Good thing for us you don't charge by the question :eek2: BTW, looking at my build sheet you decoded Battery: R59 Energizer So we know for Fact Top Post, answer was there all along ou: DL
DL states, "answer was there all along" You can't go by that. There are no available reference books you can use to help decode Flint buildsheets. Pretty much the only way to figure out the manufacturer codes (Manifest codes) is to cross reference them against each other and deduce the answers. Then you get to add the fact that they often used the same letter code to designate parts that changed during the model year. (Now I am sure that GM sent out updates for these codes, but there are no "Rosetta Stones" out there that I know of.) All these codes do is "ID" the options. In your case it shows that the battery was a standard one for a 350 and was not upgraded to the heavy duty (455) battery. Therefore, being that I do not know for sure whether the batteries changed to the side post for late 71 cars, I left the designation the same as the early cars. You guys are now starting to see what it takes to find the answers to many of the questions asked on this board. It often takes a lot of research, and frequently involves looking at original cars as well as doing "book" research. If you want to know all the answers then you need to help with the research, and I will warn you, it often takes years to determine some answers. That is one of the reasons why my 71 Stage 1 GSX was not done years ago. I needed to get a few questions answered before I could start. Duane
Dave states, "I see GM part #s in book but is R89W correct for 455?" I don't know, do you have any way to cross reference the part number with the application codes? Duane
I have no way of cross referencing them however the 71 Service manual shows code R59 for a 350 and R69 for 455 and heavy duty cooling 350 which are top post #s. Anyone with a 72 service manual? This should show GM part # and "R" number on battery spec page. AC Delco site probably will not show the old stuff.
Remember my car is a small block. And the cables matched up to what Duane's former 350X had. Which was even a later build date. Perhaps that is the answer. My grill for instance was originally the darker argent color, and thats how I had it restored because it was original for "my car". Where I was apparently mistaken was thinking the final build sheet was an "absolute". I guess if we don't want to know the truth , don't ask ?:error: Us small block guys have it bad, no one is attempting to reproduce concours correct 350 parts, and I can understand why. At least on this topic I don't have to worry about the plastic block DL
DL, The question of top post/side mount for late 350 cars gets worse. The code for your neg cable "TL" 8904951 is not referenced in any of the 71 assembly manuals, but the 72 assembly manuals do reference were the old code "JS" 8904122 was changed to the new 72 style "JS" 8904973 with the pig tail. A later 72 manual also shows where the cable was changed to another number for a month (2/72-3/72) and was then changed back. That means that according to the assembly manuals your "TL" code cable doesn't exist, yet both your and Ritchies car have them. Go figure.................. Duane
Dave, The battery part numbers for the late 71 cars and the 72 cars are the same. So does anyone know what batteries the 72 cars came with? Duane
I do, what do you need to see? Also need to remember that the service manuals used the same diagrams form one year to the next sometimes so can't count on the details...
Tim, If you could check the battery spec. page(section 120 in71)there is a list of what battery was used with each application. The list shows the Long GM part # as well as the catalog number which may be R89W or something. Just looking for correct application fof a GS 455. This is the way they are listed in 71 anyway. Thanks
Tim R. Man, I don't believe that 72 list at all. If you look at the part numbers it shows #1980145 as being two different batteries. It also lists two different batteries for big-blocks, ie one for a 455 and another for a Stage 1, and the assembly manual only lists one battery for both applications. The 71 Chassis Service manual lists #1980145 as an "R89" for the 350 (45000) series cars. Duane
let me throw another wrench in the works.the y91 battery shows it to be bigger then the rest.does that mean it came with a bigger battery tray?or will the standard tray fit all?
"does that mean it came with a bigger battery tray?" Probably, and it is probably for the big cars also. For the top posts, the only difference between the small block & big block batteries was the height, and I believe this carried over to the side posts. That way the BB's had more cold crankng amps, but GM didn't need to change battery trays. Besides, in an A-body where would they put a bigger battery? Duane PS. What we are seeing here is another case where you cannot use the Chassis Service Manuals to determine the finer points of a restoration. That's not what they were designed to do.
This is all too weird. It still lists the R69 which is the same top post battery listed for 70-71?????????
Probably not relevant to your Buicks at all, but in the Olds world, in 1970 a plain Cutlass or F85 used an R59 battery, while a 442 used a considerably larger R71S battery. How did they make it fit? They moved the windshield washer resevoir to the other inner fender, and they put spacers under the battery tray and used a larger battery tray. The spacers lifted the tray just high enough so that the curve of the inner fender gave more clearance. The end result makes the negative battery terminal/cable almost touch the core support above it. All of this is shown in the Olds Assembly Manual, though we Olds nuts face the same problem you Buick guys do: the assembly manual lists a GM part number for the batteries but not the shorthand Delco number.
Like Duane has been saying, the Assembly Manual is the last word in what parts were used (though it's difficult to figure out exactly what the revisions were and when they actually took effect). But I've got a couple of Delco Remy manuals/catalogs from the era. While these were used at the parts counter, not assembly line, they may shed more light. The Delco TBA Parts Manual (will someone please tell me what "TBA" stands for?), dated May, 1971, says that a 1971 Buick Special/Skylark (ie, all A-bodies) with a 455 V-8 used R69 if it needed top terminals or R89S if it needed sealed (side) terminals. There is an asterisk next to the R89S which refers to a footnote saying that Police and Taxi use should use an R89W. The Delco Energizer Battery Wholesaler Catalog, dated January, 1973, says that a 1971 Buick Special/Skylark/Century with 455 V-8 uses a top terminal R69. It doesn't list any side terminals! However, this is an obvious error, as the table does list side terminal replacements for 1970 and earlier (obviously needs the cable adapters) and for 1972. For these other years, the recommended sealed terminal replacement is R89S, though R89 and R89W are also listed. This same wholesaler catalog lists the following data for these batteries: _R69____R89____R89S___R89W ------------------------------------ __11_____11_____13_____15____Plates per cell 3150___2900___3250___3750____Peak Watts at 0 deg F __70_____61_____62_____80____20-hour rating in Amp Hours _380____350____420____465____Cold cranking Amps at 0 deg F _290____270____310____375____Cold cranking Amps at -20 deg F 10.25__10.25__10.25__10.25____Length _6.81___7.00___7.00___7.00____Width _9.5____8.75___8.75___8.69____Height _4.8____4.0____4.0____4.8_____Quarts of electrolyte 52.95__46.95__50.95__57.50____List Price No separate mention of GS, Stage 1, or high-output engines are made in these two catalogs.
