So the magazine mis-quoted you and the facts, and that doesn't bother you ? If the organizer of the event can't even be represented properly, how in the hell is anyone else reading supposed to understand what is going on ? uzzled: Didn't the magazine send you a draft of the article before they printed it ? ou: If it is just a matter of "getting some ink", I'm sure that Jimmy is glad that his '69 ZL-1 Camaro got some, and Peter's '69 Z11 Camaro received similar print. As you do more of these, I'm sure the learning curve will ramp up. But PLEASE ask that any ink be reviewed for correct data before you let 'er rip. And for God's sakes .... be consistent on what you are calling F.A.S.T., Stock Appearing, Pure Stock, Factory Stock, etc. before everyone on the planet is scratching their heads in delirium. And "YES", I always have a GREAT time ! :grin:
I agree with Tom, as I believe, as the article is worded, that Jimmy was done an injustice of accomplishment(s). :blast: Jimmy's car, as far as i'm concerned, is the single MOST impressive talent out there, Pure Stock, 4 speed, mid 11's, NOBODY can touch that awesome feat on this planet. Actually Case, since Pete's white car is a hardtop, it should be a Z10 right?? ou: JH Gonzo, are my Nova tail lights a problem at the Etown event?? :grin:
Look this is my last go-around with this I will correct the magazine about Jim's Corvette "Camaro" I am sure Jim will see the article and not make as much of a stink as you guys are. Yes Jim has an awesome car. The magazine did a great job, the time-line is presented slightly incorrectly, Big Deal... There are NO large misquotes that you are trying to imply. There is NO confusion over the classes, you are trying NOW to create some, but to anyone who was there, everything was just fine, everybody knew where they belonged. Everyone who can actually read rules, knew what to expect. You are again trying to make a mountain out of nothing. It was a good time. It is a good magazine, that has just started supporting this HOBBY, they will make small errors now and then, and yes most will be corrected. If you had any sense at all, you would realize that this type of press is GOOD for any muscle car event race series. Understand Good. I'm sorry I am not going to subscribe to the "My race is better than your race stupidity". If the thread was started with "Geez great article but I wish they would have said more things about Jim's accomplishment" that would be different. But to immediately get on the BuickV8 negativity bandwagon doesn't help anybody. This is a small HOBBY and you and I are not THAT important, but what is important is that any event that we have and or that is covered by magazines be presented as a fun time for the newbee to get into. My goal is to encourage more people to enter, not to argue over who has a faster car, who is cheating and who is more right about the world me or you. Is the world perfect NO, am I? no, are you?? Relax, have a beer, it will be okay.
Gonzo, I think your getting too sensitive here.... nobody called you out, personally. The post started, based on what HEMMING'S wrote, not you .... I think it is a good and fair topic. You keep using the word *YOU* in your reply's, whom exactly are you directing your posts to? :Comp: Jim
I can read Only two existing rulebooks I'm concerned with, anything else is confusing and totally unessessary,and probably only for personal gain. o No: When you correct the magazine about the Corvette "Camaro", don't forget to tell them that MUSTER is not the best word to use when describing a mid 11 second Pure Stock pass down the 1/4 :Smarty: F.A.S.T. is STOCK APPEARING alway's has been,alway's will be. The class you call stock appearing is in dire need of a name change. Pick one, they are all available, stock bone stock stock musclecar virgin stock show room stock I'm in this class because I'm not F.A.S.T. or stock appearing stock restored stock close to stock, has new plug wires and a new battery I guess this is my last go-around with this also, my point or suggestion has been made. Just trying to help you promote a better, less confusing race format. :bglasses: I'm not out to rain on someone's parade or ruin a good time, but personally I wouldn't walk across the street to enter my pure stock car in a race where it's classified wrong, let alone pull it halfway across the country.
I guess that you said it best Gonzo .... "All us Pure Stock guys are a bunch of idiots that incite drama and ego-centric mentalities and are such lunk-heads that they can't read rules" ...... Oh wait, I mis-quoted you. But that's OK apparently for what you are looking to gain from your experience in this hobby. :bglasses:
When someone shows up with, oh .... I don't know .... A 511 Cube 454 in a '68 Biscayne, that should fit pretty well in the "Stock Appearing" class .... correct ? o No:
I'm not really in the running Woo hoo...Woo hoo hoo...Woo hoo...Woo hoo hoo....... People do dumb things.......the name of that class and it's rules are some of them. Of course it really doesn't effect me......with the "looser" rules my car is not legal to race there with over 200 psi cylinder pressure..... It matches the stock spec in the service manual......but what would the factory know about stock. o No:
Ok I'll take the bait one more time. You can sure write alot about a one word mis-print in a magazine can't you? Did you guys mention the great pick of Jim's car boiling the hides off of it, where it is correctly identified?? No I guess you missed that huh?? Just dwelling on the negative. Lets see since the thread started you have attacked the magazine, you attacked the name of the race, attempted to spread confusion about classes,(gee I guess no one is ever confused about the name "Pure Stock") now it seems, I'm included, because apparently I'm in it for personal gain!! Excuse me but this was a one word misprint remember??? One sentence was written about Jim's car...THATS IT... But NOW after years of giving me grief about "sorry man all of the races are in the midwest" "you wasting your time" "You can't use that name or anything like it" all of a sudden we should join hands in the spirit of liberty!! Yeah right!! Listen I did my own thing, I do not charge extra for people to get into the race, I have spent $1000's promoting it while you have only typed alot, people are having a good time, magazines are noticing, I am happy about the progress. Anyone who wants to come down can and people are doing it. And you don't like it!! Nevermind all the other nonsense, somehow people enjoying themselves someplace other than the usual place, must be discredited. I am telling you this is the wrong approach. You are missing the point of the hobby. Its not us against them. Thats not going to work. I hope there are many more events nationwide and guys in California set new F.A.S.T and factory stock type records, whatever their set of rules are!! Its funny how people want the event to grow as long as its THEIR event. Bad approach, the new guy reading Hemmings or any other magazine covering these events doesn't care about your gripes, he wants to know where he can go and join in on the fun, and if its the east coast great, if its the midwest great, I DON'T care and neither does he. He doesn't care about why some Pure Stock guys and F.A.S.T racers have some sort of problem being at the same event together. Why should he?? Enough stupidity: Jim has an awesome Corvette, and his ET was quite an accomplishment The magazine did a great job covering the event, as things move forward I am sure the coverage will be better The Pure Stock Drags is a wonderful event for people in the midwest or others that are willing to make the trip The Stock Appearing Drags on the east coast is building into a nice multi-class event where everyone has a good time. To the new guys: If you want to join any of these events, go ahead you will not regret it. Just read the rules carefully no matter where you go, and relax and enjoy yourself.
Bill, I guess you have to have a little perspective of the history here. Pure Stocker guys have always been fighting the 'cheater' label. From guys with trailer queens think there cars would be faster than what we run and guys with Edlebrock underwear and headers can't run the numbers some of us do, the numbers that get posted at our events are always looked at sideways........Hell, I just got a round of hater mail at the Corvette Forum over this. So when (rightly or wrongly) Pat Wendling is quoted in Hemmings that "We started in Pure Stock, and a lot of people were cheating in that. I mean, I was too; everybody was." it is going to raise some ire. http://forum.yearone.com/forum_posts.asp?TID=1317&PN=3 And when a Certified Pure Stocker is unfairly compared to Waynes car, it is going to raise some ire. There were 21 FAST cars at your event, and only 5 of them outran Jimmy and only 6 of them outran Pete.........but because the magazine has seen (or been lead to believe) that the 'Stars' of the show are the FAST cars, the Pure Stockers again appear to be field filler.......... It looks like you have a great event, and I am not going to tell you how to run it, but whether the cars are running 10's or 15's, we all do this for fun, and really, in hopes that our car might actually make a magazine. And right now, it appears that is less and less likely to happen running at a mixed event......
these types of events arent really that new. they were having"pure stock" type events at Atlanta Dragway back in the late 80's.i believe they also had the nostalgiac drag cars from the early 60's there. i remember one i went to at Atlanta dragway in 1990.i remember a badass 66 W30 running 13.30's at the event. that was back when "stock" Hemis and Buicks ran low 13's.. uzzled:
It boggles my mind that some of you can get so worked up about what the press prints. Who gives a rat's patootie what they think or print? Apparently some of you have never dealt with the press before. The shorter the lead time, the less they care about facts. Magazines are only one step up from newspapers -- what do you expect? Listen, Grasshopper: If your own happiness relies on the competence of others, you will live a miserable life. If anyone should be insulted it should be Wayne. They use his ET on the cover to sell magazines, yet not only does his car not appear on the cover, but there is not one picture of it (or Wayne) inside, either.
I can see your point of view. From the standpoint of a non participant. If you had been participating in this stuff over the last decade plus and lived through the growing pains your view might be different. Anything that causes confusion or makes people think they "can't be competetive" because an 11.40 doesn't pass muster or that everyone is cheating is bad and gets folks fired up. It's been a long hard road for the race organizers and participants to get folks involved. Heck, folks have been riding you for years to drop your headers......
Bill, Bill,Bill I realize I can come off as a little abrasive at time's, and when I feel fairly strongly about a topic, I can keep kicking a lying dog for about as long as someone want's to keep arguing, I guess it's just in my nature. But, in every one of my earlier post's during this topic, I ended them in a pretty much upbeat fashion, so I didn't come off as some irate,insane person, except for maybe the last one, where I said I wouldn't pull my car across the country to have it lumped into a wrongly named class. That I meant. I never once bashed your event, I congratulated you,etc. Maybe instead of taking offense to the thing's I said, you should just take them into consideration as constructive criticism? Maybe by taking some input from people who are 100% into this type of racing, it will make your race even more successful? I don't know you, but I'm sure we'll meet at a race eventually, maybe even at your race o No: I just really don't understand why you would would want to create confusion by wrongly naming a long standing class of car's by fiddling with the rule's that literaly 100's of car's are already built to comply with? I really do feel that you would(and will) win the heart's of lot's of Pure Stock participant's with a simple name change from Stock Appearing, to something a little more fitting, I.M.O. I applaud you for your creativity in starting a class to get people away from the lawn chair carshow's, out onto the track :TU: , I'm referring to your new Musclecar Eliminator Class, great idea :TU: :TU: Since it's a new class, I can see where you had to create a new set of rule's for these car's that have never attended a race like this. But I feel that any car that show's up at your event should fit into one of the 3 classes without altering rules that would apply to the pure stock car's(that are currently called Stock Appearing by you). It's quite simple and non-confusing. Look 100% stock but hidden modifications=F.A.S.T. Stock Musclecar=Pure Stock,Virgin Stock,Show Room Stock,etc. Headers,easily seen aftermarket modification's, Musclecar Eliminator Keep up the good work Bill, and congratulation's on a successful event and it's media coverage :TU: :bglasses:
Ya, what Brian said! Where is the pic of of Wayne or his Car? At least Jimmy got his pic in there! :laugh: And for the rest of you, participant or not, good luck ever getting a magazine or newspaper to print anything 100% correct! I've been misquoted in the newspapers several times and sat on a jury in which the newspaper was getting sued for printing lies. You know what the editor of the paper said on the stand? We're the media, we can print or say anything we want, even if we know it's not true! And he meant it too! Now, before you jump ahead I'm not saying Hemmings printed anything wrong directly to insult or cut down anyone. You just can't expect perfection from a printed source, and shouldn't let it ruin an otherwise decent attempt at coverage of an event. How many collectors guides have every fact 100% correct? Probably none. I've been participating in Musclecar events since the early 90s at Brainerd International Raceway in MN racing in Pure Stock Modified (there's another class name for you). It was all heads up classes based on the NHRA specs for factory delivered weight and horsepower ratings and allowed headers and DOT stickies. No, they didn't check things real close and Yes, some people cheated. But it was a damn fun weekend of racing against other cars that were similiar to yours. If guys were running way fast for their class they could bump up to run cars with more similiar times. If you were running dog off you could bump down to run cars with similiar times. Who really cared as long as everyone was having fun. On a side note, guess who had one of the fastest cars there as well? Wayne Nelson! I even saw Joel race his GTX there. $50-75 or so entry, no payouts, just a fun weekend of racing ! If you were lucky you won your class and took home a Class Champion plaque. What happened to just having fun? :3gears:
My point exactly. I'm a happy individual despite what all you guys think of me. :moonu: :laugh: I've developed a mighty thick skin towards the media due to the fact that I read their dribble about one of my family on a daily basis. You just can't get worked up about this stuff or it'll kill you.
