I wrote a big essay earliar and when I hit send it said error. I am trying to get a tig welder to make 350 race intakes. I don't have the money. We can convert Chrysler intakes to Buick plates but Sean thinks that's alot of work and Sean you are probably right cause I havn't done it. I need to do something to build this 350 because I said it will run 10.99. If you read Seans thread about the guy running stock cars it was fast but the rods couldn't hold up to the power of the Buick small block made. I need a tig welder or a spool gun for my miller 210. I think the indiana oxygen wants 800 for the spool gun and the tig is more than that. I would rather have the tig for all the right reasons if you know what I mean. If any of you 350 power hungary Buick lovers are out there let me know because I'm ready to devote my life to all Buick. Big or small block.
With the $1200 connecting rods you have and the forged pistons allong with the ported heads and huge camshaft the engine should run hard in the high RPM and it should be reliable. A single plane intake is the key to getting the high RPM potential from the combo, I think. Sure the stock rods had a tough time over 6500 RPM and when over 500 HP but your rods will hand much more. The easy way to get a kick but intake for a high RPM 350 is this... Take a Poston intake, gut the center divider and make it a single plane: Pics here of "MHGS"s poston 350 intake modified like I describe above I would not say it is "too" much work to cut up a mopar intake to fit it is just a lot of work and it does not seem like much more work to start from scratch in my mind but whatever works. Here is a well done intake that looks pretty darm good. In this thread you can see what all i s involved in the mopar intake cut appart to fit on a Buick 350: http://www.v8buick.com/showthread.php?224127-Intake&highlight=poston+intake+mods Hereis the intake Mark Burton built for me, should work well:
I see more work grinding out that intake instead of making a hot performance sheetmetal or transfering the Chrysler since you will be working on it every night and day so the gains in the Chrysler or making your own will be greater in comparison to making the Poston work.
Do not underestimate the challenge of mating a hand made intake to the engine. As someone who has done it, I can tell you from experience that things do not work out the way you expect the first time around. To be realistic about it, you would be best served to just assume that you will scrap the first one for any number of reasons. Warpage is a very large problem so just as one example (and probably the most severe one), if you think you can just bolt everything to an old block and heads and weld it up, that probably isn't going to work out real well the first time you try it. You have to remove the assembly to make the underside welds and attach the valley pan, and when you do that the warpage is very likely to require more metal removal at the flanges to get flat mating surfaces than a standard gasket will compensate for. In addition the two flanges need to be machined evenly for the ports and bolt holes to attach properly. Also the bolts do not go in at a 90 degree angle so every time the flanges are milled the bolt holes move upwards in the flange. Since the warpage is probably not going to be the same on both sides you will not have a fixed starting point to determine the amount of metal to be milled off, so initial cuts will have to be made, after which the port match will have to be checked and the next cut estimated, bearing in mind the target gasket thickness. It can be done, but don't expect it to be simple or easy, and if you are counting on your local machine shop to do it just be sure you have a really good machinist and leave him plenty of metal to work with. This probably means shimming the heads up on the block before you start. Just a helpful hint that might save your project, you can thank me later. Jim
Good to know Jim. That's the big problem in welding. I need to weld the 12 Bolt before I put it in the Buick and I keep thinking about the warpage. Some guys say a little here and a little there and it won't move but that still scares me. Bill says he has a rod, and he showed me that he puts in the rearend before he welds the tubes. I keep thinking I'm going to make something but I havn't yet.
Typically a turbo engine will benefit from a larger plenum volume, this helps add to the gump capacity of boosted air under the carb or throttle body. The bottom line is that with turbochargers you can run a stock intake on a 350 and make 550 HP pretty easy, if you swap on a nice big custom intake like mine you might be able to make about 600 HP without any extra boost. The turbo engine will run well even without much plenum volume, with a turbo (s) sized for high RPM you could easilly make a 350 breath at 7500 RPM with a stock intake manifold. More wear an tear on the engine this way with the high RPM and less lower RPM torque though. When running naturally aspirated the larger plenum volume is much more important or needed to get good high RPM power. For my application I am using a nice mild camshaft and and conservative sized turbos that give me great power from 2800 RPM to 6000 RPM and if I can meet my goals at the track shifting at 5600 RPM then great there will be even less wear and tear on the engine. ---------- Post added at 03:59 PM ---------- Previous post was at 02:12 PM ---------- Here you go, just buy this car... It already has the custom single plane intake: http://cgi.ebay.com/ebaymotors/Buic...ars_Trucks&hash=item337fc7e190#ht_1652wt_1167
Making the poston into a single plane I spent no more than 5 hours of machine time and blending of the jb weld it took to fill the new shapes. I WILL warn you though that with this new manifold and the large plenum your rpm power range is gonna go through the roof starting at 3500 or so....I"M also telling you that with the manifold , ported large valve heads and the cam I have it wants to fly through 6k rpm.
I would love to see any type of manifold for the 350 made but I also think a stock appearing single plane would be awesome!
I would love to be at the starting line the first time out with the 350. with a 5000 stall a 1050 Dominator, and when I nail the throttle without wheelie bars the rpms shoot up to 7500 and I have to shift before the front tires hit the ground , and hope they do, and go through 2nd to 7500 and through the traps at 7200 and run a 10.50. I think I will shut it off at the ticket booth and wait for my golfcart to come and get me so i can rellish the moment! Then get it back to the trailer and check for leaks because I might be wondering how fast it will go next round. That would be living in the SBB life!
What rpm range was the X-factor designed for? The short runners suggest high rpm, but the lack of plenum would negate that would it not or am I missing something? Was there ever a dyno or track comparison done between a stock manifold and the X-factor, I can't remember and couldn't find anything with search.
It kinda looks like this intake was designed so the boost can be shut off faster when the throttle is released,and the boost can be diverted through the blowoff valve,and the plenum can depressurize much faster?And maybe the idea behind the smaller plenum is to increase air velosity?And with the smaller plenum,turbo lag wouldn't be as long because the air is forced into the cylinders faster? This is all a guess on my part,I'm more of a machinist than a engineer. Sean,can you answer why the plenum is so small on this intake? Or maybe Mark Burton can,if he reads this? Another question I would have is why are the runners on an angle instead of being flat under the throttle mounting surface? It seems like that V design under the induction inlet would flow the air to the bottom of the V first,and the air volume increases the air works its way up to go down the runners?(to come to this conclusion,I imagned how water would flow into the throttle opening,the more water that is poured in,the higher it will be on the runners,and the more area it would use to flow downward as the volume increases) In other words,the air has to go upwards,and sideways and make a slight turn to find its way down the runners,instead of straight down. And it looks like part of the runner is blocked by the mounting flange,sort of(is that to keep the pressure off the bottom of the throttle blades as the plenum gets full?). None of what I wrote is meant to criticize the intake,but rather to understand it. I know it is proven to make power,and it looks great,I'm just curious why it was designed this way. :TU:
Mark is the one who can answer all those questions about the design of the X factor, I will e-mail him and ask him to have a look at this thread when he has time. I did have some dyno testing done with an early version of the X factor and it was much better than the ported TA intake. The current intake design is WAY different and in my opinion much better though so there is no point in looking at the numbers off the old testing. I do not feel the need to prove my intake is better than stock, I am happy with it and will run it without concern about how much power it adds to the engine. Under boost the engine will make a crap laod of power anyways so I just plan to make sure the plugs are all burning evenly and then watch the air/fuel ratio and exhaust temps.:TU:
I thought this manifold was originally designed for N/A, but I may be wrong since Mark was already building is turbo engine. I had similar thoughts as 300sbb. Also I'm not being critical, just curious and trying to learn. Mark Burton a lot of very good work for the SBB.
Howdy folks, as Sean said I was asked to chime in. Before that though, I wanted everyone to know I recent had a substantial stroke, and am not going to be offering more shop services, machine work, welding etc. I announced the closing of the shop on my website. Bear with me if this is written odd in places. Speech issues were among the problems. X factor is not a huge calculated science marvel. I didn't go school for fluid dynamics and physics. I looked at features tend to have intakes behave certain ways, and designed it based on a few simple ideas. The idea of the small plenum, was to have it act almost like a dual plane, but with the runners right under the bores of the carb. The long thin runners were an attempt of high velocity, but big flow potential. No pulses, no hemiholtz or whattever. All this crap guys throw around car forums like it the gospel when ones one that are actually doing something talk little. Maybe I got lucky, but it worked exactly as I planned. Great response at low speeds, screamed through the tach. It pleases me to hear those who give me credit for efforts for Buicks. I bled that stuff for 6 years and got so much lip, judgement, ridicule. Seems like most had it all figured out better in their minds. Things like the turbos are wrongs, the manifolds are cheeze, the bonnets, blah blah blah. My advice is to anyone wants to build something for their car, and thinks somebody is going to prove them wrong, BUILD IT! Trust your gut, your research, build it your way. If I had listened to everyone who knocked my designs all the years, I wouldn't have had the car run like I got to see it. It is a friggin beast, from smooth mellow idle, to tire wrecking though the gears. Read less forums, and listen to racers, and the guys that have the cars like everyone else wishes their ran like. Okay, I'm tired now. Later.
So sorry to hear about your health problems Mark Life is too short,and this goes to show how insignificant the car hobby is God Bless you and prayers for you and your family, and i sincerely hope you are able to move forward through all of this Wish i were closer and could do more If there is anything i can do let me know I enjoyed our converstations in the past and look forward to more Again God Bless Nick
Mark,I'm so sorry to hear about your health issues.From what I could see on the internet,you are a very talented machinist,and your services,and contributions to the Buick community will be missed!
I'm very sorry to here about your health problems Mark and wish you a speedy recovery! Thank you for explaining your design, it makes sense. Another example of seat of the pants engineering triumphing. If there hadn't been people who thought up new ways to do things like you have done hot rodding would never have happened. I wonder how many pioneers in our sport were ridiculed for their ideas back in the day? Again I hope you for your recovery.
First off a disclamer: I do not mess with the Buick 350 because I think it is the best engine in the world. I do this because I have had a passion for this underdog the past 13 years... The next car I build will have a LS engine with twin turbos, MPFI, and all the goodies.. It will run 8 second quarter miles and drive nice on the street. Today I made about $2000 at work so there is more to this that trying to make a poor running engine run well. I will still keep my Turbo Skylark and a few other Buicks around do not worry, I am not a sell out. The goal of my projects is to make the best of an engine with no aftermarket support and very little recognition. Back to the topic of intakes: I know Mark is tired and did not want to go into details on his design but believe me this was not just a shot in the dark design. Mark does things properly and always does his research with these things. I had a quote for $3200 from Hogan to build me an intake and I was able to have Mark build an intake that is as good if not better than what Hogan would have built me and I payed WAY less than that. Mark has read books and done a ton of research on these type of things and I appreciate the hard work he has provided this hobby of ours! This pic shows the intake from the top and this is a straight shot to the cylinders compared to the stock intake. The stock intake is a pancake piece of crap that takes the air and fuel runs it into a floor then puts it down 8 un-even runners around a few corners and to the heads. No wonder the 1021 HP Buick 350 used a 4" spacer on the stock ported intake, the need for fuel and air atonization was required. Still no where near as good as my intake in my opinion. I am using exhaust temp gauges on all 8 cylinders to help make sure the tune is on spot and each cylinder is happy. Also cutting apart spark plugs to read them will be a part of the tuning plan. If others can build a better intake then great, let see it... Myself I have no need to even try to prove my intake is better than others. I just need to make mine work and have the fastest Buick 350 powered street car on the earth.... And if it blows I have 20 spare engines to work with, an obsession that took over my life till I got married LOL.... Glad I had a barn full of cars and engines before I met her LOL.... The last lady said it is me or the cars.... And attached is a pic of a $3000 intake that has the same type of V shape under the runners:
