We're a little further along. The inner fenderwell reinforcements have arrived and been fitted up and the header openings located and cut, plus a mock-up of the left rear header tube positioned to determine steering column and rack relocation. Photos below. Bill Young, "Service Garage" in Kansas City, MO has sent us our first actual premeditated cash contribution, a check for $100, and Dan Masters started the ball rolling by promising $100 when he comes through and picks up the axle housing to deliver it to Ted Lathrop (Fast Cars, Wayland, MI) who has promised to weld it up in the proper MG configuration. My intention is to use some of the first check to cover the costs of setting up the organizational structure. Hopefully the state fees will be only a fraction of that and there will be some left for parts, but at this point I think that first step is a necessity. From the layout using the mock-up tube it appears that the steering shaft will have to be moved down about 2", perhaps slightly further depending on the size of the u-joint used. It's kinda gratifying to discover that this distance is exactly the same as the first estimate before any measurements could be taken. Jim
Jim, make sure you leave enough room at the exhaust cutouts to reach the header bolts through them, will make that job a lot easier. Looks good so far, sorry I can't make those Roadmaster weekends, perhaps some day I can swing over your way.
Thanks for the suggestion Bill, that's what I'll try to do. If anyone can make it, this coming weekend is the MGB Roadmaster weekend, here at 9406 Gunpowder Rd, Florence, KY. It looks to be our biggest weekend so far and there's plenty to do so come and join the fun! Jim
Jim here is a copl of pic's of the u-joints on my LUV trk going to the pinto rack steering i installed.
I must be brain dead. I write posts and then don't post them and have to write them over. Well at least the good thing is that I mostly remember what I wrote earlier so here we go again: The "Roadmaster Weekend" here at Blackwood Labs was a success and we got a lot done. Carl Floyd brought the T5 transmission (that's him in the photos) which we fitted and made up a crossmember and mount which was simple and effective. The fit was about as perfect as you could get, adequate clearances everywhere and a proper angle of the engine, though we did end up pushing the right firewall back a half inch behind the head. Following a bit of tweaking we removed the engine and put the car up on the rotisserie (which we also completed). With the 430 on the engine stand we pulled the pan and rocker covers and Carl shot rust buster goo into the spark plug holes, and yesterday after some rocking I was able to crank the engine around a few times so it may not be in too bad of shape. We'll see when we pull the heads but might as well hope for the best. Anyway, we pulled the doors and hatch off the car and finished up with a few photos which will be below. Incidentally, Allen (Izanurse) on this board has offered us a 1970 455 rebuildable core but we need to get it from Eureka, Kansas to northern KY. We can do this in stages. Dan Jones, any chance that you could get it from St. Louis to Florence? Bill Young may be able to get it to there from Kansas, he just has to fix his pick-up first so it may take him a couple of weeks. We're not in a tremendous hurry otherwise. Why do we need the 455? Because it is lighter (anyone know just how much lighter the early 455 is than a 430?) and because our stated goal is to build this car with the biggest BBB. It'd be better to start with the right engine. In addition having the second engine will let us build the headers while the machine work is being done. Incidentally, we still need a small starter if anyone can donate one. Jim Anyway, on to the photos:
Dan Jones stopped by for a couple hours today on his way back to St. Louis and we had a real nice visit. He's got quite a nice Pantera he's working on, and in 2 weeks he'll be bringing a trailer to Cinci to haul it home on. Being empty on the run into town, he should be able to haul our engine, so I guess that's our timeline if you guys can meet it. I've sent the contact info to Bill, Dan, and Allen so if you guys would contact each other maybe we can work this out. Keep track of your expenses because they should be deductible as a charitable contribution once the non-profit status is established, or as a regular business expense if characterized as a sponsor. On that note, I now have a contact who is familiar with non-profit entities and should be able to talk to her tomorrow about getting the organization in place. It has taken longer than I expected to get to this point but as it turns out, my contact is someone I already knew so that will help things go smoothly I expect. There's not a whole lot that got done to the car this weekend but I did get some cuts made on the steering column relocation. I'll try to have that all tacked into place by the next Roadmaster Weekend (27, 28, 29th) so that after the wiring and dash come out we can start welding. That's also when I expect to start on the rust repairs so soon after that we will be needing some panels. Dan mentioned that he knows of a body dip facility close by and he described some pretty phenomenal results, saying afterwards a car could sit outside for 6 months and not rust. Sounds a little hard to believe, but a dip could sure speed things along so I asked him to send me the info that he has on it and I will contact them about pricing and possible sponsorship. Jim
Here are a couple more shots, one of the worm drive on the rotisserie and one of the bottom of the car. Jim
This is such a cool thread guys! What a great idea. I must confess to, um, ahem, 'borrowing' or 'appropriating' ok, just plain copying some of the ideas used here. My BMW project was asking more questions that I seemed to have answers for but things like the motor mounts and actually moving the steering where it comes through the firewall are most helpful. I can see many of the same things happening with my project. One difference is that my car will have an auto transmission rather than the stick as in this one. Not trying to hijack the thread here just really enthusiastic about both cars, yours and mine. Keep up the great work guys! I wish I was closer to Florence so I could help out! :beers2:
Jim, would you happen to have the rough dimensions of a 215 small block? And a 455 big block? Your swap has me thinking that a 455 might fit into a '63 Skylark fairly easily. Power to weight ratio would be fairly good in one of these cars and there is one close by that could be picked up cheap. Brian
Brian, 455: 26-1/2" long bellhousing to damper face 25-5/8" wide between exhaust ports 18" tall intake to crank 215: 24" long 21" wide to valvecovers 17" tall Most of the extra width is exhaust port, they stick out. Jim
Thanks Jim. I figure since the '63 Tempest came with the 326 which is the same as a Pontiac 455, then the Buick 455 should fit without too much trouble. I've been to a couple drag racing events in the last 2 weeks, and I'm getting the fever. Brian
More great news on the engine. I just talked to Dale Spooner (our machinist, Danville, Va.) and he spends his weekends with his girlfriend in Carl's neighborhood, which means that once Allen, Bill and Dan are able to coordinate the transfer of the 455 to me at Florence, I can work with Carl and Dale to get it back to his shop in Va. Guys, this is exactly the way this project is supposed to work! We're really getting rolling with it now. Of course with the British V8 meet coming up in a little over a week all eyes are on that right now and not much will get done on the MGB Roadmaster until after that (for my part, I'm still trying to complete my rollbar for my roadster in time, a very shaky proposition right now) but the following monday (6th) I have it on my calender to call the secretary of state and file papers to incorporate the organization. I just need a name for it. So far the best I've come up with is something on the order of Anglo-American Rodders Historical Society, American British Rodders Historical Society, Big Iron LBC Society and things like that. Nothing really catchy so far, so I need some help on that. The name is all important in terms of our success because of two things. It will help persuade the IRS that we meet their qualifications for a non-profit, and more importantly, it will help persuade larger potential sponsors such as TA, Edelbrock, and others that we are worthy of their investment. So this is a serious need and must be the best choice we can make. Assuming we succeed beyond expectations (and I'm planning most carefully to do just that) there may be other projects in the organization's future, so tying it into the MGB Roadmaster project with the name is probably not an advantage, although if there was a way to tie in Buick and MG I can't see that hurting anything. A word about the purpose of the organization is probably in order. To bestow a public benefit, our best approach is probably to direct our efforts towards educating the public about the history and potential of these wonderful cars which were the result of British and American cooperation. The public is fast losing awareness that the use of big American V8 engines in small nimble British sports cars was a cottage industry that forever changed the shape of performance cars worldwide, and one which grew in size well beyond the remembrance of most in that generation. It was a phenomenon that has had a profound effect on the world today, and the public should be reminded of it. Due to Buick's involvement, Rover has enabled mankind to explore the far corners of the globe in areas that would have otherwise gone long ignored, and which have contributed greatly to the general welfare of mankind, as only one example of many. Others include a wide and deep racing history as well as the development of some of the finest driver's cars the world has ever seen. There are a number of historians much better qualified than I am to inform us of the intimate details who could be our wellspring of information for this purpose, but at this point we just need a name for the organization so that we can get back to the business of building the car. I just need help with the words. Please? Jim
hmmm, interesting. there's also been a long history of aeronautical cross-pollination between the England and the US. the P-51 w/Rolls Royce engine (the original Allison powered 'Stang was middling fair but nowhere near the exceptional performance levels of the updated design) springs immediately to mind. do you think there would be any way to work in a link with the American Air Museum, a la The Faithful Pursuit and the Tuskegee Airmen? maybe Anglo-American Motors Historical Society or Society for the Preservation of Anglo-American Automotive History?
Good ideas Bob. Here's an update reposted from the MG Enthusiasts forum, Roadmaster thread: http://www2.mgcars.org.uk/cgi-bin/g...jectar=36&source=T&thread=2007040716030628069 Seems we let the thread drop off into the archives, but the above link should bring it up. To bring things up current, at the V8 meet we came up with the name of, "British American Sportscar Historical society" or "BASH". A second suggestion was "British American Derived Automotive Sportscar Synergy" or "BADASS" which I must admit goes rather well with the character of the cars. So we have a choice to make and I'd like to hear opinions. We've had more contributions. Graham Creswick who many of you know and who owns a stunningly clean 302 MGB gave me a $100 check at the meet and a local MG owner, Tom Craddock contributed $10 to the cause. These funds bring us up to $212.23 and is enough to justify opening a bank account, something I will do as soon as the incorporation papers are filed. As well, Dan Masters assured me we could have the Jag rear end which he has, we only need to transport it and that shouldn't be much of a problem. If you'll recall, Dan has also assured us that when the time comes to wire the car he will take care of us. Also Jim Stuart reassured me that he has a nice set of aluminum wheels for us, again we just need to get them here from Maryland. Curtis (V8 Newsletter) has asked me to write an article on the car which I should be able to complete in about a month, and that brings to mind a request I'd like to make of all of you. As each of you who has visited the newsletter site knows, Curtis had developed the newsletter website into something we can all be very proud of, and which we use as a resource on a regular basis. Frankly most of us are quite amazed at what he has accomplished and very much want him to be able to continue a labor which he obviously loves. It just so happens that we can make that happen if we act in concert. I had him explain to me some of the details of how the site can generate revenues and the long and short of it is just this. If we all will make one minor change in our browsing habits we can very easily insure the future of the Newsletter. http://www.britishv8.org There is a Google search block on most if not all of the Newsletter pages. If you will make the Newsletter your portal for Google searches (possibly your home page), you will cause the Newsletter to be paid a good bit of money. I forget the exact numbers but if you run a search from the Google block on the Newsletter page it can result in somewhere from a quarter to a dollar or so of revenue, particularly so if you follow the top three search results that come back. Each of these search result is worth something like thirty cents (the links lower on the page to Newsletter articles would not generate revenues of course). And these searches can be for anything you would normally search for, not just car related stuff. In addition there are links across the bottom of the page from left to right. Advertisers bid for these positions and the left ones generate more than the rest, say around a dime or so each time you click on them. I do not recommend that you go click links just to run up the score because that won't work anyway, but I do recommend that you at least check them out from time to time. If we'll all do these things there will be no more worries about financing the newsletter, and perhaps at some point in the future as our sport grows we can even give Curtis a paid position. Personally I can't think of anyone better suited to take us into the next decade. As long as you are going to run searches anyway, you might as well be sending the advertising money to the web site of your choice. There was a great deal of interest in the Roadmaster project shown at the V8 meet, including some very good potential sponsors. Everyone voiced considerable amazement at what we've been able to accomplish as well as encouragement to continue. It seems we've hit upon something that has popular support, and which has generated a lot of excitement. Those who have been to Florence to help with the car and contributed in other ways are the Founders of the organization and I'd like to call on you for additional support. Carl has expressed an interest in coming back to the "scene of the crime" so to speak and do some more work on the car. I wonder if anyone else realizes the importance of this milestone? In order to succeed we must persuade people to come and help. But everyone is watching us very closely to see if we will rise or fall. Their main criteria to judge success is the actions of those who have been here. Did they like it? Was it worthwhile? And of ultimate importance, would you do it again? Carl has answered this question in his own inimitable way, but only to me and my presentation of it could be biased. What I would like to do is call on each of you who have been here to assure everyone that you do indeed believe it to be a worthy cause, that you are confident of our success, and that you are or at least would like to plan a return trip. Now I'm taking quite a risk by making this request. In fact I'm putting the entire project in jepoardy by doing it and keeping my fingers crossed in hopes that I've not made the biggest tactical blunder of the campaign. But I'm doing it because I believe in Carl, Steve, Pete, Dan, Dan Jones, and all of the rest of you who have contributed but have not been able to come to Florence. I know you guys believe in the project and will not let me down, provided you see this message. So I guess I'd better make sure you see it. Anyway, if you would, I'd sure appreciate it if you'd add a note here to let folks know how you feel about it. Don't be swayed by how I'd like it to sound, just give us your own opinion and I think that'll be a big help. Oh, and don't forget to let me know which name we should use. Jim
when you have something like "B.A.D.A.S.S." on the table, how can there be any competition? just think of the Big Daddy Roth style BADASS logo T-shirts! that right there could probably finance the whole thing. :TU::laugh:
Brian, the idea of a 455 in a 63 Skylark is a good one. That's what I wanted to build when I built my Nostaglia Super Stock car , but the organizations would not allow me to use a 63 or actually I had considered a 62 Special. They only allow a 64 to 67 so I went with the 67. I have seen several of the Tempest with Pontaic engines(they are allowed) and a couple of 62 and 63 Specials with a Chevy engine(running bracket). I think the earlier cars would have had a little smaller hole to punch through the air. Jim N.
At this point the name BASH is in the lead over BADASS by the slimmest of margins. I'll wait until Monday to file, other names are still welcome. Work continues on the steering, as the crossmember has been cut for clearance and the cone more closely located. Next step is to procure a set of shaft collars for rack mounts and then the location can be finalized at both ends. Jim
It has come to our attention that BASH is associated with 19 organization names, some of which we'd just as soon not be confused with. Thus the balance has tipped very slightly in favor of BADASS. Comments welcome. Jim
Thus the balance has tipped very slightly in favor of BADASS. Comments welcome. have you counted my vote for 'BADASS'? if not, where do v8buick members go to vote? i don't know how much 'constructive' help i'll ever be to the project or organization but i know i'd buy a t-shirt! :laugh: i could alternate between W.O.T., W.E.T. and B.A.D.A.S.S. :bglasses:
