Got the body off of the frame on my 65 Riv this past Saturday, and pulled out the motor and tranny today. Tom T. has convinced me that I should rebuild the motor, and I think he is right, as the engine has never been rebuilt. It is an original 90k miles or so engine. Ran fairly good, but it is dirty. Since I'm doing a frame off on this car, Tom is right, I'm going to rebuild it. So, in the attempt to do as much as I can myself both to learn, and save $$$, I'd like to sub out all the machine work, but do the re-assembly on the motor myself. Before I tackle such a feat, I'd like to do as much reading as possible on the Nailhead. There are several things on the Nail that I am familiar with from reading threads here and on the Riv forum, such as no hardened seats, making sure to align the flywheel properly and such. But, overall, I still know very little about these motors, and want to gather as much info as I can to accomplish this job successfully and properly. Honestly I'm a bit nervous attempting the rebuild, as I've never rebuilt a motor before, and much less a Nailhead. Have installed a number of engines and such, restored and built a 72 Corvette, and a Factory Five Cobra replica, just never attempted an engine rebuild. I know there are several guys on here who know these motors well, so I am anxious to hear from you guys. Thanks for the help and the patience, as I will be asking more questions than a 5 year old. :shock: BTW, I am looking to do a stock, factory spec rebuild. This car will be driven, not raced.
Rob, You might want to put some "X" bracing on your stands that the body is sitting on. It would be a shame if it got bumped and the stands folded. Good luck with your project.
Its a X frame. By running the frame down the center of the car they were able to achieve a much lower ride height.
Rob, For me, the single best source for engine rebuilding is the Buick Service Manual. It goes into great detail on clearances and assembly procedures. Using the shop manual coupled to past threads here at "the mother ship" V8Buick that cover tricks and procedures not outlined in the manual and you'll be covered pretty well as far as the written word. For someone new at this, when it comes to the actual assembly errors can still result because of how one interprets instructions and most instructions take into account the person doing the work has experience and gaps can occur because of it if not careful. I also suggest building a good relationship with your machine shop as they will be a good source for assembly info. Even if the shop isn't doing the assembly, they should have a vested interest in how it turns out. Shops I deal with have always went above and beyond to answer any of my stupid questions. Lastly do not assume anything making sure you are confident in each step of the process. Pay special attention to "ALL" your clearances and double check everything. Its time consuming but imperative and are crucial to a successful build. Many horror stories of bad engine jobs can be traced back to someone making an assumption and not verifying clearances. Good Luck with your project
Glad you started this thread, Rob. I'm in a similar situation. Just got started on a '54 nailhead 322 that I plan to put in my '37 Chevy pickup truck daily driver when the Jimmy 302 I have in there now wears out.
A minor point perhaps, but there are several capscrews that thread into the water jackets and require thread sealer. Be sure that you know which ones that they are, or you will spend more time then you want to chasing coolant leaks after reassembly.
x2 on the Buick Chassis Service manual! Here's another series of articles: http://www.webrodder.com/index.php?page=showStories&search=nailhead
If you did what you show in the pictures , you are able to build a engine.... like Jason says,,, start with the factory manuals and do your homework....so you can do your homework:Brow: and do the teardown your self.... dont mix up the rod caps,,,, dont mix up the maincaps.... with a engine with 90K miles on it, I would replace all the factory cast pistons.... just too much risk of metal fatigue.... get you a little black book and record everything , measurments, machine work done, ect... and keep it handy.... buy name brand replacement parts.... listen to Tom, Walt, Jason, ect.... and remember, nailheads have forged steel cranks, forged steel rods, good cooling and oiling systems.... dont need hardened valve seats, and basicly are just like any other gm v8 engine of the time... the only difference being that the valves are on the inside of the rocker arm shafts instead of the outside... there is no mystery or majic about working on them , just common sense......btw assemble with moly grease, not the liquid assembly lube,,, the liquid drips off the parts and the grease stays with the parts.....
Thanks for all of the replies so far guys, and thanks for the encouraging words Doc. I really appreciate the information. I do have a chassis manual, and have been reading the engine section. While it does contain a decent amount of information, I do find it a bit vague. But, as suggested above, it is most likely intended for people/mechanics whom have prior engine building experience. I've got the engine now out of the chassis, and will have it on a stand soon, then teardown begins. What other tips can you guys provide on teardown other than the ones Doc already mentioned. In the effort of not wanting to make mistakes, and not assuming anything, this is why I ask. I have not yet found a machine shop, so that will be my next step. If anyone knows of a reputable machine shop in the Miami, Ft. Lauderdale, South Florida area, please let me know.
John, I'm assuming most of these are related to the water pump, to timing cover, to block bolts? Is there a list available which dictates as to which bolts need the thread sealer? Thanks.
Rob, From an overall perspective, if you are doing a COMPLETE rebuild, it may be wise to allow the shop which does the machine work to do the teardown and assembly. Under that scenario there should be a warranty. Reason is the teardown and assembly should represent a small part of the overall cost if you are doing all the pistons, boring, etc...so from a financial perspective doing the assembly may not make much sense...a;so, the teardown is as important as the assembly as a keen engine builder will be looking for clues as to potential problems during this phase. If things go south, who will stand behind the work? Who is ultimately responsible if the machine shop does some of the work and the owner does some of the work? Sharing responsibility for the engine may become a sticky and very frustrating situation. It is great you have the desire to gain the experience, and that has value, but for your first engine perhaps a simple bearing, ring replacement would be better suited because the labor represents a much larger portion of the overall cost? Not trying to be a downer or a Doubting Thomas but I have received more than a few calls over the years demonstrating how optimistic, well intentioned owners and just as well intentioned shops have gotten into a stalemate over a situation like this. Just something to consider... Jason and others are absolutely correct, the shop manual is an excellent source of info for a start. With basic mechanical skills and good common sense and a few specialty tools assembling an engine can easily be accomplished-that`s why a standard machine shop only charges a few hundred dollars to do it. For your intentions be sure to find a builder who has an excellent reputation and is willing to protect it, even if you have to pay a little extra. Good luck, Tom Mooney
Rob, From an overall perspective, if you are doing a COMPLETE rebuild, it may be wise to allow the shop which does the machine work to do the teardown and assembly. Under that scenario there should be a warranty. Reason is the teardown and assembly should represent a small part of the overall cost if you are doing all the pistons, boring, etc...so from a financial perspective doing the assembly may not make much sense...also, the teardown is as important as the assembly as a keen engine builder will be looking for clues as to potential problems during this phase. If things go south, who will stand behind the work? Who is ultimately responsible if the machine shop does some of the work and the owner does some of the work? Sharing responsibility for the engine may become a sticky and very frustrating situation. It is great you have the desire to gain the experience, and that has value, but for your first engine perhaps a simple bearing, ring replacement would be better suited because the labor represents a much larger portion of the overall cost? Not trying to be a downer or a Doubting Thomas but I have received more than a few calls over the years demonstrating how optimistic, well intentioned owners and just as well intentioned shops have gotten into a stalemate over a situation like this. Just something to consider... Jason and others are absolutely correct, the shop manual is an excellent source of info for a start. With basic mechanical skills and good common sense and a few specialty tools assembling an engine can easily be accomplished-that`s why a standard machine shop only charges a few hundred dollars to do it. For your intentions be sure to find a builder who has an excellent reputation and is willing to protect it, even if you have to pay a little extra. Good luck, Tom Mooney
Rob,,,, ASAP start soaking the bolts in pb blaster or atf.. so it will be easier to get them loose.... also a bench grinder with a soft wire wheel works wonders for cleaning gasket surfaces.... also the scotch rollock discs with a angle die grinder.... but be carefull with the discs as they can eat metal.... just use them untill the metal gets bright and then stop and move on to the next location....
Yes. I'm in Florida and my manual is in MA, but if you follow the service manual - you should have no problems specific to the Nailhead. There's no magic (as Doc says). The only seriously unique feature of the Nailhead is that the valves are on the inside of the cylinders. And, of course, it's an awesome torquemonster.
There are several head bolts which protrude into the water jackets. It is cheap insurance to use some sealer on those. Over this point, and with great respect, I am going to disagree with Doc regarding using abrasive discs for cleaning gaskets. Aside from his caution regarding removing metal, abrasive discs throw off ABRASIVES! The discs are used in shops where time is a priority but the use of these discs is a huge no-no for component rebuilding where cleanliness is a concern. I also dont like to breathe the dust, gasket or abrasive, that the discs can throw off. An adjustable handle razor scraper with a fresh supply of razor blades will work just fine on any machined surfaces. A wire brush, either on the bench or chucked into a cut-off tool (speed adjusted down) will work on hard to clean components like oil pan or valve covers. Use safety goggles when using both. A broken piece of razor blade or an errant wire in the eyeball will ruin your day. Good luck Rob! Tom Mooney
There are several head bolts which protrude into the water jackets. It is cheap insurance to use some sealer on those. Over this point, and with great respect, I am going to disagree with Doc regarding using abrasive discs for cleaning gaskets. Aside from his caution regarding removing metal, abrasive discs throw off ABRASIVES! The discs are used in shops where time is a priority but the use of these discs is a huge no-no for component rebuilding where cleanliness is a concern. I also dont like to breathe the dust, gasket or abrasive, that the discs can throw off. An adjustable handle razor scraper with a fresh supply of razor blades will work just fine on any machined surfaces. A wire brush, either on the bench or chucked into a cut-off tool (speed adjusted down) will work on hard to clean components like oil pan or valve covers. Use safety goggles when using both. A broken piece of razor blade or an errant wire in the eyeball will ruin your day. Good luck Rob! Tom Mooney
Steve, you are absolutely right! When I was in my 20`s..50`s now I slid sideways into a large tree in a `65 Riv. I was knocked unconscious but when I came to I was draped over my buddies lap with my head toward the pass footwell. The tree was occupying what was the driver`s seat. The car was folded at a 45 degree angle...it wasn`t pretty. What made matters worse was the car was a typical midwest car, probably soft in the inside structure of the rockers. Buick made the rockers super beefy but that all goes away when they rust. I have seen these X frame so weak from rust that they will snap the windshield right down the center from the stress of the body folding around the frame. I always urge would be first gen Riv owners to find the cleanest car possible, it`s just not worth compromising safety no matter how good the deal is. Sorry for momentarily highjacking the thread but this is a point most folks dont consider about X frame cars. I learned it the hard way, serious business, Tom Mooney
