this is directed toward sean76, but all may chime in. im tore between my ssb an rebuilding my bb olds. lotsa cash!! would a bigger cam, deeper stall an 4.10s REALLY make a difference?? it'll be a spin king, but im looking for more top end,big time. i want a thumpin head turning cam. which one?? dont want to change valve train,ive got a 2800 stall in there now, 3500 stall on the shelf, really dont want to dump a ton into head work, an 4.10s are a phone call away. im saying im on a major budget here. im sick of running 15.50s. I WANT 14,s dammitt!!!
I know you were having serious carb issues and ignition issues as well. Were you able to make a clean pass with both of those issues resolved? If not then you may not be far from you goals. Changing the rear gear to 4.10 is a great idea, you have the 2800 stall already so keep that for now, I would pair this with this cam: http://www.lunatipower.com/Product.aspx?id=1497&gid=287, run a 1.5" or 2" open spacer and tune the Q jet so it smoothly gets into the secondaries. I also suggest trying this cam with your current gears, it just may be the missing link now that your carb and ignition issues are fixed. It is a good idea to try one change at a time and find out what is helping and how much. The cam needs to be changed to get the high rpm charge you are looking for though so start there. I have a feeling that 3800 stall converter may slip a lot on the top end and cost you some mph.
gotcha. an yes carb an ignition issues have been fixed. new/old dist, new conversion kit, retimed/powertimed, like i stated before, car RUNS fanfreekintastic, just NO top end. pontiac guys keep say portwork, im thinking a GOOD cam upgrade, an maybe a little NOS!! as far as passes have had about 10-15 good 1/4 mile plus passes. no hiccups.just slow. 15.50 to 15.90 no real consistant passes at the track.
we use t/a 298. about the same specs and have pushed with stock arms and p/rods. unless there is something drastically wrong with your engine, it shouldnt be a problem. the 4.10 would be a great help moving the car down the 1/4.
While you are making good torque your HP is likely pretty low without head porting espcially with that cam, this is most likely why you run out of steam in 3rd gear. The 4.10 would help you get more leverage on the big car in all gears... What are your shift points and tire size? Radials I presume? Where you able to get a decent 60 foot or spinning too much? The cam I suggested is made to work well with nitrous so spray a 150 shot and have some fun! Since you have a stock intake use a perimeter spray nitrous setup like this, just add a spreadbore to squarebore adapter: http://www.streetperformance.com/part/zex/nitrous-carbureted-system/1241054-82040.html
as far as shift points, i was shifting at 4900,5000 in sec an 5000 in third, but lastime out, tried 4700 into sec an 4800,4900 into third. got my best pass. with a bigger cam, with shift points of 6000, i still wont go much past 5200,5500. i hit the track maybe twice a yr. mostly goofin on fri an sat nites. still, all my bros are MUCH faster. thanks about the valve train question. motors, fine, just slow!! 0-60 its a rocket!! third gear, no balls.BIG CAM!!
With 10-1 pistons. .020 decking, super comp headers , 2 1/2" pipes, 3.42 gear,2,800 stall, you should already be in the low 14's. If your ignition is good, check secondaries to see if they open fully, or ditch the carb and try something else. (Holley maybe). If your cam has at least .460+ lift and good springs, you should do 14's without any head porting. I used to run very high 13's with 750 vac. secondary Holley, .456/.480 Crane cam, dual springs,stock valves, no porting,'68 1.6 ratio rockers, your headers, 2-1/2" exhaust,10.-1 Hypers,Fel-pro blue .042 thick gaskets, no decking, (comp. was approximately more like 9.6) 390 gear, 350 turbo trans, 2,100 stall. Mallory dual pt. dist. / coil, with packard 440 stainless wires. BFG's T/A street radials on 8" rims....Nothing real special.
see, that is what erks the crud outta me. all of my components say mid 14s. at the track mid fifteens, best ever. carb seems to be at full throttle.even at high end. it pulls, just not like first gear.no misses, pops, bogs, plug read is a med brown, so not lean.timing is at 12 init, 30 total. maybe a little more?? like i said before 0-60 is GREAT. top of sec to third shift is firm, an pulls, just not like i want.i might try a 650 dp holley on it before it parked for a nap.
Play with timing, try as high as 36*. Don't go smaller cfm with carb. Hope u degreed cam. It's important.
yea, true on the carb. as far as the cam went in straight up. same with timing chain. would that be an issue on a stock motor, as basically this is.
I would take a compression test and see what you have there mine is at 190-95 My comp ratio is at 10.6 I run the Lunati cam about the same as the one suggested.. Go with at least a 373 gear. 2800-3200 stall. Put some nitrous on and you will beat everybody. I run my timing at 32 but I would try to go to 34-36 if you can without pinging. Use 2-5 gal of race gas, this will let you run a little more timing. I ran 14.90 with 373 gear Comp Cam 268 no porting just headers. Cam installed with the dots. Check out the tests with the Ken-Bell set ups.
My cams always degreed in at 4* advanced setting on the gearset..I use a 3 keyway gearset. Hope rings & valves seat well.. Again, it's important. Could be not making the power it should.:TU:
Yes...what Guy said. Nitrous will beat everybody! Also put the gear in ! I wouldn't go with less than 3.90 or 4.10. Get a 2004r to fix that.:TU:
Your secondaries can't be opening...you are a full second off ET. Borrow a carb off of one of your buddys to try. ("at the track mid fifteens")("top of sec to third shift is firm, an pulls,"). No car pulls till you get in the 13's or less. Mine feels like I'm sitting on my sofa, cause it's a heavy Buick and comfortable! (bench seats) ..but it runs!:TU: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=j_TXmApWlQs
4 degrees plus is gonna fall off at higher rpm. You may loose some low end, but it sounds like you want high rpm horses. For that, I would say retard or zero cam timing. Also remember "air in+air out=hp". Port the heads!
I don't know if you've posted this or if anyone has thought to ask, but what is the altitude you've raced at? And the specific weather conditions? You could be missing .5 or more just due to bad air. With my Skylark, I know I"ve run alot of good times with the car compared to many, but I only run at sea level tracks and often with Calculated air that is BELOW sea level. This is something to consider. Also do you have any time slips you can post up from what you think were good runs but just didn't ET like you expect? This will help to diagnosis where the car isn't working for you.
as far as cam timingit was set a dot to dot. so zero, i would think. at 1/8 mile, i was at 10.2 at 74mph. at 1/4 mile was at 85 was a 15.80.only slip i found. rest i BURNED. i ran at milan dragway, milan mi. sea level stuff, i have no idea. i DO NOT have any kind of spacer on it. big help?? as far as porting the heads, for that kind of mola i could buy forged pistons for my olds motor.$$$$$$$$$ shoot, the voodoo cam only 145.00, lifters i cam get fairly cheep here in town. an all i really got to change is one or two cheep gaskets. bigger cam, 2800 stall, 2 in spacer plate, maybe 4.10s. if anything, its gonna rip the tires for a block an a half!! 14s or bust.
Get yourself a vacuum gauge. Hook this up to a line on the carb that sucks air at idle. It should be about 15-17 inches at idle in park. If you have a larger cam in than stock it will be a little lower. I think the 268 Comp cam I had in got me about 13 inches at idle. But you should pull 15 inches, at least this much with the stock cam. 17 is better, It should be closer to this range. If it flutters it usually means the valves are having trouble with leaking. Get a 4 hole 1 inch spacer for the Q-jet, especially if you have the stock intake. I know that this is a redundant exersize but have someone get in the car push the pedal to the floor and look inside the carb to make sure the barrels are opening straight up look at the back also. There is a diaphram that is used to open the back barrels when you floor it. This part might be bad and your secondaries may not be opening all the way. Even when you have the car in park and you go out and floor it freely the secondaries should start to open up some before the engine gets revved up all the way. There is a lock out on the Q-jet that will stop the secondaries from opening up that is hooked up to the choke and they will not open up untill the choke stays open all the way. Check this out also. It does sound like the secondaries are not opening all the way up. In first and second gear the primaries are doing most of the work and in third that is when you need the gas and those secondaries are needed at this point. If you have a Mighty vac pump you can check that diaphram that opens the secondaries and see if it is leaking. If not put a hose on it and suck on it and see if you can hold it open. All of this crap needs to work together to get those secondaries opened up. Damn no wonder I use a Holley carb, but you need a TA intake to make this work good. Holley carbs and stock intake and the adapter DO NOT go well together. Do you think that there might be a posibility that the intake is a little over ported and is larger than the intake ports on the heads? This might not be noticed in first and second gear but it might be a problem in third. Hey Mart I hope that you are not using that crappy Fram filter on your motor are you? Get a Wix filter #21258 or # 1258. Napa stores have them.
