
Definitely check the '70 block for block code. If in a full-size car will probably be SF, if in a GS Stage 1 it would be "SS", regular GS455 is a 3rd code (S?).. Remote chance but that SS is worth something to a Stage 1 owner looking for a block. Find the letters between #5 and #7 (driver's side) between the plugs, below the heads. Clean and scrape and have a flashlight. The '73 head can be made up as well as the '70s if I'm not mistaken. They can be shaved for true/flat and if done correctly you can reduce the cc to gain compression. Mine are '73 heads and measured with zero deck pistons for 11:1. I wouldn't know which engine to get, probably the '70. But if it happens to be SS (slim to none I'm sure).I might buy it for resale value (complete) and buy the '73 for my builder.
Thanks for the input guys:grin: :TU: I have pretty much decided on pulling the '70 engine. It has the added benefit of being compatable with the "steel shim" head gaskets for a little more compression. My engine already has pretty good 10:1 (advertised) pistons. My main goal in the beginning was to get that compression to REALLY be 10:1, or a little higher. But with an extra block and stuff, I can leisurely build an even better engine.:grin: I know so much more now than I did the 10 plus years ago that I put my current engine in.
A little more work, but I would mix n match if allowed ,,,,,,,,, grab the 70 heads and the 73 block. I have even swapped to get the pistons I wanted. Make sure you get the big pickup tube and a rear sump oil pan. The 73 should have an 'improved' timing cover to match the larger oil hole in the block. This assumes the crankshaft is good in both engines. Ask about the warrany too. If it isn't a good core, can you bring it back?
Take the whole 70 engine, keep what you want and need and then sell off the extra parts. You will certainly be able to pay yourself back for the cost of the engine in the first place. Rockers, rocker shafts, oil pan, valve covers, and the timing cover should get you into the black. Basically a 'free' upgrade to your existing car.
Thanks for the responses guys.:grin: To make a long story short...The crank on the '70 engine would not turn . So I pulled the intake and heads to discover that the cylinders looked perfect :grin: and they had not been bored out yet :TU: I decided to go ahead and take the engine home...I know, big gamble. It turns out that the #4 main bearing had a little damage to it which probably caused the massive failure of the #7 & #8 rod bearings.ou: However, the block appears completely undamaged, no rust even :TU: The crank suffered minor damage but should be useful as a core exchange for the stroker crank I plan on getting. But I don't think the 2 damaged rods can be saved . Anyway, I got a good block that I can modify/improve and a good set of heads. Of course, I will have them professionally checked out before doing anything with them. And I have some spare parts I will be able to sell to whoever needs them...Anyone need a cast iron Q-jet intake?? Again, thanks guys.:TU:
Hey, im doing pretty much the same build up on my 455 and should be ready to run soon. I can let you know how mine turns out, should be all good, cause its a BUICK! I'm using my '74 455 block bored .030 over and hyperutectic 10.1 pistons and timing cover, GS113a cam from Poston, crome moly pushrods,5/8 pick up tube, stock crank and rods,block decked .010, '70 heads shaved .006 and complete valve job, stock '70 intake, 4 barrel '74 carb, cause its 800 cfm. This monster is going in my restored '79 trans am. This all took me 3 years so far but its worth it. This monster will make those tires dance! If theirs any questions Ican help you out with let me know, i'd be glad to help if I can since were doing the same thing. ~Vinny
Leo, The valves were the first thing I checked when I pulled the heads...NOT stage 1 :ball: Motor came from a '70 Electra. Vinny, Sounds like a pretty good build. My current engine is a '75 block with untouched '74 heads, a Poston GS112 cam, 10:1 hyp. pistons, roller rockers, and an S-divider intake....Runs pretty good. Built it up 10+ years ago. The heads and maybe the intake are major limiting factors in top end performance....If I knew then what I know now.... My current plan is to modify the '70 heads and put them on my current engine. Then I plan on eventually getting a stroker kit and stage 2 heads and a barely streetable cam for my "new" block.:grin: :grin: :3gears: This will likely take a while though.
Just an idea here, been in your position before, get the 73 to have as a spare. Buick 455's are getting harder to find. Also, the 73 will have the 800 cfm Q-jet, that alone is worth $80-100. So for $100 you have a complete long block!:Smarty: I remember the saying, never time to do it right, but always time to do it over!:TU: When you see what the new 455+ cu in blocks are going to be selling for in a few months, that $200 73 will be a screaming bargain!
