Cam Degree with Heads Installed

Discussion in 'Race 400/430/455' started by NOTNSS, Feb 25, 2002.

  1. NOTNSS

    NOTNSS Gold Level Contributor

    What's the trick to correctly degree a cam with the heads on the engine? Do I need a mock up tool to set the indicator on top of the piston or what? Will be my first install and degree of a cam. Will be installing TA rollers at the same time (I hope).:Do No:
     
  2. rlracing

    rlracing Member

    Gary,
    Go to the "buickperformance" site and follow the cam degree instructions in the tech articles section (too lengthy to re-post here). The only change is that you will need to use either a commercially available piston stop that screws into the plug hole of the #1 cylinder, or make one from an old spark plug and a short piece bar stock (you get to use the welder---yippieee). Set-up of the dial indicator becomes a little more challanging, as you won't have the nice flat surface of the deck to stick your magnetic base to, but it's manageable. Disconnect the battery before doing anything--it'd be a real bummer if someone suffering from brain fade were to turn the motor over with the starter while the piston stop was installed. The manifold will have to come off for you to read off the edge of the lifter, or to install a solid "checking" lifter. Good luck.
    -Ron
     
  3. buick535

    buick535 Well-Known Member


    On the magnetic mount dial indicator stand that I have, the shaft unscrews from the base and just happens to be the same thread as the rocker pedistal bolt hole, so I simply screw it into there. It gives a perfect solid mount for the dial indicator, then I just use a pushrod on the lifter to reach the gauge, very simple.
    Jim Burek
     
  4. JohnK

    JohnK Gas Guzzling Infidel

    With the engine in the car? Man, you sure know how to party, dude! You're going to get a hell of a kink in your neck trying to read the degree wheel. The .050 points are a piece of cake to see, but when you're at full lift the lobe centerlines are a bit sublte, it's easier to bracket the readings from full lift minus .010 either side. And when you stick something in the plug hole, you'll want all the plugs pulled so its easier to pull the crank bolt ccw and not start to loosen it up instead of turning the engine. Coat hanger wire in a timing cover bolt hole works a hell of a lot better than the pointer that comes in the kit. I was able to read and repeat my degree readings to within half a degree - you'll be REALLY glad you did this. Atta boy :TU:
     
  5. NOTNSS

    NOTNSS Gold Level Contributor

    John,

    I'm swapping the radiator for aluminum anyway. Not much more work to loosen the bumper and pull the grille, then I can crawl right up in there and read away or shoot it with my spotting scope from across the room. Maybe you oughta plan a gambling weekend when I'm ready.

    Thanks.
     
  6. JohnK

    JohnK Gas Guzzling Infidel

    Gary,

    I'll tell you what. In about a month I'll need some breakin miles on the new rear end, and more break in miles on the engine. And all this before our tracks around here start to open. I'd loan you my dial indicator kit now if I didn't need it for the rear end buildup. We'll stayed tuned for more on this....
     
  7. GSThunder

    GSThunder Dejavu

    Gary,in case you haven't done it yet,take an old sparkplug and knock the porcelin out of it so its hollow.Then just tap the inside for a 3/8" bolt.I rounded the end of the bolt so it was easier on the piston head.
    Hey Jim,I gotta try that trick with the magnetic base shaft and see if it will work with my set-up,sounds great.:TU:
     
  8. NOTNSS

    NOTNSS Gold Level Contributor

    John,

    Do you have the degree wheel, too. I have a dial indicator but no wheel so had planned to buy one (Comp); figure with the wheel I'll be more likely to use it frequently.:grin:

    Might work out.

    Al,

    I knew there was a sparkplug tool but not how to make it; now I do. Might add that to Wrenching Secrets BB.

    Thanks guys.
     
  9. JohnK

    JohnK Gas Guzzling Infidel

    I've got the kit from Summit with the dial indicator, magnetic base, a tinker-toy assortment of shaft pieces, and the degree wheel. I can send the degree wheel and spark plug hole gizmo over on the Lamoille Express if you are going to do this right away. Or drive over with the whole goodie box if you're still farting around by the time I put the torque converter and rear end back in the car. Curious to see if you put a LCD flat panel screen in the 'reading' room.:puzzled:
     
  10. NOTNSS

    NOTNSS Gold Level Contributor

    John,

    The cam swap will be the last thing I do and it might not happen at all this year. Depends on how I sit after fuel pump, rear end, radiator, etc. I'm looking hard at it though. Might get TA rollers, too... definitely will if I do the cam swap.

    I heard from Rob last night that the local Mopar Scamp (Dart) has a problem.. he told the painter at Rob's shop yesterday that he doesn't mind getting beat by the Chevys and a Pontiac but, "Someone needs to take down THAT BUICK!". HAHAHA!
    Also says he has "all the power he needs" but can't plant it on the ground. I hate to tell him that 380 crate motor won't catch the GS regardless of traction. I guess he's gone with a new rear and some new tires.. heheehe.. I LOVE costing these guys money.
    There are also some snotty shivies comin' out this year, supposedly all with me in mind. I might get beat, but have nothing to lose.. they're doing the mouthing off. I guess they think I'm lounging the winter away.. gonna bum them out when I won't race on the street but invite them to Wendover. If they ain't got trailers they won't show.. most have 4.56 gears and call them 'street' cars, but won't drive them 200 miles round trip.
     
  11. JohnK

    JohnK Gas Guzzling Infidel

    300 mile round trip for me. See ya there. It'll be fun.
     
  12. Adam Whitman

    Adam Whitman Guest

    When is Wendover? I may try to get down there. What's the elevation? I may need some tune-up time if it's a weekend blast to get down there.
     
  13. NOTNSS

    NOTNSS Gold Level Contributor

    Adam,

    Past years Wendover has been every 3rd Sunday from March through October, weather permitting. I expect notification of the first one within a week or two and will let you know.

    Keep in mind this is a run what ya brung thing. ET only, no RT, 60' times, or MPH. Very loosely run (I've run with 4 folks in my car, no helmet, some have kids along, etc.). There is a fire truck and ambulance on site however. I don't know how we get away with it; that'll all stop if there's ever an incident.

    The good new is, I've run as many as 15 times in a single day. Gets to be like roundy-roundy after awhile, just get back in line, if there is one. Most cars run 15-13s, a few in the 12s, an occassional trailered 11s car. Seems like there's always some NOOSSSS on hand, too (like the "Hemi in a Box" - runs 11s with a Hemi on the juice, big fancy trailer and all). Randy usually tries to have a couple funny cars and/or dragsters on hand but they rarely run flat out due to the bump in the track at about 100'.. gets squirrely. He may have fixed that by now but it's doubtful. Still they get some 8 and 9 second runs out of the big guns.

    A good time to be there might be Speed Week at Bonneville but we have fun every time regardless of who or how many are there. If you show up Thursday or Friday of Speed Week, we can go watch the land speed stuff; I might even take a run at the 130mph club, depending on the final solution of my rear end issue (then beat feet for the car wash to clean the salt off). Seems to me we raced both Saturday and Sunday following Speed Week (it ends Friday).

    There were some Land Speed guys watching us race one year, since I-80 had been shut down that day due to major snow in the Wasatch and through Wyoming. These guys were headed back to Kentucky or Alabama but couldn't get over the hill so stayed to watch us play. One of the guys had just run 358mph the day before..:jd:

    Elevation is 4300'. Shouldn't affect your tune too much coming off 5000'.

    We'll keep ya posted.
     
  14. JohnK

    JohnK Gas Guzzling Infidel

    Adam,

    That would be cool if you drove here. Can't think of a straight road that gets you there quick, but that's great you're thinking about it. If we could get Nitro71455 out there, and if I could get my Mopar-infested kid to drive my other rig, we would have a 5 car regional event. If I can get Elroy Wilson to show that would make 6. Woohoo!! Yeeehaaaw!!

    Wendover is 4235 ft, was 93 degrees when I met up with Gary out there last summer. The 'track' is a closed taxiway at the airport. Only thing I didn't like about it was you can't drive around the burnout box, it's too narrow. You have to drive thru it and burn, or else you stage and sit in a puddle waiting for the last yellow.

    John
     

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