does anyone have an interest in using titanium connecting rods? if anyone has priced a set, i need to know what the cost was so that i can figure out if i could make them at a more affordable price. they can be made any length, journal size, etc.
They are at least $4000.00 for a set and you will wait forever to have them made. I know of no one that has ever bought or used a set in a Buick Big Block, they are not cost effective, and have their downsides too. Anyone that buys them for a Buick 455 will probably be the first to do so, and should have a see through oil pan on the car , play circus music, and sell tickets for everyone to come and look at them, I personally not waste the $$$$ on set,not needed,would put the money else where.
I can't imagine lightweight rods being a bad thing. Titanium valves and carbon fiber push rods would be sweet, too! Can't you get titanium rods for a BBC that would work with an offset ground crank? Alan
David, You're going to have to be a little more tolerant of other people's opinions on this board if you expect to get anything done. Would you buy a product from someone who responds in the manner that you have? I'd be afraid to return a product to you. :spank:
I believe the point that Keith was making here is that if titanium rods currently cost $4000, even at $2000, I doubt that you be be able to sell any. I don't know if it would be possible to produce them at a cheap enough price to sell them. Most Buick guys won't spend $1100 on a set of steel replacement rods as it is. Jim Burek P.A.E. ENTERPRISES P.S. please leave out the rude comments, definately not the way to win over new customers.
you're right fellas. probably not an appropriate response for which i apologize but too bad neither of you chose to comment on the original rudeness. diabo's response was not the type of comment i am used to and i let it anger me. one of the reasons i have enjoyed owning and racing buicks for the past twenty years is because of a general feeling of camraderie amongst buick owners. i am not in the business of producing nor selling parts. just a fortuitous opportunity came along that i wanted to share with other buick enthusiasts. even though it doesn't appear there is any interest, i am going to continue to putter along and if it works and is affordable i will let you know. in fact if anyone has ideas that involve exotic materials and/or precise machining, i am open to suggestion. dkm
There is a company that machines engine blocks from billets of aluminum! http://www.cnblocks.com/ They aren't interested in producing a Buick block, but I would be interested if someone did!
Parts? If your looking at making titanium parts, what about valves? Spring pressure can be reduced and valve stability would be improved. You could also have better luck running a roller cam with TA rockers since you might be able to run a small valve spring that would not interfer with the rockers. I like the idea of titaium rods. I would like to know the weight difference between a titanium rod and aluminum. I think people are concerned about putting a high dollar rod in there Buick since the motor likes to spit them out. The oiling would have to be fixed to lure more interest into to high priced rods. :Smarty: I would like to see a small journal crank with billet main caps and spacers in the block. The smaller diameter would slow the bearing speed down, reduce drag, and centrifical force would greatly be reduce so oil could pass though the crank and get to the rods. You greatly reduce the risk of tossing rods from spun bearings and increase the rpm range. A 401 buick bearing size would work. And being the crank would be a billet, strength would not be an issue. Price is looking about $3000 for a crank with spacers and bullet caps. Scat would make the crank at about $2300 each. Hopefully next year this will be pushed a little harder towards production. :TU:
Didn't intend to offend anyone by injecting a little humor in my comments, it was meant to imply that anyone being the first to get these rods, everyone would want to see them. Certainly any lightening of the internals a benefit , hey why not do a crank at the same time? Save even more weight. Point is you won't see 20 HP from lightening after spending $10,000 for the lightened internals pieces.Were not spinning these engines to 8000 RPM either. There are some really good affordable reliable steel and aluminum rods available, the steel rods now, are not nearly as heavy as they used to be, and can be made quite light for a steel rod. Aluminum rods have a greater life expectance these days too. By all means anyone who wants Titanium rods and can justify the cost go ahead good luck with it. Never ever had any problems with any rods, even stock, once saw a cylinder crack on a 430 and it hydra-locked a cylinder and the stock rod didn't even break, it sure did bend like a pretzel though, big end of the rod stayed together and stock bolts did not break.
One of the bad things with the Buick is that we don't get the trickle-down effect from bleeding edge technolgy parts unless it happens to fit or you make it fit. There aren't any Buick Pro-stock teams to spend $10,000 to get that last tenth! I would like to hear more about the small journel crank and spacers!
Crank Serveral years ago when Bob G. at Performance Concepts was racing he worked on taking a 401 Buick crank and putting it in a 455. He's out of racing but still builds motors and has the project still sitting around. I talk to him about finishing it so "I" could put it to the test for him. I run 1/8 mi since I don't trust or have the rpm room to stretch it through the 1/4. With this new combination I'd be able to turn the motor hard enough to go through the 1/4. The only problem to finishing the project is interest. I'm not ready. I'm still trying to recover from building the one I got. Hopefully mid next year I can get it going. If your interested you need to let Bob know! :TU: Bob would rather use a billet crank instead of a 401 considering all the work it will take getting the block set up for it. We talked to Scat and there needs to be a minimum order of 7, but they have to all be the same so everone needs to agree on the same crank. They told us that we needed %50 down and it would take 6 weeks from the time they were ordered. Scat cranks are a true billet machined from a solid stick not like the Moldex which is a rough forging that is then machined down. Plus Moldex has been know to give you your money back after waiting a year and getting nothing. The initial talks are to have a crank set up with stock stroke, 2.75" mains, 2.100 rod journals (BBC), and reuse the stock rear main cap with a spacer in the upper and lower half so you can retain the stock rear main seal and use a standard Buick oil pan. We haven't ruled out a stroker but on a power adder application it would probably over stress the block and you won't need the extra cubes since you generally don't have enough air flow to feed a stroker and turn it up to 7800. Right? If your interested call Bob and let him Know. (706) 234-2414 After 10 am M-F. If for some reason there is enough interest and the majority would rather have someone else do the machine work it doesn't matter to me. As long as its right and it works, I don't care.
I think we might be putting the cart in front of the horse here. What ever happened to a better block? Putting in high dollar internal pieces are great for strength and performance, but with a flimsy block your laying some good high dollar cash and hoping the block will last, which it won't Case in point guys. I started a new engine by first re-freshing my old one. Decided to go with the light weight aluminum and have the engine stroked. Everything in the old engine was fine as she ran low 9.80's in a 3,200 pound GS w/me, steel heads, .040 over and not stroked, mind you. Just decided to up grade while still using my old block (only 110 passes, and it was one of the '76 short blocks from Buick) Now all the fresh pieces are in and a good examination of the block showed a hairline crack on the #2 main bearing surface. and a closer inspection showed after the girdle was removed the stud had a slight wobble. A slight yes slight hit on the web and a nice chunk of the webbing along with the #2 bearing block side surface fell off! An even closer examination showed an air bubble that was inside the casting were the crack formed. On a stock engine she would have ran forever, But put in 740 plus ponies and the stress was too much. Hence my point, our Buick 455 blocks are junk when you are looking for high HP (not street strip). They were not designed for high HP high loads, they were designed for low rpm torque and power, thats why they are so great on the street and with mild performance improvements. So my point here is even though it is a great idea for the rods, I feel that all focus should be first on a new block. Just ask Scotty of PG. His Regal ran a 7.67 on power (455 block) putting out well over 1,000 hp. He said that he only can muster up a few runs before the block literally warps and is then junk. He learned this the hard way after breaking TWO high dollar Buick engines with only a few passes on each (back to back). Just my two cents here, Maybe with all of the interest and business involved it could be a collective process to have a new block designed. We all know TA has looked into this, but as of now it is not cost effective. Just how many people would spend about 5K for a bare block? I would but there are not too many other people that would. Mike was saying that it would actually be about the same in cost as compared to upgrading and existing 455 block (girdle, alligned bore, oil mods etc) as the new block would have all of this. As of now he has the V-6 aluminum block being produced. Hopefully they will sell well and Mike would throw some profits back into the new 455 block. As of now I guess we can only hope and wait while our supply of blocks slowly declines. Which is another problem. All these cams, rods, intakes etc, but very few blocks, see the point. Rick Martinez
Where's the line? Your right Rick! But like you said there's not enough people that would put the money up front AND wait. Until there is you've got to come up with more feasible way to make it work. I feel you have more people that need more rpm and can get away with the factory block. I'd like to see it still with a small main journal setup. :TU: The smaller main bearing would free up some HP and give you more rpm to work with with less problems. Until you find someone with enough money to "sponsor" a aftermarket block, the horse will always be pushing the cart.ou:
First, if there is a conclusive market for a new iron block we can provide them. We often build engines with titanium rods, titanium valve train components, custom crankshafts, beryllium push rods, and alternate alloy valve seats. The engines however make maximum power between 8500RPM on the 815 cubic inch engines and 10,500RPM on the 358 cubic inch engines depending on the application. There is specific reasoning for each part alloy application including but not exclusive to weight reduction. All of these components excluding the block are currently available for the Buick. These parts are custom made to our specifications. I have not run in to anyone desiring to spend the money needed on an entire Buick engine project that would dictate the need for any of these exotic parts. If you do, send them our way. We would be happy to assist them.
