GM has managed to get 400 HP @ less than 6000 RPM and 400 ft. lbs of torque @ less that 2500 RPM out of a 350 CID pushrod engine. They have acheived this without compromising runnability or durability of the engine. These 400 ponies are SAE Net ratings meaning these motors would rate around 450 using pre 1972 methods of testing. Here is my question: Why are we not seeing more integrated engine management systems being retrofitted to these wonderful older motors? It seems a PFI manifold, low parasitic, light rotating and reciprocating, broad roller cammed and computer controlled distributor engine, of the size we play with, could make 500 HP and 600 ft. lbs. of torque. All of this with A/C, power brakes and 150k miles between teardowns. Discuss
It's because I do not have the desire to retrofit those things onto my engine. I like Alleyoop technology. I like carburetors. I am not into having the most gee-whiz car, I'm into having a car that I like, and to me, that means working with essentially what the car came with. I also do not want to have to have to cut the car to install anything, or to be forced to use, say, a hood that is not a GS hood. I like the fact that I can work on my engine without difficulty. i like being able to get at my spark plugs. I like being able to easily access engine compoments without ducts, wires and fuel rails being in my way. I hate new car engine compartments. Then there is the money involved. I also suppose one of the biggest reasons is that it seems to me we can already make an honest 500 hp net and 600 lb/ft torque 455 without all that stuff.
...since when is GM interested in producing a quality product? VW tried this idea a few years back and it wasn't very profitable. The simple answer is that there just isn't enough market interest int he project.
I couldn't agree more, Chris. I'm the guy that has $775 in my 455 84 LeSabre. There are guys here who have a longer pedigree on their distributor than I have on my entire car. Is this not a concession to technological advances? I see cylinder heads from TA that cost $1,800.00 naked. The pitch being that they are designed to incorporate new technology in air flow. Is this not putting lipstick on a pig? How about Torque Converters, fuel pumps, fans and Carbuerators? I don't see many folks putting Dynaflows and 4Jets on their hotrods. Yes, 500 HP motors are all over this site. Drive one of them down J street in Sacramento on a summer Saturday nite and see what happens. And then there is the problem of turning 120 lbs of rotating mass, mounted on huge journals, at the 6500 to 7000 rpm it requires to make these HP #s. A single plane or tunnel ram base massaged to receive a 8.0 chevy or 7.5 ford plenum and thottle body is a doable deal and would probably fit under a stock hood. Imagine the work you could do on your car if you had control of components based on temperature, atmospheric pressure and relative humidity. A whole new world of tuning challanges would be open to you. I love the natural physics of a carb. doing its job, but a single carb. is a design of compromise. If we can accept technical advances in all other facets of our cars, why not put aspiration on the table, too? My unabiding respect goes to the Purist and Collector. Thanks for saving an era in auto history that is uniquely American. Most of us here are modifiers of one sort or another, and it is to those, that I pose these questions. Tom.
One other aspect to ponder is that not much has changed in the bottom end of things. GM is making that power in a 350 that has about the same bore and stroke as its predecessors. Almost all of the changes have been in the rest of the motor. I'm sure that, given appropriate funding and today's technology, you could build a similarly versatile motor out of an old Buick 350 block. It would take new heads, intake, ignition, cams, and EFI, but it could be done. GM just has deep pockets and a lot of time on their side. - Freed
Well, I'm not in disagreement with you really, Tom, but there are many members here who don't overheat their 500 hp cars on saturday night. Building such a motor as a relaiable engine for daily driving is difficult, that's why we have guys like Jim W. As far as new carbs and new cylinderheads go, I do not consider a design philospophy change on an old piece of technology to be "new" technology. Just because a cylinder head is redesigned, that dosn't make it a completely new thing to me. It's just an improvement on the old thing. Aluminum heads and even aluminum exhaust manifolds are old hat, and have been around longer than my car. It's just that we Buick guys have had to wait a long time for things like these heads. Same with torque converters. Well, I already have one, so a better one isn't quite the same as putting a new piece of tecnology on the car. I think we should differentiate between "improved parts" and "parts never intended for the engine" Like this: Turbo- not intended for the engine Aluminum Stage 1 cylinder heads- improved part
