Discussion in 'Small Block Tech' started by Mark Demko, Jan 7, 2021.
more like it!
Aside from the heads, intake, and fueling, what exactly is different that makes the LS so responsive to speed parts?
Both the 5.3 LS and 350 Buick have less than a 4" bore
They both have crankshafts, connecting rods, and pistons.
What is the magic to the LS?
Not arguing, just wondering
You inspire me
short answer LS I don't know it just does I would have to talk to my Corvette guys I know from cleve..
you go 12.80 that will be impressive
This is the most sbb talk I've heard in awhile......I can see a problem with the 350 head circle......it sounds like the heads are cast awaiting machining, there are a few pull that have completed sets.......some very patiently waiting........but getting them out will maybe drive up demand......but maybe not.....you can sell them if not machined.....so where does this circle end between whatever the reason is they are rolling out slow. I know TA does alot in house with few staff. But seems there are always stuck in another overlapping circle of getting parts themself.
The covif stuff isn't helping anyone's parts needs.......hell comp cams doesn't even hydraulic tappet lifters for sbc and bbc.....which just means getting buick parts that were already behind are going to be that much farther behind.
I would have to believe that TA could sell more parts if they could turn them out faster......I'm sure they know this and are working on it......but even the step of hiring or trying to take away from being able to produce stuff. I dont know what the answer is to fix the circle......and get it opened up......but it constantly seem like one thing leads to another problem.
I'm not bashing TA here, it's a problem faced but many small business, that have more than they can handle themselves, but not able to trust outsider to do work to great standards.......not a great supply of replacement parts if they get messed up, but is the demand going to last long enough to expand.....its a tough circle for sure
Come to think of it, I think the intake spacer was brought up when someone asked Mike at TA about building a raised intake runner head..
So So pretty Keith!
My timing must have been perfect, I ordered the heads, cam, roller rockers, Johnson lifters, all around turkey day and nothing was on back order and had the heads and cam in less than 2 months. when I ordered the heads there was only 2 more sets left.
I ended up going with the exhaust shim kit, the rockers were just touching the valve springs.
Hope to be firing it up in the next couple days.
Yes 100% of the problem is finding good help that you can afford. They are doing very good considering but it’s not easy to be profitable. There has been no delay or back orders on 350 heads, they sold a bunch of sets and hundreds more people are optimistic and watching.
I actually feel for TA, there a relatively small parts company, family run and committed to quality, if they ARE overloaded with orders and short on parts that’s a good thing and bad thing, I heard from Mike awhile back it’s tough to keep good people.
Well hurry up and report back
What kind of mods are in your 350 Skylark now? Trying to see like all of us as to what these heads can do?
Also maby you know, did he have 50 sets of the 350 heads cast first. They are also sold??
Would of been nice if all the buyers were members here
About that LS horsepower and what's different: Let's start with the biggest difference, the camshaft. The LS comes with a roller cam and we all know that gives you more area under the lift curve which translates directly into more air in the cylinder and more power. So that's the biggie and is the reason why roller cams are now available for both versions of the SBB.
Next is chamber design. The LS chamber has evolved from a long line of development and is now pretty well optimized. The SBB chamber? A bit less so but I understand the TA chamber pretty is pretty similar to the LS design.
And the rest, as mentioned is just common parts. You have piston crown and runner/intake design and that's really about all that is left except for EFI and COP ignition, both of which can also help.
So even though the little things do add up, it is now possible to build a SBB that should give very similar performance results to the LS.
My current build is a fair example. First, the TA(Rover) heads, next a near stock spec roller cam, '411 ECM out of an '02 Camaro with COP and pistons with a hemispherical dish which appears to be the latest greatest thing. Light valves and springs and instead of a hot cam I'll be adding a blower. This engine should be competitive with an LS of similar build. I don't know of any reason why it wouldn't be.
Been there done that Ben. It's unbelievably frustrating. A few on here would know of my old company if I divulged it. Never a complaint on product quality. Never ending complaints re: customer service & lead times and it wasn't that we didn't care. We were overwhelmed and underfunded. Felt like how it must've felt at Kenne-Bell back in the '80's & early '90's. We all remember calling endlessly and once you got through being on hold for an hour. Yet there were some of my customers that had a stellar experience. Timing was everything and mainly was whether we had the raw materials in stock.
Then there's the limited resources for development of new products that you know there's a demand for & the lost opportunities. Again, unbelievably frustrating. I'm 100% sure TA never expected the 350 head project to take so long to come to fruition. Mike T. probably would've bet $ on it back when that original thread was started.
It usually, if not always comes down to being under-capitalized as most small businesses are. The solution is investors which brings on a whole new set of problems. I'd bet if TA wanted to raise $1M they could (over $1M you start getting into a whole new world of SEC & State regs.) - There's probably 200 of us in the Buick community that would invest $5k ea. but then Mike doesn't own the company anymore (maybe he already had/has equity partners - I don't know). It's a tough road. Beleive me, I know...
Most info in my Winter project thread.
JE pistons at zero deck, 10:1 comp.
Enlarged oil passages and pick up
Stock 68 rods, polished crank, balanced
Headers, 2 1/2" exhaust
With mild flat tappet cam, dual plane manifold, 750DP carb, bone stock iron heads, TH400 trans, 3:23 posi, 7000ft DA, (track elev. over 5300ft., high 90's temp) best time of 14.1, 98mph.
Im gonna give it a hell of a try
Thats some nice numbers considering every weather related specs were against you. High 90's temp wow.
The 3.23 out back also..
The track is in Alb. New Mexico, no shade, some days in the low 100's. I usually only go in the spring and fall. Opening day is in 3rd week of March and usually runs till a week before thanksgiving. 1/4mi. track.
I moved a year ago farther south about 1 1/2 hrs. north of El Paso, the closest track now is 1/8mi.
If I get a check from uncle Joe I am going to redo rearend with new axles and maybe 3:73's
My 1st 350 really came alive w/3.73's (M-21, KB MKII cam (mild), TA intake, headers, stock '70 Hi-Comp bottom end/heads). I was running 14.0 @104 - My 60' times were awful & I didn't know squat about tuning but at that speed it was making good power. I'd gone from 3.23 to 3.42 to 3.73 and it got progressively better. These 350's also seem to really like the 4-sp. Even KB's build in the '80's showed that. I'm curious what mine would've run w/an automatic &/or an M-20.