1961 Buick Invicta Bubbletop - $58500

https://dayton.craigslist.org/cto/d/1961-buick-invicta-bubbletop/6512847325.html

 

Well, I have to say the 61 is probably the best suited look for a hot rod or a resto-mod. This thing looks neat. Looks like there is a lot of work in this too, but there's no way he's going to recoup his investment.

 

nice car , has been for sale a short time not quite same league the red car hes comparing it to

 

Nice car, love it actually, but it's a $35K tops car. You can get some spectacular looking 61's for a whole lot less money

 

I absolutely LOVE the looks of these cars.........but at that price I would "at least" expect a good set of disc brakes. Four wheel drum brakes on a resto-mod like this should not be..........especially not at that price. On a "concourse" restoration yes, but if you're going to do a resto-mod and ask nearly $60K......no. Am I wrong? That just seems "cheesy" to me.

 

No sir, you aren't wrong one iota. It's an absolutely gorgeous car that I am envious of, but isn't up to that kind of money for what's done.

 

Love the car, but the stance isn’t perfect to me, the red one I assume has air ride...looks perfect to me

 

Who needs discs with 12" Al-Fins? 1960 Invicta road test (new) : 60-0 brake test, 138' on those squirrely 4" bias ply tires.

 

Yeah, those drums will stop like that. Once in a row.

 

It's here also at $65000.00......including shipping. Such a deal.

https://www.carexportamerica.com/us...&minyear=0&maxyear=0&stock=&today=&one_owner=

 

Car Life, 11/67 road test, '68 Riviera ~
front vented discs/ rear iron drums: # of stops from 80 MPH before 20% loss in deceleration rate : 2

Car Life, 9/67 road test, '67 Wildcat ~
front finned aluminum drums/ rear iron drums: # of stops from 80 MPH before 20% loss in deceleration rate : 6

Fantastic brakes, those Buick Al-Fins, not comparable to any other drums.

 

Agreed on them being great for what they are, Mark, but comparable to discs, they aren't. There's a reason everything save for econoboxes have discs now, and even they have discs on the front. My Riv still has the drums, and with good tires, I get brake fade just driving the mountain roads around here.

 

Wonder how the magazines got such good results in their instrumented testing? Buick provided 'ringers' with non-stock parts?

Car Life, '68 Buick GS400, 4-wheel drums (assumed iron- were A-Body aluminum drums available in '68?) ~
# of stops from 80 MPH before 20% loss in deceleration rate : 8 / no fade.
"Our 8 panic stops from 80 MPH produced less than 20% loss in deceleration rate and pedal effort remained reasonable throughout the exercise. It was still possible to lock the rear wheels on the last stop."

Same '68 Riviera road test mentioned above :
"The 1968 Riviera test car was equipped with optional front disc brakes, in place of the excellent finned aluminum drum units standard on all full-size Buicks. Fade resistance and brake effectiveness were not noticeably superior to previous Buicks equipped with drum brakes. A road test of the 1966 Riviera, with drum brakes all around, showed that car to have superior fade resistance to the 1968 disc/drum version."

Car Life, '69 Riviera, disc/drums ~
# of stops from 80 MPH before 20% loss in deceleration rate : 4

Maybe the early Buick / GM discs weren't all that great. Still, if the big finned drums can do 60-0 in 138' on skinny bias plys, I'm willing to try them out on radials at high speed.

 

Because compared to the disc brakes in their infancy in the 50s and 60s, drums were fine and compared quite well. Drum technology was essentially at its height, discs were just getting going. If drums are better, where are they today?

Furthermore, those road tests were performed on bias ply tires. You aren't suggesting bias tires are safer, better tires than radials, are you?

 

My Riv has new take off Goodyear Eagle F1s from a new Vette on it and stock drums i rebuilt. Believe me, the tires will far out drive the brakes.

 

Link to the red car hes comparing this one too https://www.mecum.com/lots/LN1117-298019/1961-buick-invicta-custom-bubble-top/
Yes air ride

On the brake discussion since 67 wildcats were brought up, my old 67 would bring that big girl to a stop damn good with everything in good shape new master,wheel cylinders rubber hoses. So I agree that a well built 4 drum system can work good in tip top shape.But not every car would perform that good.Im glad my 61 has vette disc brakes.

I think part of the point is this seller is asking good dollars and trying to go for the resto- mod buyer and hes missing something most guys in that market want as far as brake conversions and air ride suspension. At least adjustable coil over springs.
Hes got a car that's not quite stock not quite resto- mod and asking high dollar modified price. These cars seem to bring much more modified than stock and he hasn't modified this car to the price hes asking.

 

That sure as heck wasn't happening to my 60 Invicta when I owned it! Oh, wait; it had sat in a bush for 25 years and the drums had been delaminating in the dirt and the wheel cylinders were no good, that might have had something to do with it, if not that, then the fact that they weren't power brakes and the master cylinder was wheezy...

I have the drums on both of my big Buicks, and they've never, ever let me down. On both cars they will lock up and stop that car as fast as it takes for the tires to burn off. A good option would to have a little putty knife come out of the glove box and scrape your face off the windshield. And the last time I tested how good they work is when I locked them up in the foothills near Edson on the highway doing 85 mph; - there was a herd of deer on the highway 16 and I came around a corner and saw them, hammered on the brakes, putting the car in a sideways skid. It must have been a combination of the noise of the screaming tires, me screaming like a little girl and 2-1/2 tons of red roofless steel coming at them where most of them bolted towards the bush. I was convinced I'd be driving one home with me. There were one or two that just stood there in front of the car after I stopped it with a sort of "what," expression going on, unfortunately when they decided to move, the semi that came flying up behind me and had to swerve because of me being stopped made short work of them.
A year later, same stretch of road except now with my 01 LeSabre; - what are the chances, same herd, same time of year, same idiot driver speeding, except the ABS kicked in and wouldn't let me lock them up. Sure, the car didn't go into a skid, and it stopped in around the same distance. Piled up the transmission and killed the motor, it didn't know what hit it. So no great improvement in distance but a lot more control; I could drive around them when it didn't stop in time.
Now I slow down when I get to that area. But the long and the short of it is there is nothing wrong with the Buick Aluminum finned drums, as long as everything is ship-shape. After my experiences with the early discs in the mid-seventies boats, I have to conclude that I actually like the drums better, but that is just my opinion.

 

"I think part of the point is this seller is asking good dollars and trying to go for the resto- mod buyer and hes missing something most guys in that market want as far as brake conversions and air ride suspension. At least adjustable coil over springs.
Hes got a car that's not quite stock not quite resto- mod and asking high dollar modified price. These cars seem to bring much more modified than stock and he hasn't modified this car to the price hes asking."

Hit the nail on the head!!!

 

Bias ply tires are a detriment to braking performance- they have smaller contact patches and more tread deflection (everything else being equal). That's where 138' on bias plys is that much more significant.

 

I know, Mark, I was just being a smarta$$.....Sorry, didn't mean to derail this thread....I think as Roy stated, it's just an expected thing that a car of this build style and price SHOULD have a 4 wheel disc brake swap, at least in most people's eyes. I know when I park somewhere in my car, the drums are first thing that people point out/complain about on my car....And I agree with them that with a lowered, custom wheel car, there should be a nice shiny set of big aftermarket 4 wheel discs, no matter how well the drums work.