So now they want to charge one of our brave soldiers with murder..........

I can't believe I got suckered into this one....

Truzi, what do you call sending $25,000 to the families of Pal. car bombers? :af: You missed your calling, you should have gone into LAW & become a defense lawyer. p

Every single body on the ground should have a bullet (or two) in the head, whether or not the body is moving. One exception, is IF they are waving a white flag. In that case proceed very carefully... The end. :Smarty:

Everyone wants the war to end, but you have to WIN it first, and it looks like one city at a time! The job has to be finished. Our troops are doing a great job. Keep it up! :TU:

Yeah, I have family over there. My nephew was ROTC, graduated with honors, went straight to Navy seal training. :jd:

Spent his tour over there, and getting ready to go back (with vigor). I've never been more proud of him, and ALL the others that Willingly risk their lives. Secondly, I'm proud of ALL the other troops there fighting for Us , even though they might not be there because they wanted to be. :TU:

I'm also proud of the people supporting our gov. with the war, and thoroughly disgusted with the rest of you. :Smarty:

 

Wounded Troops Describe Fight
USA TODAY
November 16, 2004

LANDSTUHL, Germany - Four U.S. servicemen wounded last week in the Iraqi city of Fallujah on Monday described intense fighting with a skilled enemy, adept at markmanship and rigging booby traps.

The three Marines and an Army soldier were among 419 patients admitted to the U.S. military hospital here since the beginning of an offensive into Fallujah on Nov. 8. Most of the new patients are from that fighting.
The injured troops told reporters that Fallujah's streets were filled with booby traps. They said masked men with automatic rifles and grenade launchers targeted Americans with the aid of spotters who told them where the U.S. forces were located.


Despite the difficult conditions, the men said they remain committed to finishing the task the U.S. forces set out to do in Iraq. "It's part of our job, to help the Iraqi people get their freedom," Chapman said. All four servicemen will be sent home soon to recuperate, but they say it's hard to leave their comrades back in the field. "I'd go back (to Iraq) in a heartbeat," Chapman said. He was hit while on patrol in the turret of a Humvee. After an Iraqi national guardsman was shot by a sniper, Chapman scanned nearby rooftops and windows through the scope on the wire-guided missile launcher he operates. A sniper's bullet hit under Chapman's helmet, temporarily blinding him.
The bullet cracked Chapman's skull, but he said doctors told him he has no brain damage. "Everybody says I'm lucky, and I'll go with that," he said

 

WOW! You had me for a minute until you got to the stabbing of Fox News! :laugh:

What don't you see as fair and balanced about it? There are all sorts of libs and right wingers and everybody in between interviewed constantly on that channel. Everybody has a voice if they choose to come on.

No other network in the United States does this. If it seems slanted, it could be you. o No:

While some people may hate O'Reilly, (probably because he asks the tough questions and doesn't let people dance around it with BS answers) he welcomes anyone to come on and give their side. Plus, the important thing is, it's live and un-edited. What you see is what you get. No sound bites like the other propaganda news station where you couldn't get a fair shake if your life depended on it unless you were liberal.

 

Al Jazeera

Nailhead67,
have you seen the english language version of Al Jezeera's report?

http://english.aljazeera.net/NR/exeres/CA613824-B948-4CF8-B17E-B9E55674A925.htm

I checked it out because I suspected exactly what you are saying.... that the Arab press would spin it as negatively as possible. I don't read the original language Al Jazeera is written in. I do not know if there are two different spins put out.... but their coverage in English of this item seems pretty fair/objective based upon what I have heard and seen in the Western Media.

For comparison here is the CNN version:

http://edition.cnn.com/2004/WORLD/meast/11/15/marine.probe/

 

I wouldn't give Al J. the satisfaction of even reading their terrorist, islamic biased website......they can print in any language they want to, it's still a crock of slanted propaganda.

Ken, my beef with Fox news is the same beef I have with all the news networks.......they find one story and milk it for all they can get from it........I've heard about Scott Peterson until I want to puke. It was Kobe Bryant before that, Micheal Jackson before that, and the list goes on. OJ went on for over 2 years. Then they assemble a "panel of experts" that we can listen to who try to predict the future every night........I only know this b/c network television is so lousy, there's nothing else to watch unless I want to see the Leave it to Beaver re runs.

One other thing that bugs me about Fox is Hannity and Colmes.......Sean Hannity is so outspoken and hardnosed but Colmes is too soft. Sometimes I'd like to get behind him and kick him in the arse and tell him to speak up. :spank: Half the time the guests on these shows all talk at once and I can't make head or tail out of what they are trying to say anyway........the CNN shows are the worst (crossfire). Sometimes I think if I wasn't so concerned about what's happening I'd just turn the TV off and listen to the radio. :bglasses:

 

The Whole Story

Where are the cameras for the schools, hospitals and playgrounds the soldiers are fixing up ( hammer in one hand & machine gun in the other ) ? Why isn't the good being shown ? Why ? ---- because THAT stuff doesn't sell. Plain & simple. Bless all of our troops wherever they serve.And thank the veterns for fighting for the freedom to speak our minds, in english.

 

They're doing the same thing we would be doing if we were invaded, is it that big of a surprise?!

I'm the opposite I guess then. I support our troops 110%, just not the guy sitting in the big comfy chair thousands of miles away who's sending people to die for what he thinks is right.

 

Who do you let "see" for you?

This is not Political. Maybe it is just a statement of the obvious.

Everytime you turn on the TV or Radio you are allowing someone else to give you their view. No one says you have to believe it! Based upon what I have read in this thread there are some people who would line up and drink Jonestown Koolaid if the right individual told them to.

Nailheadina67:

"I wouldn't give Al J. the satisfaction of even reading their terrorist, islamic biased website......they can print in any language they want to, it's still a crock of slanted propaganda."

If you read it with your eyes open what are you afraid of? Do you think your mind is so weak that they might convince you to blow up a building?

Then " Sometimes I think if I wasn't so concerned about what's happening I'd just turn the TV off and listen to the radio."

If you are so convinced that the media is full of crap, and you don't trust yourself to sort out the BS from something plausible, what good would any of these media outlets do for you?

 

Now THAT's funny! :TU:

 

Henry,

I see no one has answered your obvious questions. They are the same thoughts that I have regarding Iraq. With a situation like we have in Iraq, there can be no winners. This is especially true for those young men and women who have enlisted into our armed forces. They shouldn't be put into this sort of policing operation. They can't win because they can't tell the "enemy" from the normal citizen. No doubt the British would have called the rag tag 1776 Revolutionay forces insurgents!

The problem of defining the enemy arose when 9/11 occured. I wrote my congressmen and begged that the events of that terrible September morning be treated as a crime and not mislabeled as an act of war. Bush vowed to find those responsible and make them pay. Ahh, George, this was a suicide attack. They're already dead dude! Still, a criminal investigation should have been done and any remaining conspirators or perpetrators captured, tried, and rightfully convicted. Someone on this thread already suggested there was no difference between 12/7 and 9/11. Friend, there is a big difference. The attack on 12/7 was the result of a desperate nation taking action. The attack on 9/11 was the result of desperate individuals of a religious based organization. No nation declared war on the United States of America!

Some might say that certain nations were harboring terrorists and that is true. Should we bomb Florida where they were last "harbored"? Bush, and those pushing the New World Order agenda, were more than happy to twist the events of 9/11 into a war for the progression of their agenda. Once again, I will add that this war is not about the oil, 9/11, or WMD. It is a struggle for good of Israel and the furtherance of the New World Order. It's as plain as the red nose on Clinton's lying face! When are most folks going to wake up and smell the coffee? These Republicrats will sell you out every time. Look at how quickly they will sell out this young soldier! He is just a pawn as are most of us.

Perhaps this sounds a little sarcastic but it is rightfully so. The reality of the situation deserves a realist. These young men and women should have never been sent to the middle east. We have absolutely no business on their soil! It is an unjust war to say the least. Henry is right - we've got to get out now. I've suggested it before on this board only to be ridiculed. That is ok with me. I hope we can return to some political threads as they really are just current events and as such can't be completely avoided.

Henry's offered up the reason and the solution for a pull out in Iraq. He is right on the $$$$$. Those that found fault with me in the past mentioned time and time again how the US will lose face. Bull hockey! Look, we have to leave Iraq sometime unless you want to make the darn place the 51st state or some kind of colony. We will still be the only real superpower of the world if we pull out of there {until the communist monster China finally passes us up due to corporate greed}. We left 'Nam with our tails between our legs, and at the time we were one of two superpowers locked into a cold war. We seemingly still prevailed in the global sense against the USSR. If we walk away from Iraq, it can't be considered a loss. We weren't defeated by anyone. We will however, continue to be attacked as long as we are there as the policemen. It can't work. It won't work. For every "insurgent" you kill you'll make ten enemies. The Israelis pound Palestinians everyday. Their harsh and brutal retaliatory attacks only brew more attacks by the Palestinians. What good can come of that? If no one is willing to stop the killing, then I sincerely worry for my 7, 11, and 12 year old sons because this war will surely be ongoing when they turn 18. By then, the draft will be mandatory!

Of course, and this has already been hashed over a few times by the pundits on this board, we could just NUKE 'em. Yea, that is a great idea. We save them from their evil dictator by blasting them off the face of the earth. It is a typical warhawk reaction much like like the mentality of "freeing" the Dividians at Waco with a massive military assualt. I wish Henry were running this country right now. On the other hand, I value him on this board. If he were president, he would probably be taken out by the "NUKE 'ems".

I wish more people with commonsense were more commonplace. Way too many are drinking establishment KoolAid. ou:

 

from a Marine in the 11th MEU:

This is one story of many that people normally don't hear, and one that everyone does.
This is one most don't hear:
A young Marine and his cover man cautiously enter a room just recently filled with insurgents armed with Ak-47's and RPG's. There are three dead, another wailing in pain. The insurgent can be heard saying, "Mister, mister! Diktoor, diktoor(doctor)!" He is badly wounded, lying in a pool of his own blood. The Marine and his cover man slowly walk toward the injured man, scanning to make sure no enemies come from behind. In a split second, the pressure in the room greatly exceeds that of the outside, and the concussion seems to be felt before the blast is heard. Marines outside rush to the room, and look in horror as the dust gradually settles. The result is a room filled with the barely recognizable remains of the deceased, caused by an insurgent setting off several pounds of explosives.

The Marines' remains are gathered by teary eyed comrades, brothers in arms, and shipped home in a box. The families can only mourn over a casket and a picture of their loved one, a life cut short by someone who hid behind a white flag.

But no one hears these stories, except those who have lived to carry remains of a friend, and the families who loved the dead. No one hears this, so no one cares.

This is the story everyone hears:

A young Marine and his fire team cautiously enter a room just recently filled with insurgents armed with AK-47's and RPG's. There are three dead, another wailing in pain. The insugent can be heard saying, "Mister, mister! Diktoor, diktoor(doctor)!" He is badly wounded. Suddenly, he pulls from under his bloody clothes a grenade, without the pin. The explosion rocks the room, killing one Marine, wounding the others. The young Marine catches shrapnel in the face.

The next day, same Marine, same type of situation, a different story. The young Marine and his cover man enter a room with two wounded insurgents. One lies on the floor in puddle of blood, another against the wall. A reporter and his camera survey the wreckage inside, and in the background can be heard the voice of a Marine, "He's moving, he's moving!"

The pop of a rifle is heard, and the insurgent against the wall is now dead. Minutes, hours later, the scene is aired on national television, and the Marine is being held for commiting a war crime. Unlawful killing.

And now, another Marine has the possibility of being burned at the stake for protecting the life of his brethren. His family now wrings their hands in grief, tears streaming down their face. Brother, should I have been in your boots, i too would have done the same.

For those of you who don't know, we Marines, Band of Brothers, Jarheads, Leathernecks, etc., do not fight because we think it is right, or think
it is wrong. We are here for the man to our left, and the man to our right. We choose to give our lives so that the man or woman next to us can go home and see their husbands, wives, children, friends and families.

For those of you who sit on your couches in front of your television, and choose to condemn this man's actions, I have but one thing to say to you. Get out of your recliner, lace up my boots, pick up a rifle, leave your family behind and join me. See what I've seen, walk where I have walked. To those of you who support us, my sincerest gratitude. You keep us alive.

I am a Marine currently doing his second tour in Iraq. These are my opinions and mine alone. They do not represent those of the Marine Corps or of the US military, or any other.

Link to sourcehttp://www.powerlineblog.com/

 

I got suckered in here too............

I have a very simple question for all here that are "discussing" this Marine and his actions ?

" HOW MANY OF THOSE THAT HAVE POSTED HERE, HAVE BEEN IN A MILITARY BRANCH AND SERVED IN A COMBAT SITUATION ?? "

I spent 8 years in the Navy. Went to the Gulf the first go round. But I haven't been directly in a combat situation............That means that I feel like I have NO opinion in regards to this and will keep my mouth shut about what is going on over there.

Yall want to think about something FINE !!!!!!!!!!!!!

Within the last , oh, say 10 days. Some, oh, say 20 year old KID got killed so some can sit here, NEVER serve the country they claim to love in any way shape or form, and complain about anything and everything that is happening from the comfort of home.............................

You know................your HOME.................that place that the above mentioned 20 year old will never get to see again.

Posts like this to some extent make me feel ashamed of being American, my service in gulf, my honorable discharge, and my good conduct medals.

I served my country proudly overseas. I have never seen combat.........

I AM NOT ENTITLED TO HAVE AN OPINION IN REGARDS TO THIS MATTER !!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

 

With those last few posts,I believe this thread should end.

 

we have gone for six pages without anyone insulting anyone. i hope we can let this stay as long as no one gets nasty.

for the record, in the 15 years i spent with the navy dept. i handled countless secret documents every day. i took an oath to defend this country from all enemies foreign and domestic. and i was prepared to fight to the death to keep those secrets out of enemy hands. i cant compare my time there with that of those in combat, just saying that i pledged to give my life for my country if needed. that is the same today as it was 22 years ago.

there is a difference between supporting country, supporting the troops, and supporting a president. i support the first two.

henry white

 

Im not trying to attack you. I understand what you mean by a foreign country coming into your country and fighting etc. However, in that country they had a dictator who was feared by his people. He gased and killed thousands of his own people.. Now some country comes in and tries to liberate Iraq and make people be free and not affraid. The citizens will help and be glad once the deed is done.

To compare this to America being invaded is just silly. We are free here, and do not fear our government or military. No matter how bad you think your life is here, most likely you can realize that it is most likely much better than your life would be had you lived in some other country. Now if America was to be invaded, everybody would join together and fight against the invaders. The national unity that would destroy the invaders was seen after 9-11 and pearl harbor.

Now in Iraq, not everybody is joining to fight the invaders ( The US Military ). They have a few thousand people hiding out causing trouble. We will find these people, and deal with them. If america wasnt full of political bs and we werent a bunch of pussies, we would go in and kill everything that seemed remotely dangerous. We would have been done months ago, and the war would be over. Whatever your opinion is, just support the troops.

 

BeatleBuick said:

That's very true. We had many discussions on just this fact in my journalism classes. News outlets have tried it, and lost circulation/viewers. On the other hand, having a degree in journalsim, I often wonder how many of the reporters I see on TV do.

At times I've even taken a red pencil to our daily papers (aweful spelling, etc.). I've never sent them the corrected versions, though.

Mechacode said:

I agree completely.

As in case anyone is counting, I don't believe I posted a comment on what should happen to the marine in question.
: p

 

This thread.

 

The problem is that 100% of iraq wasn't under control of saddam. I wish I could find the map that they had shown on cnn a few times of what parts of iraq was controlled by who. Sure saddam had control over alot of it but there were alot of people that were already fighting against saddam and were free in their own way and now we come in and try to control the whole country. We've only replaced saddam with ourselves and these people will gladly fight us as well.

 

Wait just a minute here!

I thought I killed this thread, just like all the others I reply to!!!!!
:rant:
I do at times attempt to do a public service ya know! :Brow:

.