i have a 71 GS 455, the car has been a drag car for many years and already has a cage. i am looking for some input on who makes the best bolt on aftermarket suspension and brake components to transition this straight liner into a corner carver. the car currently has all stock suspension parts and front disc brakes. as for the brakes, i'm looking at installing a 4 wheel disc setup. i already have available a set of baer fronts and a set of wilwood fronts, is one better suited over the other for road racing vs drag racing, or is there a better cost effective alternative available in a bolt on kit? any input is appreciated.
Wilwood makes some nice big brake parts that won't fit stock wheels. Are you going some large diameter wheels, at least 17" or bigger? I was sold on the Wilwood stuff if it would have fit factory wheels.
I still think Global West is the best.http://www.globalwest.net/ Lots of good information there too. Their new lower control arm with spherical ends is really nice. Currie has some really nice lower control arms (rear.)
just about any rear controlarms work for protouring/road race now due to sc&c/Curries Johnny joint Kit (sperical joint bushing that goes into rear ears) cures binding on all rear arm setups so no real need to get the expensive DSE or speedtech, or even air ride kits.. as for rear swaybars, their's only 2 worth getting, the DSE rear or the sc&c pro-tour rear bar if you have the money for a splined front bar DSE..other wise DSE reg front bar or hotchkis front bar spc front upper/lower control arms are the best for the $$$ go with tall ball joints if hyou plan to keep stock spindles if you want aftermarket spindles..again only 2 worth getting, speed techs and L&H Kustoms? i have links to all if you need if you go with the "stock height" drop spindles you're already setup with c5/c6 hubs for big discs ---------- Post added at 11:38 PM ---------- Previous post was at 11:26 PM ---------- Johnny joint rear bushing kit http://scandc.com/new/node/815 lower Umi arms ask about the roto/roto version http://scandc.com/new/node/774 upper edelbrock (5248) arms( no longer available through summit?) Spohn upper control arms http://scandc.com/new/node/101 UMI rear control arm brace....Hotchkis and DSE makes this style also..this is best of the 3 styles http://scandc.com/new/node/786 rear sway bars spohn/sc&C rear pro-tour bar http://scandc.com/new/node/94 or DSE rear swivvel link bar http://www.detroitspeed.com/1964-1972 A-Body-Products/042201-rear-swy-br.html' if you want rear coil overs chassieworks is a tad cheaer then the DSE version http://scandc.com/new/node/721 I'll throw out some links for front suspensions once you answer these questions stock spindles or going drop spindle? Stock balljoints or Tall Ball joints? stock steering or Rack and Pinion? also. you sticking with shock/springs or coil overs? 14/15s or 17+?
Helwig's rear bar #55868 j is a real nice piece, and the good Hotchkis rear bar (the one that links to the frame) is also nice. I like the way these bars do not hang under the differential. I use a Currie rear lower control arm with the spherical at the end. Use a Edelbrock upper with a spherical at the frame. I think Edelbrock sold this to someone else but it is till out there. Don't forget the brace between the rear upper and lower control arm. Front: Usually you will need new upper control arms in the front to get the caster and camber to works right. I did mine a while ago used Global West uppers, with B-body spindles. Bar is Helwig 1 3/8 (that's beefy) and have QA1 shocks. Also has Jeep steering box. Don't worry about slamming your car to the ground, geometry, springs, shocks, bars, and tires are where its at. Only thing I do not like about my setup is the steering box needs a stiffer bar. Someday will send box in for upgrade. I would go more for good driver than track car. The sad news is that at an autocross someone in a Honda Fit is going to whip you. Here is the link to the good Helwig bar http://www.ebay.com/itm/Hellwig-558...Parts_Accessories&hash=item46029a8426&vxp=mtr
I did mention the brace and the better style out of the 3.. also. Seems like edelbrock sold their arms to qa1, as that's what pops up in summit. The 2 rear bars I posted are the only ones to consider for a handleing setup as they're the only 2 bars that implement a feature withihn the bar so it won't bind.
I been to pro-touring.com lateral and other protour sites long enough to know, Im a geek when it comes to researching haha and talked with the best over phone such as Mark of SC&C soon there will be no reason to jump ship over there..I know theirs a few other v8buick members that flock to protouring, so thats why im confident we'll have a wealth of info to share/post when we finally get our pro-tour section ---------- Post added at 02:21 PM ---------- Previous post was at 01:57 PM ---------- well since the OP hasnt responded to my questions as of yet. i'll just post links for a good setup and substitute parts..like shock/spring vs coil over or lee 600 box vs unisteer R&P and ats/L&H spindle vs stock spindle with tall BJs I'll try and get brakes also..but for most part brakes are brake..just a question on what size piston calipers your wanting.
Mike, I think we are pretty much in agreement on handling basics. I looked at both of the rear sway bars you mentioned and the Helwig I posted and cannot see any difference in them except for $100 price diff.
I personally would not buy a Spohn (or any solid) sway bar. Go with tubular bars. Way more efficient per pound.
The difference is the 2 I posted swivel links so thebars articulate rather bind the suspension at a point.. the dse is hollow/ pretty sure the spohn is too..ill have to double check on that...I personally like hollow bars better then solid
The Hellwig is hollow. It looks like the link is not a spherical link. I am really adamant about spherical links on the trailing arms at the frame. Not sure that it is that big of a deal on the bar links. I am pretty sure that no OEM uses a spherical for that type of link. Will have to take a look under my the next ZL-1 Camaro my neighbor brings home. For a race car I would use a heim joint just because. Next time I see Mark Stielow I will ask him about it.
I am doing a similar investigation for my 72 GS. I feel like I have looked at every suspension site 20 times at this point. Do yourself a favor and call Mark at SC&C. He spent an hour with me on the phone 2 days ago evaluating and making suggestions on my planned set up. I can't remember the last time I had someone take that kind of time and offer that kind of expertise with such a great attitude.
the OEM cars wont have it, they typically have a paralleled 4link setup the g-body/abody and fox bodies are triangulated and is easiest to bind that only 2 bars have it I love my DSE bar even Ride tech is doing something similar to special end swaybar or swivel link bar heres their posi-link rear bar http://www.ridetech.com/images/features/musclebarproduct.gif perhaps you can add these to any rear sway and possible front swaybars! http://www.ridetech.com/store/musclebar-swaybar/posi-links-components/ Def add the rear Johnny joint bushing kit in the axle ears if you want all the articulation non binding movement out of your current setup ---------- Post added 04-25-2013 at 12:18 AM ---------- Previous post was 04-24-2013 at 11:48 PM ---------- Front control arms spc uppers http://scandc.com/new/node/57 can get thse in high durameter or Delrin bushing rubber also if you look through internet you can find them off a particular site for about 205 spc lowers http://scandc.com/new/node/79 if you search internet you can find them off a particular site for around 400 to convert to coilover with this lower arm bump stop for this lower arm http://scandc.com/new/node/690 if you want extra camper with stock spindles get howe tall upper/lower ball joints or skip that and get a uni steer R&P http://www.unisteer.com/seach_by_ve...chevelle_power_rack_and_pinion_kit_w/sbc.html Electric steering conversion http://www.unisteer.com/search_by_p...ng/4460_improved_universal_electra-steer.html if you dont want a rack, heres the best box you can buy http://scandc.com/new/node/246 if you want a stock height drop spindle or close two it. onky 2 real options L&H Kustoms http://scandc.com/new/node/679 couldnt fins seperate link just bundle..but you can get without hub to run reg 14/15..or get hub to run 17+ also has new steering arms or AFX spindles..should be uncder speedtech but not seeing it.. most expensive out bunch and you have to run big brakes/rotors with this one, not modular like the L&H front sway bar DSE http://www.detroitspeed.com/1964-1972 A-Body-Products/031402-swy-brs.html or Hotchkis http://www.hotchkis.net/6472_gm_abody_front_sport_sway_bar.html Frame Reenforcement HPI kit http://www.hpicustoms.com/products.html#
Mike, I guess we will have to disagree about needing heim joints for sway bar links. At least for a street car. Otherwise we go to the same book. Have to get the new spherical bushing for the differential ears. Always thought the Wolfcraft bushing were neat but not for a car that might see rain and dirt. Also have to look at the frame stiffener. Would love to see how that comes out.
I'll throw out some links for front suspensions once you answer these questions stock spindles or going drop spindle? Stock balljoints or Tall Ball joints? stock steering or Rack and Pinion? also. you sticking with shock/springs or coil overs? 14/15s or 17+?[/QUOTE] as far as the parts go, i am open to change just about anything if the performance/handling gain is worth spending the cash, i am not familiar with the different setups out there and the components they include as for the spindles/ball joints/control arms and the gains behind the different parts, i do plan on keeping the stock style steering, and i had figured on needing different shocks, just didn't know which ones to go with and i already have some nice 17" rims to start out with. i don't get on the board every day, and i probably won't have time to go through all of the parts links that were posted here until next week, but i do thank you for them and i will add more questions here as they come. thanks again, john
as far as the parts go, i am open to change just about anything if the performance/handling gain is worth spending the cash, i am not familiar with the different setups out there and the components they include as for the spindles/ball joints/control arms and the gains behind the different parts, i do plan on keeping the stock style steering, and i had figured on needing different shocks, just didn't know which ones to go with and i already have some nice 17" rims to start out with. i don't get on the board every day, and i probably won't have time to go through all of the parts links that were posted here until next week, but i do thank you for them and i will add more questions here as they come. thanks again, john[/QUOTE] Well for best buck for performance. Skip aftermarket spindles and rack and pinion/electric steer. And you may skip out on coil overs too. Eveything else I listed goes hand and hand. Wity best price for buck
The basics for improved handling. 1. All suspension parts must be in perfect condition. 2. Front geometry caster 6* camber -1 toe -1/8 It is really hard to get some of these numbers with stock upper control arms. Need a good beefy sway bar. Hollow is nice but my 1 3/8 solid works well. High quality 550 pound spring. Good shock set. Lots of them out there now. Poly in the front works OK A good quick ration steering box. I use a Jeep Grand Cherokee because I am cheap and it works good. 3. Rear Suspension Rubber bushings or Spherical bushings at the frame. Mike found that nice bushing for a spherical bushing for the upper control arm at the axle. I think that could be even better than just at the frame Make sure you have the frame braces we talked about. I really think that stock lower control arms are too wimpy. Get a good after market one. It used to be the only one to get was Currie but now everyone has a lower control arm with spherical bushing at the frame. If I had lots of money to spend it would be for double adjustable shocks at the rear. Rear shocks can really affect the chassis tune. Have not played with spring rates in rear yet. Need a rear sway bar. They all work, some better than others. The big do not: NO ALL POLY BUSHING SETS IN THE REAR CONTROL ARMS! You can use poly at one end if a spherical is at the other. Cheap trick. Get a set of chevy camaro 1LE rubber bushings. Will firm up the rear suspension without binding the rear suspension. If you have the money to spend. Go to one of the really good firms, DSE, Global West, SC&C and just go with everything they advise for what you want to do. They all have good engineers and all of their stuff works for sure when you use the advised combinations. Glad to see that no one wants to use big rims with rubber band tires. It is really hard to get camber curves and bump steer good enough to make this stuff work.
