I did a quick search but only found old postings regarding converting to hyd clutch and didn't seem to find answers i was looking for so here goes..... I have a 71 lark with gs factory 4 speed pedal set up, 455 with shorty headers, TA flywheel, Centerforce II clutch, Richmond super street 5 speed tranny w/od. So i had been talking with Mcleod industries about a camaro type master cyl kit from them with a internal slave or release bearing. They indicated i would need an adaptor from American Touring Specialties (ATS) http://store.nexternal.com/shared/S...reType=BtoC&Count1=868572413&Count2=785712838 to get the correct angle at the firewall, then i noticed in the Mcleod book they seem to sell the same bracket? Anyways the guy at ATS say unless i have a T56 tranny I will have limited sucess ie...may not work well for hyd setup i'm after? The cost will be over a grand for a setup which may not work. Personnally i wasn't too keen on an internal slave cyl from the start cause i don't want to pull the tranny if it screws up or doesn't work right. So my next option is the external slave cyl setup and i have found a kit here http://www.novak-adapt.com/catalog/kit_hcrb.htm which looks ok but i was wondering what type of master cyl should i be researching to work with the slave cyl. Then i was informed that a clutch for a hyd release is different then the mechanical release, damn...... my last option will be to run the stock mechanical setup.. bellcrank..etc... So my questions are..... 1. who's done a hydraulic conversion setup? 2. what kind of setup? internal slave? external slave? 3. What kind of sucess? 4. Are you happy with the results? 5. Who was the supplier? p.s. sorry to flog a dead horse here if this has been talked about before, and this is a pro tour/ resto mod driver not a race car, thanks again for all your advice guys.....:beers2: Gord
i know nothing about those clutches. why do you want to go that way. i would leave your vehicle with what it came with. those new clutches can not be that easier to push. jim
I did the conversion using a Howe hydraulic throw out bearing using a wilwood mastercylinder. hardest part was figuring the angle for the master on the firewall, as you know. I did a whole thread on the conversion a while back that included all the measurements to make the bracket. I think I even listed all the part numbers I used as well. It worked really well. so well I grenaded the muncie... Let me know if i can help. Joe
I am in the process of doing one now on a 65 special, it's a 455 with a Tremec 5 speed. I am using a 3/4" master cylinder from wilwood with the remote reservoir. I fabbed a bracket to hold it at the correct angle on the firewall. I am also using the novak slave cylinder. One thing I did find is that the front of the slave cylinder will hit the bottom of your exhaust manifold if you use them. I looked at the shorty's but I think they will also hit the slave cylinder. I went with the full length t/a headers. I haven't installed them yet but they look like they will clear. If you get the novak kit make sure you get the same size cylinder in the slave & the master. The Novak kit was $200, the master was about $100. I still need to have a hose made up, so the total price is going to be less than $350.
Joe, I used your mesaurements to build my bracket:beer Here are a few pics of the wilwood, bracket & novak slave, bracket that mounts to the bellhousing.
ask and you will recieve..... thanks for all the info guys and Joe i did read your post but it looked like you did this a few years ago and maybe i didn't read far enough to see how you liked the overall setup. Frank my car is lowered 2" so i went with the shorty headers, can you or Joe post a pic of the slave cyl installed showing interferance with the exhaust system? One last thing...how much stroke are you guys using on the wilwood master cyl? with the Mcleod master cyl they only wanted max 1" stroke, thanks again Gord p.s. sorry Jim but some of us just can't leave good things alone.....
I don't have the exhaust manifolds anymore so I can't get a pic. I should have my headers intalled in about a week, I can post a pic of them with the slave cylinder. The flange on the exhaust manifold was hitting the very back of the slave cylinder. You may be safe with the shorty headers but it will be close. I think you can grind a bit of metal off the slave if it's close.
I didn't use a slave cylinder, I used a Howe Bearing. Its a hydraulic throw out bearing that expands to depress the clutch. really slick, fits right inside the bellhousing. only 2 braided lines going into the bellhousing, no interference issues whatsover. And it was awesome to drive, very fast quick shifts!
Frank, whenever you get pics that'd be great. Be carefull to shield your slave from the hot exhaust as the oil may expand and you may loose your freeplay? Joe, whats your master cylinder set up look like, are you also using a wilwood master? Gord
I think those are internal slave cylinder is that right??? What do you guys think:- internal throw out bearing vs -external throw out bearing with fork wich is better, more reliable, and fits with long tube hooker headers??...
if you spring a leak, you're gunna wish you got the external type... as far as fitting with headers, i don't knowo No:
yep thats the drawback for the internal slave for sure.....many mechs don't like them cause its a big job to repair. And if a guy has clutch release issues you can't see inside to see whats going on. At least with the external slave you can trouble shoot alot easier. What about a Pull type external slave instead of a push type. That way no issues with the hot exhaust? I am going to contact Keisler, they have the whole kit and it looks decent? My problem going with an external slave is that you still have to use the adjustable pivot ball and arm. Some guys say they that the adjustable ball can come loose over time? I'm not going to make a decision on which way I'm going untill I can do more research. Gord
I don't think the clutch cares what operates it. Either a hydraulic thowout bearing or a fork achieves the same result I'd think. I used a RAM hydraulic throw our bearing. The biggest pain is you can't hook up the hydraulics with installed. You connect the lines, slide it into the bellhousing were the clutch fork went and then slide the transmission in. Kind of a pain when working by yourself. If I had to do it again I'd use a slave cylinder. The PULL kind. Then connect it to the clutch fork and to the transmission crossmember. It would be easier and cheaper. On mine I had a heck of a time getting it bled. It's a tiny system but it took forever to get the air out. I suggest assembling the whole system out of the car and getting it properly bled and then installing it in the car.
i have been following this thread and i still do not understand why you guys want to go this way. i am having a keisler 5sp put in my vette. i talked to the guys that are doing the work and they asked if i wanted the hydraulic clutch also. i said i can not put the tranny in myself, so why would i pay to have one put in when the old z bar has worked for 43 years. they laughed and said you do not need one. some day i am going to have to learn all these new things, hydraulic clutches, discs that move rotors that move and have a top hat with it. so damn cornfussing to a old fart like me. so keep writing and maybe i might learn something although i doubt it, hell i do not even know how to work those games you hook up to the tv sets. jim
I just have to get the hydraulic because my car is an automatic, and finding the z bar plus all the rods and hardwares to get it manual clutch would be a much more complicated pain in the ass
here I found a nice exemple: http://home.off-road.com/~nobucks/clutch.html Really nice!!! Now between those 2: http://home.off-road.com/~nobucks/clutch.html and http://www.novak-adapt.com/catalog/kit_hcrb.htm Between the puller and the pusher...??? Both seems great, the puller is almost sure to clear any exhaust (stock manifolds or any headers) system, but is it as reliable to the pusher.Plus the pusher comes with a kit with the right bracket and fork.For the puller you need to figure a way to fix somewhere, but will fit with the original fork, thus, for some of you guys, you dont need to take out the tranny.But I was wondering, if the puller, pull 1 inch and your throw out bearing needs, let say 3/4 inch of travel, then whats gonna happen with the 1/4 inch too much, will it hurt the throw out bearing or the puller or something else..? How do you adjust a puller slave to get the right travel on the throw out bearing??Same for the pusher...
