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Tips on aligning 455 engine mounts to frame pads.

Discussion in 'Street/strip 400/430/455' started by Bogus919, Mar 6, 2022.

  1. Bogus919

    Bogus919 Silver Level contributor

    Hey all… I’m tapping out on figuring this out myself and looking for some wisdom. I put the 455 in my GS last week but have yet to be able to get the long bolts to go through the mounts and pads cleanly. I can get it aligned so that I can put a bolt halfway through the drivers side front but not all the way through and the front passenger side shows about 3/4 of the frame hole. Both the rear mount holes look like they need the mounts to tilt down in order for it to alight correctly for a bolt to go through.

    So far I’ve hooked a chain to both sides of the engine and with a hoist I have slowly lifted it up and then tried to wiggle it into place. I’ve done this and also used a heavy screw driver and tried to pry it into place through the mount holes while the full load was not on the mounts. I’ve unbolted the trans cross member and moved it about a foot closer to the rear and used a small trolly jack to lift and lower the whole setup (engine is mounted to trans) up and down to see if I could wiggle it into place. I’ve allowed the trans to droop (until the driveshaft touched the cross member so not a ton) to see if that would help and so far nothing.

    I only have a few more ideas in the bag of tricks… one being to completely remove the trans cross member to allow even further droop… then if I have to maybe lifting up the front of the engine as well. (I have some grade 8 bolts at all corners of the heads)

    I’m really trying to avoid pulling the engine again. What would you suggest?

    I have the aluminum frame pads and the big block mounts. I’ve double checked the pad and mount locations on the block and frame. They are correct, it just appears to be a small alignment issue that I can’t get.

    thanks

    front middle
    upload_2022-3-6_19-8-13.jpeg

    Front passenger
    upload_2022-3-6_19-8-49.jpeg

    Front driver
    upload_2022-3-6_19-9-44.jpeg


    rear drivers side… passenger looks similar
    upload_2022-3-6_19-11-13.jpeg
     
  2. Brett Slater

    Brett Slater Super Moderator Staff Member

    I had a similar issue when I put mine back in with new mounts. Thankfully, I did it at my buddy's shop and he gave me a foot long, heavy duty punch tool.

    I lined it up, whacked it with a hammer and viola!
     
    Bogus919 likes this.
  3. Bogus919

    Bogus919 Silver Level contributor

    Brett, what part did you hit with a hammer? I have a 6 inch long tapered punch that I could attempt to drive into the hole to see if it aligns. It’s diameter isn’t greater than the mount hole so it probably will be fine.
     
  4. Smartin

    Smartin antiqueautomotiveservice.com Staff Member

    Drift. Or big ass punch like Brett said.
     
    Bogus919 likes this.
  5. Brett Slater

    Brett Slater Super Moderator Staff Member

    The part that you'd typically whack with it. The top, flat part.
     
    Bogus919 and Houndogforever like this.
  6. Bogus919

    Bogus919 Silver Level contributor

    Thanks guys...Brett, I think when you said "I lined it up, whacked it with a hammer and viola!" I didn't understand where you were putting the punch/drift. But what I think you meant was was you lined it up into the hole and drove the punch/drift into the mount hole to force it open. That's what I will do... thanks for the tip.
     
    Last edited: Mar 7, 2022
    Brett Slater likes this.
  7. hugger

    hugger Well-Known Member

    I always take a grinder and clean the excess rubber off the inside of the mounts,...clean the sides of the frame mount with the grinder to just make it smooth and then some grease or Vaseline on the sides,....Bastard will jump on the mounts then
     
    sean Buick 76, Bogus919 and 1973gs like this.
  8. Brett Slater

    Brett Slater Super Moderator Staff Member

    The punch works well.

    You're very welcome.
     
  9. Briz

    Briz Founders Club Member

    Why not loosen the frame pads and get the bolts in place then retighten all the bolts?
     
    12lives and john.schaefer77 like this.
  10. Brett Slater

    Brett Slater Super Moderator Staff Member

    Those frame pads are an absolute b1tch to work with without an engine on top of them, nevermind with one installed.
     
    schwemf likes this.
  11. hugger

    hugger Well-Known Member

    Not gonna move with weight on them and the issue is the excess rubber not placement
     
  12. Bogus919

    Bogus919 Silver Level contributor

    Thanks Hugger, I had read that somewhere else on this forum and cut all that extra rubber off before I started. I actually mocked this up on the stand to make sure they would alight but unfortunately that all changes when you get the pads on the frame and the angle is slightly different. I think the punch setup will work. I have some room on the passenger rear side because the starter is out... the drivers side will be a bit more trouble because of everything that is in the way but I'm gonna give it a try and see.

    I had thought maybe loosening the bolts on the mounts themselves and see if I can get the long bolts in then ..... and then tighten them back down but then it dawned on me that they are torqued at about 100ft pounds and there's no way I can get in there with a small half inch ratchet and take that off with the limited clearances.

    I was one of those guys who installed the frame pads WITHOUT removing the lower control arms... so yea, it took maybe 3 hours to get those 6 bolts removed and then reinstalled with the new pads. I'd like to avoid touching them now if I could lol

    I'm doing all this on my back too btw, no lifts, just jack stands.
     
  13. BQUICK

    BQUICK Gold Level Contributor

    I've done frame pads too without removing control arms....lots of finessing with 1/4 sockets and universals.
    The issue I had was that I was trying to use 1970 LeSabre 455 mounts that had dimples that locate in the frame pads that were holding the mount up since I was using different frame pads. After trying to drop hard onto the frame pads and enlarging holes (at 2am at a buddy's house) to no avail we finally saw the dimples and ground them off and went right on.
     
    Last edited: Mar 7, 2022
    mbryson and Bogus919 like this.
  14. rkammer

    rkammer Gold Level Contributor

    Does this problem still exist when removing an old motor and installing a new one? Frame pads stay in place and new engine pads installed on the new motor.
    Should I prep the new pads?
     
  15. hugger

    hugger Well-Known Member

    Yes clean the pads on the inside and measure the widths,..takes 2min to do and will save a potential embarrassing cursing and mental breakdown
     
  16. 12lives

    12lives Control the controllable, let the rest go

    FYI - Anchor mounts have lots of excess rubber -The TA mounts do not (at least mine don't). Any issues using the TA mounts?
     
  17. Bogus919

    Bogus919 Silver Level contributor

    These mounts were branded "Westar" and were probably a generic remake. The metal cast of the mount had some round holes in it where rubber was protruding through it into the area where the frame pad would sit so I shaved it all down flat. These mounts were a tight fit anyway with the "ear" portion of them where the mounting holes is for the frame pad seemed to be a close fit... I had to tap them into place with a mallet when I mocked everything up on the engine stand... figured with 500+ mounds sitting on it there would be no problem with it sitting flush on the pad. I can confirm that everything fit fine on the stand so it's just maybe a slight angle difference now that the pads can't free float in the air and have to sit on the car frame.
     
    Last edited: Mar 7, 2022
  18. rkammer

    rkammer Gold Level Contributor

    You mean this side? What's the dimension of the width? Or, just make sure it's wider than the frame pads? Also don't remember that the mounts have two sets of holes on both sides?
    455 Motor Mounts.JPG
     
  19. Bogus919

    Bogus919 Silver Level contributor

    Ray, see those two black dots on the base of the one on the left (also on the right but hidden). That's where the rubber was pushed out and I had to shave it back to make it flat. For my case, my pads fit into that section fine, I just had to tap them in a little but nothing crazy. I'm assuming this is the location where ppl are having issues with rubber pushing out and interfering. The frame pads only have hole on each side... but the engine mounts themselves have two as you can see in your pic) and also there are a few different spots the other side of the engine mount can bolt up to the block. I assume this is for the different model cars each year.
     
    rkammer likes this.
  20. GNandGS

    GNandGS Well-Known Member

    This. I had this experience some time in the 80's so for some of you it is a reasonable quick thing to check.
     

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