So I'm debating about thinking of building a 523 4.4 stroker. I'd like to hear from others about their experience pros and cons. I'm going to have to do something as my 464 made its mind it didn't like the molnar rod in #5 hole. I was at Norwalk this past wed. 1st pass ran right what I would had guessed....on pass 2 as I got close to the top of 2nd....it seemed to fall flat for just a tick....started to shake very hard and I clicked it off to a cloud of smoke. After some quick inspection all lifters in place and all valves move...a leak down shows great results in 5 of 8 holes...but 100% leak on 5 and 7 and 25 on 6. Piston 5 doesn't move but sitting there at the bottom...and 7 moves. The block has damage to the point it leaked water and oil on the track.....so its gone. Motor still cranks with starter and actually doesn't feel bad with the starter.......so hopefully crank is usable for something else and maybe save the billet main caps. Cam, lifters, pushrods and rockers all seem OK as of now......it appears most of the head and valves should be good......with 3-5% leakage on 5 of 8 cylinder its a great sign.....I might bolt the drivers head onto the passenger side just to do a quick leak down check of valves from 5 and 7....thar would put them on 2 and 4 which tested as close to perfect as could be expected with a cold motor. So when I get time to check more out I will, but for now I'd love to hear the good bad and ugly from other stroker owners. I know molnar makes a crank and rods....but till I get more time to look and figure out the cause of failure......molnar rods might not go back in.......but there is other bbc options for sure.......eagle has beefy rods for under 400 that 800+rated. Parts I have sitting in the shelf NOS never fired 76 block, girdles for bottom end and cam i would assume i front cover and scavenger system should be good......they were new 68 passes ago and had over 100 psi when it let go. Ill put new gears in.....but thats very little money.
I have a 523 in a prostreet car. I had major issues with it due to poor workmanship from the original builder. Once I repaired the original builders screw ups, it has been a great engine. You should probably disassemble your current engine to see what if anything can be reused. Your new engine build may be determined by what parts are currently available. It seems like many parts are scarce.
Who's crank and rods are in your setup. Plan to check it all out top to bottom, but I know the block is a goner. I'm just hoping the heads don't have anything major
I’ve always liked to do stroker builds. Do you want to use a stock crank for a 482 or 494,or get a billet and go to the next level.
Seeing I'm having to start with a new block on this one........im thinking the 523. Dad and I wanted do one, its why we bought some of the base parts needed. I know stepping up to the 4.4 stroke will add alot of parts expense, but I really don't see the 482 going to make that much more than 464 did.......and in doing a 482 its not that many of my current saveable parts could be reused in the bottom end....dampner and flex plate.....my crank isn't 0/0 crank so it might not even be able to be offset ground.......and that motor might make 20-30 more than a 464 with the exact same cam and top end??? My gut is telling me save up and do the big build....... This 464 as well as ran compared to my last one always seemed a touch short on power than what I thought it should had been. My iron head 464 went 11.0s.....it would on cool fall 1/8th events put down times that would convert to upper 10.90s. This 464 when it was new went 10.75...6.78 in the 1/8 on its first full 1/4 mile pass.....and the pass b4 it blew it went 10.77......6.79 in the 1/8th In the same cool fall race it went as fast as 6.53......so that should had been mid 10.30s. But I never got to run the long track in those weather conditions. So if i compair best to best, and the big difference in the 2 motors being the old hard ported iron heads and the new had ported te2 heads there was a decent gain......but I always felt there was more in it somewhere.
Ben, Sorry to hear of the misfortune on your engine... I'm going to throw out another idea. I'm becoming more of a believer in the "stock crank in a Tomahawk" deal. I know the billet crank is only half the cost of the aluminum block, but then you have to pay for a girdle and all the machine/prep work. The when you're done you still have keep your fingers crossed that the machine work was good. And on top of that, you've added about 50+ pounds to the front of your car. Just a thought.
Gary has a point, until this years nationals, I had no idea how many guys are running stock cranks in Tomahawk blocks.. Some of them are even power adder. Timmy
I had AMP build the 523 in the GSX. It's been a great engine with no major issues of any kind. It has a total of 155 passes on it. It was dynoed at 819HP and 711 Tq. Too bad Mike is enjoying his retirement now, instead of building these fine Buick engines!!
The aluminum block and a billet crank would be the best of both,but that might not be in the cards. Have a billet crank made. You can end up with a fairly light one which will have multiple benefits.
I love Mike's work, he did my 1st 464 that had almost 2500 I passes on it b4 it got a pinhole in a # 4 and started taking on water. He refreshed my current motor and it went 3 passes..... He had my NOS block and girdle down there for almost 2 years and nothing was even started......I know he has earned his retirement and I'm thankful for the work he has down for me and the buick world.
I'd love to have a great block.....the total cost of all the bandaid work is the #1 reason I haven't pushed and have this block farther along. I got a great deal on the girdles when I bought them.......but im certain that to fully prep and installed the girdle on the block is going to be close to 2000, and the a custom oil pan to go with it is close to another 1000. This along makes the possibility of the KBR cast iron block attractive........but its not here. I called KBR last week to inquire about their 523 kit but yet to get a call back. I know others had had crank made from others in strokes ranging from 4.05-4.5. For those of us.....aka me, that don't know much about custom cranks...what are key features that I should look for
My approach would be,....a very nice worked stock crank,...crower rods,...bullet caps,...simple halo gridle,...half fill,...deburr the block really well and a very nice light piston with a heavy pin I wouldn't Fool with a full girdle I feel like Tom has a nice product but being of Chinese material I think maybe you're gonna have some not so perfect batches,....I've got a set in my 494,..so fingers crossed but there are alot of Molnars out there,....Busher has them in his heavy hitter blower setup,..I got them from Tom and were the first set of his xtreme power adder rods tho
I wouldn't count on another block besides the Tomahawk. I know people waiting on the most common brand of iron blocks because the foundries are so backed up. You'll grow old waiting. As far as aftermarket cranks. Center counter weights are good. Some weight reduction can help. There aren't many options, and the lead times can be well over a year. Years back I had a Nailhead crank sitting in a 455 block, they're plenty beefy. But only 3.64 stroke, so you give up some CI and torque which would be challenging since your car is still quite heavy.
Given what my schedule looks like itvwill be a few weeks b4 I can my old motor of and see how bad it is. This still turns over by hand without much effort. I had the filter apart just b4 this outing and there was no signs of any debris. I'm leaning to this being a parts failure.......which if thats the case will leave me wondering if the next set or parts from molnar will hold up. But the parts they make will more than likely be my best chance to get a longer throw crank without waiting 12-24 months
I have abused my TA alloy block to the point of prob going thru 4-5 cast iron factory blocks. The cheaper option always ends up expensive
