What should the ampere meter read during driving on a 1958 Super?

Ok guys,

Here is a question for the electric experts out there (which excludes me obviously): what should the ampere meter read during driving?
At idle with no auxilliary equipment (like lights, fan or radio), the reading is slightly above "O" (towards charging). However, as soon as I rev the engine up or drive around, the needle goes close to "C" (see pic - sorry, its a bit blurry but I had to focus on traffic as well).
My question is if this is normal or do I have a problem with the battery or the voltage regulator? It seems like my battery is on its last leg as it will barely start the engine. As soon as I attach a booster, the car starts immediately. I also noticed that my battery is constantly "bubbling" even when it is completely disconnected.

Also, is the pressure reading for the oil supposed to be that high? I was cruising at a constant speed when the picture was taken.

Any ideas or advice is greatly appreciated.

Thanks,
Chris

 

The amperage will depend on the load demand at the time.A fully charged battery should not read as high as yours.
Looks to be overcharging which would also explain the battery boiling.Put a voltmeter on it while it's running & report back.

 

Ok, stupid question: measure the voltage where? At the battery, at the voltage regulator? If on the voltage regulator, where exactely?
As I said, give me something mechanical to fix and I know what I am doing, but with the electric...

Thanks,
Chris

 

Sounds like your regulator is stuck. The ammeter should read what you are charging. In this case it appears to be overcharging, do the gauge is reading high. You can rule out a bad generator based on the fact that it's throwing out lots of energy, but it won't last long, charging like that. I don't remember how to adjust a voltage regulator, it has been too long. Maybe someone with a manual can chime in.

 

I'm glad I came across this thread....

I was at the same place Chris.
My ammeter would read charge too much. If, I rap the voltage regulator with my knuckles it would calm down for a while... Then I would have to through it again.
So, I went to NAPA and for $100 they had a new regulator. It worked fine for a few days... now it won't allow the generator to charge up the battery. I'm riding around with discharge showing all the time...

So, I'm subscribed to this thread . Maybe there'll be an answer for me, too...

I've got a manual. It's a little vague on adjustment...

 

Egad, I haven't adjusted a regulator since the '60s. Now I KNOW I'm gettin' old. I looked for a bit on the intertubes, but found nothing of substance.

Hang tough, someone here has a manual and can help...

 

Yep,,, it is a voltage regulator problem,,,, they either stick and overcharge or dont come in and undercharge.... I aint no good on electrical stuff, but a very good source is the old motors manual for your year car... it shows everything about it that you will ever need to know... every time i go to a wrecking yard, i get the regulators.. because they are one of the common things on all gm cars....
the best , easiest thing to do is take the car to a shop that specializes in electrical stuff and get them to install a new one and ''set'' it to spec.... and it has to be warmed up before you set it...... or it wont be right.....
And when you turn the key on, the needle should swing off of center and go slightly to the discharge side, depending on how many accessories you have on... then when you hit the starter it should take a significant swing more to discharge and when the engine fires , it should instantly swing over to the charge side and then slowly drop back toward center and finally settle down just to the charge side a little.... usually about the width of the needle ......

 

What Doc says. Sadly, I do have a Motor's Manual that does give the procedure. Sadly, because it's on my mancave bookshelf 1,500 miles from here. Sorry. BTW: Those Delco regulators are top-quality. My airplane is still on it's original Delco regulator (same as a GM car) It left the factory in 1956. I was spinning wrenches in the 60s into the 80s. We replaced (I'm guessing) 25 Ford and AMC regulators for every GM one. Actually, the ratio was probably even higher then that. The Generator-equipped Mopars were almost as reliable as the GMs.

 

At the battery.Years ago i adjusted a few,but we had a specific regulator load tester to do it on.Never seen that kind of tester since.It was huge!!! Size of a 27" tube style TV.:shock: Setting regulators is a lost art,very few rebuilders do it anymore.

 

ou: duh! So, it's not enough just to throw a new one on there.... I have to adjust it before it'll work right? For trouble-shooting, the Buick shop manual just says if your not getting a charge, to bench test the generator.
It does give a real good explanation of how the regulator works. The description put me in mind of a water meter system for a large building. A low flow meter (voltage regulator), a high flow weter (current regulator) and back flow preventer (cut out).

I've still got the Original Delco. It was replaced with NAPA unit in 1975. So a new one, every 20 to 40 years is not too bad....

Seems, I have a Motors Manual around some where.......

---------- Post added at 05:44 PM ---------- Previous post was at 05:03 PM ----------

Yep. I found my Motors Manual. And it's got a chapter on Delco vibrating voltage regulator. Trouble the print date is 1943. So the voltage is for 6 volt system. Could I use the the same gaps specified and Double the voltage specified?
For example;
on the cut out
Air gap 0.20 inch
points open at 0v-4v (double to 0v-8v)


gaps close at 6.9v - 7.9v (double to 13.8v to 15.8v)

?

 

you measure the voltage at the battery .... and the amps too....
Motors shows the ammeter hooking from the batt terminal of the regulator to the battery....
And the voltmeter connecting at the batt terminal of the regulator to ground......
you need to operate the engine at medium rpm when you are taking measurements.....

 

Ok, so I finally had the time to start it back up and I have 14V at high idle and 14V at low idle (once the engine has warmed up). I assume the reading should be 12V?
I looked through the manual and found a lot of information that doesn't make sense to me. Is there a simple description of how to set the voltage regulator correctly?

Chris

 

book gives 14.3 at the battery.....:Brow:

 

I was about to say that 14.4 is the normal maximum charging voltage. I would check this at an RPM that approximates a cruising speed - perhaps 2,000 to 2,500 RPM. A lead-acid battery usually (at absolutely full charge) will test at 2.1 to 2.2 volts per cell. No insult intended (I assume that you can do basic multiplication) but that's 12.6 to about 13.2 volts.

 

It is a common misconception that a 12V battery is actually 12 Volts. As Doc has mentioned, the Voltage of each cell is actually 2.1 Volts. People have rounded that off over the years to say that it is a 12V battery, while it is really 12.6 Volts when fully charged. Another example of this is with your smaller batteries. Measure a fresh AA or AAA or C or D cell with a good voltmeter. They are 1.55 Volts when new. Again, people call them 1.5 Volt batteries. It's kind of a shorthand, but not technically correct.

 

Well,,, I looked the spec up in a 1961 Motors manual......:laugh:

 

Well, I guess I am back to square one...
So if the voltage is ok could the amperage still be off? Is there a way to find that out? Would that also be a voltage regulator problem or would this be a generator problem?
The manual says something about the battery using an excessive amount of water (which mine does as it constantly bubbles and "sweats" fluid through the fill plugs) when the cutout relay is not set properly. I still would need to find a 1/2 ohm, 25 watts resistor to perform this check, but maybe this is something radio shack has.
Could it be that it is my "shot" battery that causes the high ampere reading? Should I just get a new one and check if the problem remains?

Again, any help is appreciated. Does anyone know a specialist in the Hampton Roads area that could check it? I know that if I go into a modern shop they will look in vain for a diagnostic port to hook up their computer...

Thanks,
Chris

 

Lets keep it simple. If the battery is bubbling and using water, it is overcharging.

 

Yep,,, gotta be,,,, i would suspect a faulty gage.....:Smarty:

 

A bad battery can very well be causing your problems. If it is slow cranking and bubbling as you said i would be sure to make a battery replacement the 1st thing to do before making more tests. A low battery will make the gen charge higher to keep it full. The voltage seems to be in range, so the reg may be fine. Retest after battery replacement.