GS Nationals Dying

Re: GS Nationals dieing

Sorry to read about the GSCA Nationals going downhill.

The last GS Nationals I attended was the year that Beech Bend had the new concrete laid. (2007-2008 ?)
Before that, the last event I had attended was the 1990 one.

I can still remember how packed the 1987 and 1988 GS Nationals were and how exciting it was with the new Turbo Regals. That was a fun time ! :TU:

At the 2007 or 2008 nationals, I couldn't help but notice the average age of those in attendance. I understand that Buick has not made a grand slam winner of a car since 1987 , so it's understandable that there was not as much younger gearheads in attendance.


Do they still penalize a local (and interested) spectator for not being a member ? I remember one year calling to see how much it would be without pre-registering, and it was outrageous. All I wanted to do was spectate on Sat. and they wanted 50 bucks at the gate to just watch.

Good management and fresh thinking will be needed in order to save the Nats.....

 

Re: GS Nationals dieing

Ive been involved in this hobby for 30 yrs. I remember the Car Craft street Machine Nationals. They would only accept so many applicants to the event.Me and my buddies would have are stuff ready to go and at midnight on the 1st day of accepting apps we would send our stuff in. Some of us didnt make it in,still.I think the whole hobby is dieing. Just my .02. Its not just buicks.

 

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Mike,

You said "they" an awful lot when referring to "my" GSR class. Since I personally organized and was responsible for the GSR class I can only guess that you are referring to me. Trust me, if I didnt care about the GSCA, the Nationals, the racers, the members or the spectators I wouldnt put up with all of the BS much less even attend, and greed certainly has nothing to do with my involvement. Yes, we had some glitches with the tree and maybe that was my fault for not going to the tower and explaining our needs in advance. But dam dude, I'm not Wally Parks and this aint the NHRA. My two classes were the only 2 run Open Comp style which requires a different christmas tree setup than any of the other classes. But for the first 3 years we had no trouble so I didnt think it was necessary. Shame on me.

If I am part of the "wrong personnel" running this thing, then by all means someone else can step up like you or maybe even Ron Mooney aka tufbuick. I kinda figured the blatant BS I caught at the Nationals from one of the class participants about the starting system wouldnt be the end of it and here we go.

Hey Ron, you are getting your wish. This is my opportunity to step aside from it all and I am taking it. Future GS Nationals just got a whole lot easier for me, I tell ya.

So have at it boys!!!

 

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We were there but had to keep it down once the Amish showed up....Im not kidding 40+ came in on a tour bus

 

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I hope your not serious about this Jim, I really enjoyed watching these classes and was even putting together a car for the class. Please don't let a select few ruin it for the rest of us.

 

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Jim - read the posts. There are ALOT more than Mr. Mooney who are displeased with the way things are handled

Dont make him the scapegoat for years of the GSCA blindly ignoring what the people feel and want

No body, including Ron wants the GSCA Nats to be a thing of the past. I've attended with him and he's enjoyed it as much as anyone else ... and would be enjoying it to this day if it wasn't for all the shortcomings mentioned in the threads posted here recently.

The reason I stopped attending the GS Nationals and being a member of the GSCA is quite simple - a total lack of accountability and approachablilty by the owner(s)

I am (and I think you too) are accountable for your actions. Why isn't the GSCA ? If it is a club, as it purports to be, then where is the financial accountability ? Why aren't Richard and Bennett approachable on the GSCA forums answering questions ... posting the news ... being accessable to the members ?

I joined the BPG because it offered me what the GSCA did not - a true club with people in charge who were accountable and approachable. It also offers ANYONE who is a member, the opportunity to become involved with running the club by running for one of the Director positions. It also offers the ability for the Directors and members to vote out (or remove) the Chairman if it is deemed necessary.

I became active in running the club to help further these ideals - much as you have with the GSCA Nats. Has it been a perfectly smooth road ? No, but with input from the members, a group of Directors who are accountable for their responsibilites and who are approachable to everyone, new people from the membership stepping up to help run the club, and an approachable means for the members to say - and put into action - what they want, we continue to move foward. We can also account for every dollar people pledge with their membership or pay at the gate for the BPG event.

I dont want to make this an "Us vs. Them" diatribe, but the GSCA and its event has always had an aura of its leadership being one man in the golden tower ... and the gold was paid for by you and me with ZERO accountability offered or implied. I dont get to live my life that way ... The business that I am a Senior Vice President of isn't run that way, I doubt many live that way ... and it quite frankly it is that positioning that turns me off immensely.

Im not saying Richard or Bennett are living the high life off of its membership, but even you agreed that ZERO $$$ payout from the management to the race program is absurd. I expand on this by saying Richard and Bennett's lack of approachablilty on the GSCA forum or even here on V8 is equally absurd.

We all want to come to BG for two reasons - To see and spend time with the great friends we've made over the years and enjoy the cars we love ... most ignore the political BS, dig DEEP into their wallets for a weekend of fun and think nothing more of it and thats fine. For me, having no clue how my monies were spent (for years and years) while under the pretenses of being "a Club" is a pill that just became too hard to swallow

 

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Hey Snowman
It was a pleasure meeting you and your dad at the nats,the pics of your car were special and obviously you have a lot of pride in what you've accomplished.I can;t wait to see that inline 6 and turbo at one of our events,and you've done all the work yourself,awesome.you are the next generation to continue this sport.my son,"painekiller" has been into buicks his whole life and has 5 now and will continue to carry the buick banner.But you and doug maybe the exception,this could be contributing to the decline in the attendance at all the events,not just the nats.
I've been at the nationals since 1983,we only had 50 some cars and were all at the ramada inn,over the years it grew mightily and by the 90's punch cards for time trials were necessary in the staging lanes.now we're going the other way.One year we took Sandys X to race and show,she drove it,there were at least 20 there including the 71-72 cars,look what we have today.Reasons?
Since I didn't
take Scat this year and took the 69 GS stage2,I had an opportunity to talk to people and just walk around and look at the cars,a nice change.I observed that the demographics may be contributing to the decline,most of the GS/skylark owners were baby boomer types while the turbo cars were younger,not a negative here just an observation.Hence we are dying off,have health issues,can't do it anymore,or just decided its a young mans hobby and got out of it.Some believe the GS is too valuable now and don't want to risk hurting it or getting dirt on it and reduce the value,we don't subscribe to this way of thinking, as has been seen with the X.
but many do and a decline in cars was evident,but I saw a lot of people I know that just came to watch and didn't bring their cars.Some of the reasons I got were:
To far to tow,costly.
Aren't appreciated at the show or race,
Brotherhood among the members is not what it used to be
Payouts suck,especially what it cost to build a car today
When I was bringing Thumper in the 80's 10.4's were at the top of Q16,and it didn't take a lot to build it,payouts were low but no one cared,we were there to showcase our buicks,then to be competitive costs soared to build a car and higher payouts were expected,we don't expect to make money racing,but golly would it be too much to ask that if you won a class or were runner up to at least be able to cover some or most of your costs of attending.It was obvious last year when the Q16 payout was large,thanks Doug H.,many more cars were attempting to qualify,Scat ran 9.93 and was well off the pace to get in,I think the bump was 9.7.this should tell the organizers something.
So how do we get the attendance back? The economy needs to improve,lets face it these are extra play funds that people use,when you're short money you have to prioritize and a house payment is more important.
The organizers need to get more personally involved,I remember when Richard used to spend more time associating with the attendees,Bennett has the personality of a 54 Buick trunk lid.
Provide more payouts to the racers,it doesn't have to be alot just pay down more into the quarters,people appreciate that they may get something back for their efforts,and post them ahead of time.Also,little things like best reaction time,running on the dial,or a "dialing for dollars" session would provide more interest.
I don't recall what or if any seminars were done this year,but stuff on GS's for the younger guys could be helpful.
The car show seems to have waned big time,is it due to the frame off restos or expensive frame ons where the car is never driven? most owners drive their cars and can't compete against these fine cars,should a daily drive class,or a survivor class be formed?
Just some ramblings from an old man who has been there done that,I hope this event makes some changes so we don't lose it,and we have to get the younger people involved to keep our dedication to the buick moniker alive,the right changes may do that.
gary

 

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Re: GS Nationals dieing

I've only been to two nats, one in 1994 and the other time in 99 or 2000 (the one in Ohio). I've been a GSCA member since the mid 80's. The Nats used to be the mecca for Buicks. It's sad to hear all this negative chatter, although I completely understand it. Let's just not lose sight of what that club has meant for the last few decades. I suspect if we were to start a thread on the positive things the GSCA has meant or provided to people the thread would be a hell of a lot longer than this one. On the inapproachability thing.... I think it's not so much inapproachability as it is difficulty in contacting. Once you contact someone they are approachable but only on the second Tuesday of odd weeks up to 12 noon. LOL

I have a lot of respect for Richard and what he's done for the Buick community.

Edit: Without the GSCA as the forum and medium to help our hobby, where the hell would we be? Case in point the GSCA helped facilitate the MT header reproduction and I'm sure other stuff as well. Whether Richard works more behind the scenes or whatever, who cares? Whenever I called the GSCA I have been treated with respect and never had a bad taste in my mouth when I hung up. I do not race a ton, but ya know what? If I had to count on a payout to determine if the club is worth staying with, there must be something wrong. Not saying it cannot be improved, but can't everything? I may always be a late renewal member but I plan on renewing every year. The GSCA is the seed that started everything. Kind of like your mom and dad. You don't always agree with mom and dad but that doesn't mean they need to be trashed. Talk to them face to face or ear to ear. That shows more balls anyway.

 

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I am "young" guy in my early 30's coming back to a Buick from the world of Corvettes. I have attended several Nationals since I live here in BG and definetly tell the down-turn the event has taken. As great as V8 is in learning about the cars and what makes them go, having some sort of seminars might be a great idea. The Corvette events usually have seminars on maintenance, special projects, and history lessons on the cars and those who racedthem.

Also, how about a meet and greet? Other than a name and a avatar of the car, its hard to really get to know any of you guys. Building new relationship with some of us newer guys and passing on the excitement of the past could be the key to rebuilding the event.

I keep reading that many are upset with the leadership of the GSCA. I cant say I have any personal beef with anyone but I can say that no one in a "blue shirt and on a golf cart" stood out to me as someone in charge. I am not being disrespectful in any way, just saying that to most attendees it would be hard to know who to go to for questions or comments.

Just 2 cents from a newbie....

 

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good comments from the "newbie" .
> been to a few nat's - '99 in ohio and then a few after , '06 , '07 , '10 i think . not close enough to bother takin' the car - plus it's scattered around the shop normally . but i like going and checking things out and talkin etc . set up some vending stuff one year - that was work . i kinda like the october date/weather and BG is nice .
> need "regional" interest , regional OFFICIAL races , lower cost to get there and less time involved . maybe 4 or 5 ( NE , SE , SW , NW ? ) culminating in a final race to determine yearly class winners . this may make it feel more like a national happening all year not just a spotty event(s) . this may also encourage some extra ink from major mag's which in turn may/should help sponsorship money roll in ( = payout money ) .
> smaller tracks should welcome some new biz and younger car owners ( and not just members ) should be encouraged . maybe have the regional winners n runner-ups or whatever garner some perks for their efforts to help 'em make the yearend event - free hotel ? free entry fee ?
> i'm not in da know as far as the inner workings are concerned but i am kinda surprised at low car show turnout and spectator attendence at a "national" club event . maybe some extra effort towards local advertising to get a crowd in there . i know thats a pain sometimes but --- $$$ . and it may increase interest .
> that's all ------ just thinkin'

 

Re: GS Nationals dieing

V8buick.com NATIONAL meet. Right in the middle of the friggin' country. Drive it, tow it, pull it from the ocean/ woods and bring it. Anything with a tri-shield is welcome, any year. 3-5 day event.
Racing, trading, BS'ing, DRIVING, drinking, eating. Just having a good time with fellow Buick enthusiasts. Wouldn't that be nice???

This was my first time at the Nats. I was told almost immediatly that like anything, it ebbs and flows. Some years it's booming, some years it sux. Rain, cold air, wind= poor turn out. I went just to put faces to screen names and to hang out with a great group of people. Plus, saw some pretty fast cars go down the track.
I did the same for BPG GSX reunion a couple of years ago. First BPG event. Seemed the atmosphere was more relaxed. Hotel parking lots were FULL of Buick people until 2, 3, 4 AM. Any group welcomed you and offered a drink. You needed help? EVERYONE offered to help you.

Would have loved to have attended a GS Nats back in it's hayday....

 

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I attended this year and maybe a little down from the past two times I have gone. Things could probably be done better. But all and all good time.:beer

 

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Herb, did the Amish race their buggies?

 

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I attended the GS Nats faithfully from 1986-1996.
I became very dissatisfied at the last one I attended when after Driving my Buick for 12 hours & dealing with 2 days of rain culminating on Saturday Evening between Rain showers they managed to get to the Semi Finals. When a huge Rain Storm showed its ugly Head to cancel the Eliminations altogether. I was in the Staging Lanes (Yes I Was in the Semi's) only to return to my Pit Area to find that not only the Tracks Regular Saturday Night Street Race Crowd had been admitted to the Pits & my Tool Box was M.I.A.
The Locals who had parked near me of course had seen nothing!!
It was then that I realized that it was definitely a MONEY THING as the Track had Double Dipped not only having the GS Nats during the Day but had also planned on their regular Saturday Night Street Racer Event.
Have Not been back since!
I would love to attend the BPG Event (which I am also a member) but to drive my Buick for 10-11 Hours & sit in the Heat is not my Idea of Fun.
I also used to attend the GS Nats as a Vender but that went out the window when Vendor Prices went out of hand.
Doug

 

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Why is the GS Nationals dieing? To be honest, the reason is ME. And probably there are a lot more "ME's" out there.
My Story: I originally was only a GSCA member at large (back in the early 90's), then Finally went to the Nationals as a show participant in 96. Then I joined our local chapter in 98 when it was in Ohio. There were a lot more members; a lot more ACTIVE members then. (By the way, Carolina's Chapter hosts and sets up for the show on Friday.) I was alot more active with local events and the show tech, set-up, and parking set-up.
However, the company that I was employed with at that time went under, and I had to seek other employment. (Does this sound familiar to anyone?) My current job has a rotating schedule that seems to just about eliminate my active participation. (Some chapter members have even asked (jokingly, I hope!) if I still own any Buicks, as I even went to the few local events and the Nationals several times without driving a Buick there. At least I was helping for the good of the chapter and GSCA, I think.
So... long story short... What have YOU done to improve the GS Nationals? Do you even attend?

 

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Jim Rodgers is a good guy,puts forth a huge amount of effort,deals with some knuckleheads (me for one)...we would do well to keep him in our corner.
Now,back to your regularly scheduled debate...

 

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No but they were to busy trying to get John Massoud off the bottle (nitrous):3gears:

 

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One thread I'm sorry to read. I was fortunate enough to attend one Nat's in 97, the first year we had our GS. My wife and I took our daughter, 7 at the time, and had a good time. Didn't know a single person there but we managed! I was amazed at everything I saw. All day racing, parts all over, car show just packed, parade through town and oh yeah, the rain.

OK, why didn't I go back, hmmmm... I've never been a racer and over the years have been barely able to hold on to the GS. I've always been afraid to "break" it. I'm a car show guy, cruise nights and things like that. My one time there I felt like the event was really set up for racing, which I do enjoy watching.

I have the large photo of our GS rolling into Beech Bend over my desk and it's a great memory.

 

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My family had a big business for 80 Years,They felt they were the king of the industry,I knew different and saw a sinking ship.Its gone now. my point is th GSCA seems to feel the same way as my families old company did(RIP)
Richard i think is still mad at me for somthing 18yrs ago,I buried that hatchet long ago.They need to do more than just hope people come. MAKE PEOPLE FEEL WANTED !!!!!!!