Hey Olds guys part two;

Discussion in 'The "Other" Bench' started by DirtySanchez, Oct 6, 2004.

  1. realdealHurst

    realdealHurst Well-Known Member

    I would love to put my 68 H/O in this class. And I can definately see the light. And I have all the original type parts to make it happen. If a damn Buick 455 can run the numbers. So can an Olds. The Buick has got to be the craziest design GM big block out there. Who ever came up with that timing cover/oiling needs to be shot! There is no way my military pay will support setting this type of car up though. :rant: :af: How much cash do y'all have in these cars????... :Do No:
     
  2. Bald Menace

    Bald Menace unauthorized user

    Thats exactly the kind of attitude most people have about Buicks. what most people dont realize is just how easy it is to go fast with a Buick big block. i'm not saying that it's easy to do what Greg Does, but it sure isnt hard to get a 4000 lb buick into the low twelves.
     
  3. realdealHurst

    realdealHurst Well-Known Member

    high 12's is easy with about any big block. :spank:
     
  4. NEAT Car Ads

    NEAT Car Ads northeastautotrader.com

    Greg,
    What power to weight ratio would be needed to be competitive?


    Are solid cams allowed?
     
  5. Dave H

    Dave H Well-Known Member

    I guess because I look at what other Olds are running, and what's been done to them. We have lots of Olds in the 11's with headers, some even with stock intakes and Q Jets. We also have lots of Olds in the 10's with stroked diesel blocks, Nascar Blocks, 403's, and a few 455's. Of those only the 455 would be legal because of the castings. That limits you to a 70-72. But 70's and 71's are not light cars as they were pretty well trimmed out 442's. A 72 el strippo may work as the 455 and the W30 package could be ordered on a plain jane lightweight car.

    More power to someone if they want to try it.

    I'll go with what Casey says. Until someone tries it, guess we just won't know, will we? Sure won't be me, though.
     
  6. Mike Kamm

    Mike Kamm Well-Known Member

    Dave, couldn't anyone with a Cutlass body clone a '68 Hurst car and run a 455 in F.A.S.T? Same for a '69 right? :Do No:
     
  7. Dave H

    Dave H Well-Known Member

    Yes, you could clone a 68 or 69 Hurst. I'm sure it's done everyday. The 68 would be much easier since they didn't use any real unique or special parts as they did in the 69 (mirrors, aircleaner). Why, there's even a 68 in process in my garage right now from a W30. Just picked up the Dual gate for it and have everything else except the woodgrain inserts for the dash. A 72 Hurst or a 70 SX would also be a possibility. (especially the 70 SX...just sold ours).

    The 69 -72's could use the chambered W/Z manifolds, but the 68 would have to use the older style non chambered ones. They have different casting numbers, codes, and shape. We're still checking that stuff, right?

    None of these cars used 60 series tires except the 72. The 68 used 14 inch wheels and the 69-72 used 14's and 15's with 70 series tires. The 72 Hurst used G60's, so that may be a better way to go.

    Offset grind cranks (stroker) with Chevy rods, lightweight big bore pistons and rods, a big cam with roller rockers, and fully ported GAheads and W30 intake along with ported W/Z manifolds should get it into the mid 11's but don't know how much the exhaust system will hold that back. No one's tried it.

    I've got a lot of that basic stuff here to build one that I'll be selling off this winter if someone wants to try it. I'm retired now on fixed income, so no way I could ever afford to do something like that anymore. I've got a 455 block (sonic checked and OK to go to .125 overbore), crank, 7 inch rods, Venolia popup pistons, a big Comp Cam, Ga heads, and a Z RH manifold (have an X for the LH side). Good start if somebody has the cabbage to try one.

    Dave
     
  8. DirtySanchez

    DirtySanchez Well-Known Member

    hmmmmmmmmmmm :bglasses:

    Only problem I see going with the 72 Hurst is the "stock sounding cam".

    A 70 would be pretty wide open as they came with 328's in the 4 speed cars and 308's in the auto's.

    Thanks for the tire info Dave. I've been wondering if my car came with F's or G's.

    I'm still kicking this around, but it appears another Olds guy just might be crashing the party next year. :Brow: :laugh: :TU:

    I'd need to find a lightweight, low option Cutlass first. My AC/power brake W machine isn't going to cut it. I do plan to get her into the high 11's though. With the cast manifolds. :3gears:
     
    Last edited: Oct 17, 2004
  9. Mike Kamm

    Mike Kamm Well-Known Member

    That's what we like to hear Sanchez,
    And when you do, it just might reverse all of ancient '70's stereotype thinking about the mighty Old's big blocks and how they supposedly could never compete with cousins Buick and even Pontiac in the F.A.S.T. series. :Dou: No offense Dave. :pp
     
  10. junior supercar

    junior supercar Well-Known Member

    hey, thats exactly what I was thinking about doing. Buddy is thinking the same thing. 68 post, clone it into an H/O. but I need to finish my Pure Stock 69 W-31 first. Of course another project I threw around, which is why I emailed Greg a year ago, was a 71-2 455HO GTO. Was thinking a 72 LeMans post with the GTO option and 455HO. But again, one thing at a time.

    other things to try, like has been mentioned, post based 70-72 442s. another thought is a 72 U code supreme
     
  11. DirtySanchez

    DirtySanchez Well-Known Member

    I love breaking stereotypes. :cool:

    The engine going together for the W30 isn't a typical build. I'm not doing a stroker for this car, but it will have the ported stock intake and other goodies with a custom roller grind. High flow velocity is the goal, along with massive torque. This engine probably won't be ideal for bias plys, but it will be fun.

    Waiting for Mr. Gessler to get back to me about porting my W/Z's. :Brow:
     
  12. Casey Marks

    Casey Marks Res Ipsa Loquitur

    If I had a nickel for EVERYTIME I've heard what a DISASTER the exhaust manifolds are on an Oldsmobile, I'd be able to pay for fuel for my truck to drive to Tim-Buck-Two and back.

    Just because they are not swoopy Hemi or 427 Ford manifolds, they are immediately dismissed as junk. They aren't the best, but DAMN .... each engine combo has its' cross to bear .....

    Kinda like saying what junk bias ply tires are ...... while people bitch about them, folks like Pat Wendling in his Firebird are putting daylight under the left front. :Do No:

    I say bring on the 500+ inch BBOlds with a QJet, nicely thought-out roller cam, TH350, in a 3600# 68-72 .... and let 'er rip ....... I've thought out combos, and would love to do one .... but my heart is with a '71 340 Mopar right now ...... :TU: :beer :Brow:
     
  13. Mike Kamm

    Mike Kamm Well-Known Member

    Chris I like your ideas very much. I do not know if Olds ever made a post H/O or Pontiac a '72 GTO post coupe. But the way I understand it F.A.S.T. cars need to be based on actual cars that were built. There is a really nice green Skylark post coupe GS clone running manifolds right now. Greg and I talked to him at the GS nats this summer. I can't remember his name. I'm sure lots of people on this board know who I'm talking about.

    [​IMG]

    His car runs great, but Buick never made a post coupe GS so the car is not eligible for F.A.S.T. racing. How much lighter than the hardtops are the post coupes anyway? :Do No:
     
    Last edited: Oct 17, 2004
  14. Bad Buick

    Bad Buick Foe Fiddy Five

    The Olds big block will be heard from. Mark my words. To my knowledge Buick never used a 350 tranny or 12 bolt Chebby rear in a Stage 1 car. So some W\Z manifolds and 15x7 rims on a 68 H\O should not be an issue.
     
  15. Greg Gessler

    Greg Gessler GS Stage1

    Bob, You need to look over the rules before building your Olds.

    Here is a link to the F.A.S.T. rules:
     
  16. realdealHurst

    realdealHurst Well-Known Member

    The 68 H/O was made in a post body but they are rare. 70-72 W-30 also. I don't really think there is a significant difference in weight though. A regular Cutlass could be had with a 455 also. So you do not need to clone a rare car to do it. Would it be legal to remove the A/C and replace it with a correct NON-A/C set up? :Brow:
     
  17. junior supercar

    junior supercar Well-Known Member

    Mike, seems we are along the same lines of thinking. As was stated, there were 68 H/O post coupes made, but not many. Like 56 IIRC. As for the GTO, from 68-72 the only time you could get the post body style was in 72, when the GTO went back to being an option. The number of actual 455 HO cars in the post body style is even smaller than 68 post H/O, only like 7. The interesting note, for those that may not know, these are easy to identify as they have an X in the vin for a 455HO, just like 72 W-30s.

    I've seen that post coupe GS before, somewhere. I like the post body styles. Wasn't sure if Buick ever built real GS in a post coupe, but that questioned was answered. I'm sure there were 455 powered Skylark posts, right? Would that be an option for someone?

    As for taking an a/c car and removing that and installed the correct non a/c firewall "patch", I don't see why that can't be done.
     
  18. Mike Kamm

    Mike Kamm Well-Known Member

    Thanks for the info realdeal!

    As far as I know, yes. :)
     
    Last edited: Oct 18, 2004
  19. realdealHurst

    realdealHurst Well-Known Member

    My H/O is a W-46 A/C car. Would it be possible to use one of the new fiberglass heater boxes to do the conversion. This way the car could easily be returned to original. The 68 W-46 cars have C heads instead of the much more rare and expensive D heads on the W-45 models. Both motors are rated at 390 HP. So I take it the two types of heads are interchangeable on these cars? Honestly, what would somebody expect to put in an already restored car to get it competive money wise?
     
  20. Mike Kamm

    Mike Kamm Well-Known Member

    I've never seen one of those so I can't comment. This is where I will defer your answer to the actual F.A.S.T. rules committe. It is best to ask directly. Please post this question and others HERE We need some Olds guys on the Year One site anyway! :grin:


    Again take a look at the F.A.S.T. rules HERE. I don't know what heads came on what cars for an Olds. But I am quite sure you need to use the correct head, intake, and exhaust manifold castings for the year car you have or are cloning. Blocks don't have to be the exact year as the car.

    That all depends on how much of the work you can do yourself.
     

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