I ran a set of Wiesco .052 deep,...ran them in 3 different engines,...bought them back in 2003,.. 464 9.80 to 1 comp mild flat tappet hydro cam,.. aluminum stage 1 heads,...no real port work worth mentioning,...4100lbs 342 gear drag radials,...3800stall,...11.40s at 114mph ran and raced with 93octane
I have a set of them in the engine I'm building. Uncut 75-76 block, the stock pistons were .085-.087 down in it, these are .040-.042". Not perfect by any means, with the cometic .027" gasket I'm still well above that .039-.045" that seems to be a common rule for quench. At 9.6:1 static it should be fine on 93 octane. I can't speak for the slap issue as it hasn't been fired yet, but they seem well made, all very uniform in weight. The machinist liked them. No doubt the autotec seem to be the way to go for getting it perfect. I got a good deal on the wiseco's, they're still about 100 grams lighter than the stock pistons, and they'll do fine for my street engine. I don't think there's any one right answer here judging by the responses, that's just my experience. YMMV
This plays to my point. There's been an uncountable amount of real hot 455s built with off the shelf pistons using stock rods and stock stroke cranks. There isn't a thing wrong with the stock rods! The sentiment on this site is using anything but custom pistons/rods with a perfect zero deck is subpar. All sorts of cars have been deep into the 11s and 10s this way. It's possible to build a 455 this way with a reasonable budget.
Those same Pistons were in my 700hp pump gas build,...the Procharged setup,..and then was sold to Jeff Hart who far as I know used it in his wife's hotrod,...and when I mean the same Pistons i mean the exact same set haha BUT,...with what the drop in Monar rods cost,..I don't see me using stock rods again,... simply because the price difference isn't too terrible,..and with them comes piece of mind I'm still a 464 guy because I'm not positive I can have the crank ground correctly and would probably cause more harm than good,...the performance difference between a 464 and a 470 or 482 is very little,...and in a race application where you aren't interested in the little extra bottom end grunt the few extra cid provide,..there is even less cause for it,...jmo
It really depends on your budget and intended purpose. I am not saying using used or off the shelf pistons is sub par in any way. I'm just saying that there are better parts available, at an added expense of course, that make for a more efficient, and versatile engine looking forward. What I mean by versatile is, someone builds an engine with iron heads. Maybe later on, they want to go with aluminum heads as an upgrade. In a situation like that, you already have a better basis for doing so. You need more static compression with aluminum heads to get the best out of them. You are in a better position with a zero deck short block to get there. I would rather spend more money in the beginning with an eye toward the future improvements. With the current state of pump gasoline, and the many problems some have with elevated coolant temperature, I want the best detonation resistance I can get, another reason for zero deck. Detonation is sure death for our engines, especially if you run it at the track at some point. Every one's priorities and realities are different. I say take advantage of better parts when you can. Most of us just want to do this once, let the motor be all it can be, now and in the future.
Larry all your points are true and valid. Please don't take my previous post as a jab. These boards can be dangerous with the amount of information they shell out. I simply trying to let the OP know that the wiseco pistons are a viable option. To make that decision he needs to figure out the deck height with the block he is using and then select a rotating assembly after weighing costs vs wants vs reality.
Same here, no foul intent, you can't hear a person's tone over a written text and it's easy to forget that. I do it more than I wish I did myself. I just want a fun street car that runs good and packs a punch. With ported/stage 1 valve'd 430 heads and a ta 212, I think they will do me nicely, so I figured it would compare well to OP, as his goals seem to be near identical to mine.
No worries guys I am sure we have given Matt some valuable information that he can use to make his decisions. That has been my intent all along. I welcome other views always. It is what makes V8buick such an awesome resource for Buick owners.
Yes.. you must rebalance.. if you want a smooth engine. The factory balance was "ok" in the first place, but rough compared to the results of what comes off the balancer of a skilled machinist. I have not used the Wiseco pistons in about 10 years, I had one set that was so noisy at startup, I had to, at my own expense, replace that set with some SRP's from TA. I would not give the motor back to my customer with that noise in it. When I called Wiseco to talk to them about it, all I got back from the guy on the phone was "Ya, we know about that, we are in the midst of re-designing everything".. So in other words, you sell me junk so you can make a buck.. Gee thanks buddy.. Any kind of reputable business would have pulled the product, until it was corrected. That ended my time as a Wiseco customer. I build mostly strokers these days, I will tell you, they advantage they have has little to do with CI.. the reduction in block stress and better ring sealing due to the reduction in angularity at TDC promotes more power and longer engine life. The 6.800 rod is the key here to these combos. They also allow the lightest pistons in the industry for this level of engine. My 470 pistons are 615 grams, my 482's are 590 G. These are serious perf pistons weight numbers, the average "performance" BBB piston is over 700 grams. Not only do the longer rods and extra stroke allow us to build a shorter piston, I also specify the Superlite milling process, for all my stuff. It's extra cost, but worth it. In looking at the Wiseco pistons they offer now (the Pro Tru is the new line) I will tell you that the CD is still too short at 1.980 and the dish too small at 22cc. I also have never been a fan of the reverse dome type piston, as they naturally setup a piston inbalance that affects performance and ring seal. The included ring set is of questionable origin.. Chinese? probably.. that is how they can give them away for free. And I suspect the "re-design" was simply to add the skirt coating, to keep the piston slap down to a dull roar.. I am not impressed for nearly $600.. If your building a 464, do yourself a favor and get a set of TA 1611B's... they have the correct CD, but you will have to play around with the chambers size and/or gasket to get the right static compression ratio, with that 20cc dish. But they are a much better piston in my opinion, and worth the extra money. JW
