Fan Shroud vs Guard on Non-AC Convertibles

Discussion in 'Buick FAQ' started by 1968_GS400, Mar 18, 2022.

  1. 1968_GS400

    1968_GS400 Founders Club Member

    Hello,

    My 1968 Buick GS 400 Convertible is missing a fan shroud. It is non-AC and has a 4 blade fan. To make matters more complicated, my car has a 1967 430 engine in it. I haven’t found a part number on the fan yet but the part number on the pulley is 1375141 which matches the non-AC pulley parts book # for both the 1967 430 and 1968 400.

    I was trying to figure out which shroud to buy, one for a 67 430 or one for a 68 400. The listings for the 67 430 all indicate they are for a AC car.

    So then I looked at the parts book and noticed that the 4600 (convertible) less AC and less HD radiator appears to take a guard instead of a shroud. Is this accurate? Did the non-AC 68 GS 400 convertibles with 4 blade fans not have shrouds?

    EB5D3330-66C3-4BE0-95B5-4753B2DDE0C9.jpeg

    However, I have looked at photos of 68 GS 400 convertibles and all of them appear to have a shroud, but I have no idea if they are AC or not.

    I did find these photos of a 67 Wildcat convertible presumably with a 67 430 and it appears to show a guard and not a shroud with the 4 blade fan.

    A62402ED-85CE-4623-89D5-AD395B460F9B.jpeg 8053944C-C41C-4390-A10B-75B8FD330CDF.jpeg

    Does anyone know if the 68 GS 400 non-AC convertible came with a guard and not a shroud or did they all come with a shroud?

    I don’t have the parts book for 67 but did find this information from a listing dated 72 which has all the 60s shroud/guard parts in it. I don’t see a guard option or a non-AC option for the 67 430 convertibles.

    40152123-FFC3-447D-BB2B-93401E23D4B8.jpeg

    424F7579-A17D-4996-ABB1-CCD4EB96F72B.jpeg

    Anyway, I am trying to figure out if I should get a 68 GS 400 shroud or a 67 430 shroud for my 67 430 engine or if I should get a guard instead. But are the guards even available?

    The 68 GS 400 convertible guard is part number 1380106, but I haven’t found one of those anywhere or even someone discussing it.

    Thanks.
     
  2. Mike Trom

    Mike Trom Platinum Level Contributor

    67 is a totally different body style and you would most likely need to make heavy modifications. You will need a 68 GS400 shroud, a 350 car is different. I did not think that convertibles were different than coupes and I have had both cars. A shroud made for a 68 GS400 is what you will need, you may need to change the fan and spacer if for some reason it does not fit.
     
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  3. 1968_GS400

    1968_GS400 Founders Club Member

    The 68 parts book definitely lists a guard for the 68 GS 400 convertible, but I don’t know what it looks like. Maybe it looks more like a shroud than the guard that is on the 67 Wildcat convertible.

    If anyone has a picture of the 68 GS 400 convertible guard part number 1380106, I would love to see it.

    Meanwhile, I will get the 68 GS 400 shroud as you suggest and see if it fits. I have a lot of space between the radiator and the fan currently.

    Thank you.

    8F6BC565-23BF-4545-BBFE-CEBB03239997.jpeg
     
  4. Mike Trom

    Mike Trom Platinum Level Contributor

    No idea what they are talking about with Guard. The shroud on my 68 GS Conv (pictured) was the same as the one on my 68 GS400 Coupe.
    This is a full plastic fan shroud.
    MT_68_GS_008.jpg
     
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  5. 1968_GS400

    1968_GS400 Founders Club Member

    Do you have AC in the convetible?​
     
  6. Mike Trom

    Mike Trom Platinum Level Contributor

    This assembly diagram shows one fan for the 400 engine.
    No AC in my convertible (that is my engine bay in the previous photo)
    1fan.JPG
     
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  7. 1968_GS400

    1968_GS400 Founders Club Member

    What book is that from? It sort of looks like images from Chassis book but has a lot more detail with part numbers.
     
  8. 1968_GS400

    1968_GS400 Founders Club Member

    Oh assembly book. I think I found same image. My assembly book sucks. I thought I got a good one but just opened it. It’s pretty illegible.

    0ABD1082-99A1-451F-853E-724400A82DF1.jpeg
     
  9. 1968_GS400

    1968_GS400 Founders Club Member

    I think there may be 2 fans for 68 4000 cars but not sure.

    1384739 - Less AC and Fan Drive Therm Control
    1376724 - AC or Auto Climate Control or Fan Drive Therm Control

    1376724 is one in the assembly book image.

    But I think I have a 67 fan from a 430. Mine may be 1344087.

    This is from 68 parts book.

    A0555F7D-C77B-4DD3-BF3F-701528A013B9.jpeg
     
  10. Mike Trom

    Mike Trom Platinum Level Contributor

    Unfortunately, when engines and parts are swapped you may have to do some experimentation to find what works for your car. I would start with a 68 GS400 shroud if you can find one and see how that goes. Expensive experimentation but without having an original engine you really cannot rely on factory part numbers. 67 body parts will not fit your 68 body.

    You cannot base your search off of pictures of Electras, LeSabres and other body styles, you need to look at 68 GS400's only.
     
  11. 1968_GS400

    1968_GS400 Founders Club Member

    Thanks.

    All I know is my car has had a swapped 67 430 engine, a 4 blade fan, and without a shroud since at least 1994 and likely since late 60s or early 70s and has shown no signs of overheating. I drove it across 3 states and 300 miles to get it here last July getting about 17 mpg. But maybe that’s why it has a different radiator in it.

    So if I put a shroud in it, hopefully it will stay even cooler.

    Thanks for your help.
     
  12. 1968_GS400

    1968_GS400 Founders Club Member

    The 1968 GS 400 fan shroud didn’t work. I have a 4 blade fan and this shroud had too small a clearance at the bottom and the fan hit the bottom of the shroud. The bolt holes in it also weren’t drilled out properly, too small on the reproduction but they lined up properly to the plastic shield piece that goes over top of radiator.

    I ordered this one which cost $258.21 after tax and shipping and took about 3 weeks to get to me.

    http://www.oldbuickparts.com/product_info.php?products_id=8865

    Any suggestions? Is there another one that has a bigger clearance at the bottom? I thought for sure this would fit since it has the 4 blade fan which I thought was the smallest one.
     
  13. CJay

    CJay Supercar owner Staff Member

    A 430 and a 400 are identical. There is zero difference. A 68 or 69 big block shroud will work. I would upgrade to an 18" fan and clutch. You'll need to chuck the guard and get a radiator top plate for use with a shroud like Mike Troms pic.
     
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  14. 1968_GS400

    1968_GS400 Founders Club Member

    Thanks.

    The reproduction I ordered (link above) was the 68 big block shroud reproduction from Cars LLC. It didn’t clear. I know it didn’t clear because I installed it. The clearance was going to be close but I tried. It scraped the bottom.

    3CC0CB26-001E-4CDC-B50C-2FE1034ADF82.jpeg

    I am sorry, but I am not understanding what you are saying about upgrading to an 18” fan. My fan appear to be exactly 18”. Do you mean I need to install a shorter extension than the one that is on it? Is one available?

    9270BBD9-5ED8-494A-A6CC-8F8C3848DED3.jpeg

    Isn’t my radiator cover the 1968 GS 400 radiator cover same as in Mike’s pic? The bolts aligned exactly with the shroud.

    512533A6-8BEE-4B65-80B6-C1EF2D4D205C.jpeg
     
  15. Quick Buick

    Quick Buick Arlington Wa

    With out seeing a whole picture this is what I would do... Upgrade to the 18 inch & clutch like Jason said above..... You have a fiberglass shroud that has no clearance on the bottom as you say... Now FG is EZ to work with buy some mat and glass and make it work. Do what it takes

    I have a FG shroud in my 67400 the bottom of it did not have clearance. The bottom half has been field fitted to make it happen...
     
  16. 1968_GS400

    1968_GS400 Founders Club Member

    I am sorry. I don’t understand what either of you are saying about upgrading to an 18” fan. My fan is already 18”.
     
  17. Quick Buick

    Quick Buick Arlington Wa

    18 inch 5 blade or 7 blade fan... yes the 4 blade does work.. but a 7 is much better...
     
    Waterboy likes this.
  18. Quick Buick

    Quick Buick Arlington Wa

    Now a fan has to be centered in the shroud round hole rear edge.... in other words half of the fan blade needs to be in & out....
     
  19. 1968_GS400

    1968_GS400 Founders Club Member

    Ok thanks. I understand now. Thermal or non-thermal fan clutch?
     
  20. CJay

    CJay Supercar owner Staff Member

    I've never dealt with reproduction fan shrouds. The 68/69 OE shrouds are still reasonably affordable. You csn probably get one for 300-350 in decent shape. Maybe less for the 68 version (less hose hook block)

    Thermal on the fan clutch question.
     

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