Please tell me I don't have to pull the heads off

I am really having a hard time following this. Old block with the sleeves is gone. New TA built short block installed with same heads. Engine was ok for about 6 months, cooling system turned brown and rear main leaked. Engine removed, heads removed to bump the compression, headers cleaned and recoated and engine reinstalled. Fluids installed, and while rotating flex plate to hook up converter you noticed coolant dripping from both header collectors?

This is very strange. I'm assuming that the coolant leaking is from inside of the collectors and not running down the outside?

If so, the only way for this to be that I can think of is a cylinder or cylinders is/are completely full of coolant or the heads are leaking so badly that the coolant is spilling into the exhaust.

If all of this is correct or about correct, I think I would unbolt the headers from the engine and have a look into the exhaust ports to see if you can at least narrow it down to particular cylinders. Something just doesn't add up here.

 

The shop that put in 8 sleeves was looking for a payday. I have never heard of 8 sleeves put in a block.

$1300 for new block and work by TA was more than fair to the point of cheap.

There is something weird going on here. I can not see TA building a motor with that type of problem. Not a big fan of the "orange crush" gasket, blew one of them and switched to Cometic.

 

I actually had a local shop here in Arizona go back through the heads, and they assembled the long block. All I did was put it back in the car.

 

What would be the weird thing that is going on maybe It can provide some clarity for me too?
When you say 1300 for a new block and work by TA was more than fair you have to consider that I was already over $6000 paid the first time. Maybe i'm wrong but it seems like paying for something twice just feels wrong to me, but I did it so not crying over any spilled milk on that. I don't want this to turn into a TA bashing post either. I just want what I have paid for to work. because once you add the cost of everything else I have had to do associated with the rear main seal going out on a motor with less that 2500 miles on it you can add another $1000 not including the time it takes me to get it out and putting it back in to that $1300. Does that still seem to the point of cheap to you, because its not to me. And no TA didn't offer to fix it.

I did not know there was 8 sleeves in the block, this was discovered before I took the motor to TA the first time, and why ultimately it ended up at TA instead of taking it back to the shop that originally built it. Every person I talked to said that if the sleeves were installed correctly that the block would be better than new, and again I informed Santos at the time that the block had been sleeved, and he said exactly the same thing that I had heard prior to taking it, so stupid me for assuming that the block would have ben checked to ensure the sleeves did not leak especially since the cylinders were being bored out to accommodate the 40 over forged pistons I elected to go with.

My assumption after getting the motor back originally with the sleeves was that everything must have checked out, and the sleeves were not a problem as TA built on the block. If you notice on one of the pages that Larry posted for me it indicated the motor had sleeves in it. Again I would have assumed if it was a problem this would have been caught by TA, and I would have opted for a new block at that time instead of having them finish the build on a compromised block.

Before this experience with this car I had no experience. So I am fast learning through mistakes along the way, and I guess I assumed too many things along the way, And before any one asked why didn't I take the heads back to TA to have them do them, I would say at some point Principal kicked in, and call me crazy but I don't think it would have been too much to ask for Mike to have said simply bring it back to them for them to get it right. After all this did start with a bad rear main seal that turned into blow by on both heads, in which Mike was immediately called on again, and not one time did I get an offer to fix it, instead what I got was blamed and essentially made to feel as though there was something that I did wrong to create this situation.

 

Yes the coolant is dripping out at the collector, not on the outside, that is what I was hoping for but not the case. Those headers are so tight in there that even if I unbolted them I would not be able to look inside the exhaust ports. I would have to pull the motor back out to do any analyzing, and to be honest I don't have enough experience to diagnose any of this I have only pulled it and put it back which has proven to be a little more of a chore than I wanted it to be, but because I have had soo many issues to keep from going to the poor house I figured I had better learn to start doing some of this myself.

 

Get a coolant pressure tester, or rent one. The Stant model is the industry standard, and is the safest/easiest way to test out the cooling system and find any leaks. If you can't take the headers off, pull a spark plug out & run a suction hose down the hole to find out if any cylinders have coolant in them. That should at least help to localize the leak.

Something somewhere isn't mating up correctly and sealing off the water jacket. You mention that you changed the intake manifold? Are you sure it had proper mating to the heads? If not, that scenario can cause coolant to dump down your intake ports and into the cylinders, later to get spilled out of the exhaust. Get a pressure tester, pump up the radiator & listen for the hiss.

 

You can also use a leak down tester on each cylinder.

Applying 100 psi in each cylinder will tell you if the leak is cylinder related and you will certainly be able to tell where the air is going.

 

EXACTLY my thinking! This thread is soooo convoluted, Im confused alsoo No:

 

Were you able to make a complete revolution of the engine when trying to bolt the converter to the flywheel?

 

There are only a handful of ways you can be getting coolant in the headers-

Heads were ported too much, and the exhaust ports broke into coolant-

The exhaust seats were replaced, and machined too deeply and broke into coolant

Coolant is somehow entering the combustion chamber, either through a crack or bad head gasket and draining through an open exhaust valve.

There is a very small chance the intake gasket is shot and coolant is leaking sideways and into an intake port, but I highly doubt that. You might pull the carb and see if the intake is dry..



I suppose the big question is whether or not you had the exhaust crossover blocked in the intake manifold? if you did, and you have coolant dripping out both headers, then you have at least two bad cylinders- one on either side. if its not blocked it is possible that coolant is crossing the intake and causing the leak on both sides.

how fast is it leaking anyway? That might help us figure out your issue. Unfortunately I really can't think of an easy fix that wouldn't involve pulling the heads at a minimum.

You need to pull the plugs and see if any cylinder has coolant in it, or maybe look into the collectors and see which tube is wet and trace it back to figure out where the coolant is coming from.

 

No one trying to bust your chops. $7000+ in a motor should yield something really nice and reliable. We are all trying to get to the heart of this problem because it is very unusual and hate to loose a Buick brother. Most of us in this hobby have all been here. For me it was my sisters 65 Mustang that drove me nuts. Understand your frustration. I will still say $1300 for a new block and refresh is deal. I paid $1800 for a rebuild with no new parts. If a few of use were close to you I think we could put a crew together to have the motor out in a few hours and get to the bottom of this. Hopping for all the best for you and hang in there.

 

I don't know if I ever recall a situation where I put coolant in a fresh engine and a leak was so bad that it went out the exhaust. Both sides is just remarkable.

 

I'd pull every plug and stick a length of cotton rope in the hole to see where the fluid is. Once you know how many have water in them, you'll know where to concentrate your effort on.

But, with it coming out both headers, I can't imagine any scenario where you won't wind up pulling both heads though. I'm hoping you are only going to need new head gaskets or something equally easy.

 

I'm guessing if you didn't run engine yet its just what dripped in when you pulled heads. You could pull headers and tip them some and wash out with hose then let dry and bolt back up. Pressure test system after to confirm.

 

He clearly stated that the headers were removed from the car, cleaned and recoated from cooked oil from an oil leak. ou:

 

Yes I got the motor bumped all the way around no problem.