Hey guys, I am new here and please bear with me if I am asking any questions that have been done to death. I have a 1971 Skylark in which I added the T/A stage 1 intake and Edelbrock carb along with the T/A 284 cam, Petronics ignition mod, new double timing chain, GS badging, hood, GSX hood stipes and tach. Problem: Have better power/torque, but not enough for what was done. Shop at a loss after many hours of going over everything. Seems to lack some low end and flattens out at about 2700-3000 even thought the cam specs say 1500-4000 rpms. Also seems to have a slight miss when you are cruising along at 2500 or so. I put a timing light on it and the timing mark on the balancer shows up about 2 1/2 inches BELOW the 0 mark?? Rev the engine, and the mark rises about 1 1/2 inches toward 0, but no more? Can the balancer be on wrong? spark plugs crossed? am I nuts??
Welcome to V8 Buick Read this thread and follow it exactly, and you will see an amazing difference. Your timing may be way off. Don't let your shop tell you to do anything different. Trust us. http://www.v8buick.com/showthread.php?t=63475&highlight=power+timing
That is a total fact. Try an open and a 4 hole spacer to see which one helps you out. Each one will change how the motor reacts.
Thanks much. If it was that far off, would it still run pretty strong?? It does run pretty well, just not as strong as it should? I would think if it was that off, it would run like crap??
It would or could run. Might overheat, and struggle some. There is a fairly wide range of timing and tuning that an engine will run. Now tune it for optimum performance. Read the timing thread all the way through. It's not hard to do, and will make a huge difference in that 350. Toss out the stock specs. Have fun with it.
I have a stock 350 and i run it at 12 Degree thats what it likes and a little more torque also that way.
None of this makes any sense to me at all. If the mark is 2 1/2 inches below the 0 on the tab, that is severely retarded timing, and I have a hard time believing the engine would even start, let alone run. Is the light connected to the #1 cylinder (Sorry, I have to ask). I would try another timing light. If the timing light is a dial back light, is the dial set at 0? Do you understand how to use a dial back light? My timing thread will help once you clear up this mystery. http://www.v8buick.com/showthread.php?t=63475
It's on the No.1 wire, but remember the part when you said "plug the vacuum advance..? Yeah, well it's plugged now! Man I'm dumb! Anywho... no with the light set at Zero, the mark is WAY up almost at the 12 o'clock position while the Zero timing mark is at about 2 o'clock. And that is at idle? When I revved the engine, the mark advanced even further. Looks like the initial timing is way too far advanced? When I dialed the light up, the mark didn't move very far? I am obviously doing something wrong here. Any help would be greatly appreciated. Does anyone know someone I could trust in the Tampa Bay area to check out this timing issue. I know it can't be right, but don't have a garage and for sure aren't the one who can figure this out. It runs good, but not "right" and I really want to get it done correctly before I hurt anything or just run around with it running like a 6 cyl.
I'd start back at square 1. Verify TRUE top dead center, both valves closed, piston at top dead center ON THE COMPRESSION STROKE, and rotor pointing at or VERY CLOSE to #1 terminal on the cap for #1 cylinder.
OK, with the vacuum advance disconnected and plugged, and the dial on the light set at 0, point the light at the balancer. Slowly turn the dial, and you will see the balancer mark move down. Keep turning the dial until the mark lines up with the 0 on the timing tab. Now read your idle timing off the dial. Have someone slowly rev the engine while you point the light at the balancer. The mark will move up further with increasing RPM. At some point it will stop moving up. Continue to turn the dial until the mark is again even with the 0 on the timing tab. Read your total timing off the dial. The timing tab doesn't move. Only the balancer mark moves as RPM increases.
I checked and all the plug wires are in the correct order on the distributor cap, but they are not in the right place based on a picture I found on this forum. Would the plug wires being in the wrong spot on the distributor make any difference with the timing or light? or as long as they are in the correct order, is everything ok?
Won't make any difference at all as long as the distributor was installed correctly. If you can adjust the timing to what you want by turning the distributor, you are fine.
dimes to dollars larry is right....bet the timing light is not on the #1 plug....can happen very easily. beyond that.....with virtually any aftermarket cam your gonna want more advanced timing. you need to mention if your pistons are stock ? ( comp ratio ) as this will tell alot with an aftermarket cam.....thus timing needs.
I would like to add that adding the e brock carb is ok however it is lkely under sized and choking off the engine at higher revs. A 750 cfm carb is min. for the 350. Also you will have the jet the carb to get the best results and this takes a tuning kit and time.
It's on the No. 1 plug wire, but maybe the timing light is bad, the operator is bad, or the timing may be WAY too advanced? Like I said, at idle, the timing mark on the balancer shows up WAY above the 0 on the tab, and only advances past that. When I dial the light up, the timing mark never moves more than an inch or so. Maybe it is the light?? I don't get any pinging under any throttle positions, so from what I have read, that shouldn't be a problem right? The cam is a T/A Performance 284 Product ID: TA_284-88H-350350H.475"-223'/.475"-230',110' It has stock pistons and I believe 8.5:1 compression if that sounds right. I was on the phone with the techs at T/A and they said they dyno tested and found the 600 is all the carb you need unless you are racing at high revs all the time? Everyone in the Buick world states you need 750, so I am thinking about putting on a Q-jet to see what happens. I just don't want to spend any more $$ until I know everything else is squared away first. The shop that did the work had to shim the valve after installing the cam to get ANY power at all from the engine, so I am wondering if this is where the problem may be?? They said the valve springs were not shot, but maybe a little soft, but that shouldn't hurt low rpm power should it? Also thinking about a new stall converter to get some low end, but again want to make sure all is well before spending the cash.
If you say that the motor will NOT ping or detonate under any load or throttle position then you for SURE are not way too advanced. Sounds to me more like WAY too far retarded. This in itself would make the motor really slugish, not want to start and have a very low power band. Does your motor when running get unusually warm ?.....
No pinging and runs nice and cool too? I do notice that when I stop for gas etc and only shut it down for a couple of minutes, it will not just start up unless I give it a little gas first. On initial cold start, it spins and starts fine. It just doesn't have any low end (barely even squeals the tires even with 3.73 gears and flattens out at about 2700 rpm. Like I said my shop played with it for a couple of weeks and could never figure it out. They just stopped doing anything when they got it running as good as it does now and asked me what I wanted them to do next $$$ to try and find out what is up.
I think I'd start at square one...... Remove the distributor, turn the motor over to #1 at TDC, and reinstall the distributor and wires correctly. I have a hunch that will get you back in the ball park. :laugh:
Your timing light isn't working correctly if you can't move the mark back to 0 by using the dial. Try a different light. If you have a vacuum gauge, put it on the engine and give us a reading fully warmed up at idle in Park. I'd also love to know who you talked with at TA that told you 600 CFM was enough.
