Time to build the 455 ive always wanted

So i have scouted through this site and others arming myself with knowledge in order to make sure that I get this right the first time. The motor is a 70 SF code 455 that spun a rod bearing. I will be dropping it off to scotts auto machine in Fayetteville GA next Friday afternoon. He has been in business for 31 years and has built many buick 455's and is also familiar with the JW oil mod instructions. Currently the engine is .30 overbore, headers, poston s-divider, HEI, built 800cfm qjet. I read on the TSP site about Jims's 470 combo and am going to buy a set of pistons from him once all my measurements are complete at the machine shop. The block has never been decked, so i anticipate a .10-.20 machining to get everything square. I plan to keep the stock rods as i wont rev this motor past 6k if even that high. 5500 most likely. So the plan is to get the disassembly complete, oil mods done, clean, deck, and magnaflux the block, polish or repair/replace the crank and rods, then order whichever size custom pistons required to be at the magical zero deck height that he spoke about on his website. Cam will be the 284-88h from ta, s-divider will be sold and replaced with either a b4b or performer (un decided there ), ta stage 1 valve springs, stage 1 conversion on the heads with new guides, locks, and retainers. Possibly some minor gasket matching to the heads along with the valve job (undecided here too). Questions:What kind of power am i looking at here? What oil mods are needed at the pump? Any mods needed on the timing cover?Will the standard mechanical fuel pump be sufficient? Have I left anythingout? Which intake will work best with my qjet? (No ram air cleaner)The car is a 72 GS, built 2004r, 3.42 posi rear. Any speculation as to how it will run or guidance for things i may have overlooked? Thanks, Duke

 

Congratulations on starting your 455 build. You have a bunch of it already figured out.

Here are a couple of things to consider based on my experience.

Before you do all of that work on your heads, see what total cost will be, and then compare to Eddy aluminum heads. May not be much difference in cost, and would be great addition.

Your intake. I would consider the SP1 since you aren't using GS air cleaner. Even a mild 455 really likes the open plenum intake.

 

You are absolutely right Larry. I was mistaken about the increase in stroke as a benefactor in this combination. So if i understand correctly, without increasing to a 6.8 rod and sticking with the stock set I have, the end result would be a tad shy of the 470 mark? What i gathered from his website was that having zero deck pistons was the most desirable thing. Am I on track here? I will have more to come on this topic after my machinest gets back to me with the measurements and such.

-am i missing anything as far as other components required or recommended?

-i will look into the sp1 intake based off the recommendation here.

-Any mods needed on the timing cover?

-stock fuel delivery ok with my current plan?

-when you say eddy heads, im assuming thats short for edelbrock heads right? Or is this another manufacturer that i am not aware of? Either way, more research is due on this topic so i will get after it on that.

Thanks for all the guidance gents! More to follow in the next few weeks!!

 

Keep posting Duke, I live not 15 minutes from Scotts and it'll be good to know where I can get good Buick machine work done! Awesome!! :Brow::Brow:

 

"AutoTec is a High Quality, Precision Manufactured piston option. That comes at a very respectable price. Our Design Specific Forging allows us to manufacture our parts with less machining time, thus allowing us to keep production cost down. Then pass that savings on to you, the customer. Made out of 4032 High Silicone Aluminum Alloy, it has great wear resistance, a low expansion rate, is very durable, and is very low in friction. These pistons accommodate multiple uses including. Your local auto shop, muscle car restorations, performance street rods, as well as many spec racing classes. They can also withstand mild nitrous kits and small turbo or super chargers. Just about everyone can benefit from the excellent value the AutoTec line carries. Keeping in mind these pistons were originally designed for about 600 Horsepower. In Small Block applications, we have customers that frequently fine tune engines that yield 850+ Horsepower with a bit of Super Charger boost. Bore, Ring Pack, and Compression Distance changes can be made to any shelf part at no extra charge. Meaning that if you do not see your application listed in the guide, we can make what you need without charging a custom price. Every part is made with same high quality machines and tools as our RaceTec line including diamond turned ring grooves, and skirts. Not to mention our parts are 100% made in the USA."


http://www.buyracingparts.com/pisto.../autotec-455-buick-forged-dished-pistons.html


The above pistons will work with stock rods, rings are included. GL



Derek

 

Duke,

No problem doing a slight reconfigure of the pistons to keep your stock rods.. but get a price on his crank machining and rod rebuilding.. sometimes it actually ends nearly the same price to go with the offset ground crank and aftermarket rods, and you get much stronger rods to boot.

I do sell an entire rotating assembly, with crank, rods, pistons, rings, rod bearings, stock reman balancer and stock replacement flexplate. All balanced and ready to install. Just shy of $2500 with your crank core.

It's good to do your homework at this stage.. Get your pricing down now, saves on surprises later.

I don't care for the 4032 pistons, since we are on the topic.. I specifically call out 2618 for my stuff, I figure if your going forged, might as well have the strongest material.. no real downside.

Folks sell 4032 stuff because it's a less expensive material. all the other 'stuff' is basically just noise.

JW

 

While the 470 is a good combo for sure, I wouldn't spend that kind of money and run iron heads with it. A well built stock 455 rotating assembly would do you just fine.

 

yes, Edelbrock aluminum heads was what I was referring too.

For your fuel system to feed it, give that all some thought also. You don't want to run out of fuel. I run a stock pick up in the tank (with sock removed) to a Fram Canister fuel filter, then 1/2" line to the Stage 1 type mechanical fuel pump, then up to the carb. This is on my convertible with iron stage 1 head 455 with SP1 and Quadrajet. At the track, we had no fuel delivery issues. This system was not expensive to put together.

 

I would go with a forged piston for sure just for durability reasons.
Getting close to zero deck will help.
I think the 470 route is the best way to go plus you get added peace of mind of stronger rods.
If the 470 is option is off the table I like the Wiseco reverse dome pistons. There are other good forged pistons though.
Stock rods with ARP bolts if not going with the 470 option.
I would spend the money on a good timing cover or modify the old one if it is perfect to start with. If it is in the budget get the TA housing and pump assembly.
For a cam I would call Scott Brown. He can make you a custom cam for your build for almost the same price as an off the shelf generic grind.
For the heads.. It is very easy to spend close to $1,500 for a Stage 1 conversion on iron heads if you buy all the good parts. I wish I had realized this before I spent the money converting a set of iron heads..
If I was was going to keep the iron heads I would not convert to stage 1. There is always a good used set of iron heads for sale here already done.
I would not spend the money on Aluminum unless I was looking for low 11's or faster. Lots of cars run mid to low 11's with iron heads.
For intake I would say SP1 all the way. Get it with the Q-jet top that way you could run either carb.
For a fuel pump I would run the RobbMc pump and 1/2" sending unit. Stock lines should work. If not inline tube makes 1/2" pre-bent lines that are perfect.
These are just my thoughts, Hope it helps.

 

I have the perfect set of heads for your build for sale in the forsale section, you would only need the correct springs for the cam you put in. you wqould have near double in these to reproduce them from a set of non stage 1s. Heres the link.

http://www.v8buick.com/showthread.php?297538-Ported-fresh-Stage-1-heads&highlight=ported

 

Oil cover mods here:

http://www.buickperformanceclub.com/OilingMods.htm

 

I think www.buyracingparts.com is associated with Scott Brown. So you should be able to get cams through them. I have a Scott Brown custom, they rock. I would expect their pistons to be pretty good. Agree on the SP manifold, 455 Buick's seem to love single plane manifolds. Stock rods are actually pretty good. I run them in my 650 HP supercharged motor. So far so good.

Think about the whole combination, gear, trans and especially torque converter.

 

I dropped the motor off at the machine shop yesterday and had an in depth talk with the builder and what i was looking for with my build. He threw me for a loop when we started talking about the ideal compression ratio. Im sticking with my iron heads as that is all the budget will allow right now. The heads will be rebuilt however, with a 3 angle valve job, new guides and seats, springs locks and retainers. My builder mentioned a slight cut if necessary to get the optimal cc figures i need. I wont know how much until the disassembly and measurements are made. My question is about compression ratios. My plan was to shoot for 10.5:1, thinking that would be plenty for the 284-88h cam i have my eye on. Ta says 9.0:1 is the minimum requirement. When i mentioned all this, the builder said that 10.5:1 would be too much because of potential detonation issues. Does anyone concur with this? Im not familiar enough to know what would be best here. I also asked about zero deck for the pistons. Again, he said that he wouldnt recommend going with a zero deck. Everything i have read says zero decking the pistons is optimal. Again, i should know more when we get it all torn down and cleaned and measurements are made. With that, what info will you all need to know when i speak with the builder to paint the best picture for guidance and recommendations? Thanks in advance for all your insight!

 

Your builder is correct, 10.5 on pump gas is too high. Stay under 10.0 and keep advance 32deg max.
For street motors we build with iron heads we stay around 9.75 and have no issues with pump gas.
Sandy has that in her X and runs 12's. If you had al. Heads you could easily go 10.5 and higher, we've done some at 11.0 and been ok.
Build the motor for 10.0 with the iron heads and a .040gasket, and if you later install al. Heads use a .027 cosmetic gasket which will give you 10.4 with the same cc head or make the al. Less cc and bump it even more.
Gary

 

Larry,
Awesome read on the compression article! I really appreciate that. I am still in the infancy stages of this motor construction as well as parts selection. with regards to pistons, I'm still undecided on which company to go to. I think I'll make that decision once I have all of the measurements. I have research several companies to include the Autotech pistons as well as what Jim Weise has, but I think there is still more to learn there. I do have a question about milling the block. my understanding is that with a custom set of pistons, I can get a longer piston to make up for the excessive milling work. Is that right? The Builder did say that he would do a light cleaning up on the block surface and whatecer it took to square up the journals. He does have tourqe plate honing capabilities, a process i am newly aware of.

As far as some definite parts that I'm going with, here is a small list:
New TA timing cover with oil pump
sp1 intake
grooved cam bearings
arp rod bolts

Am i missing anything other than obvious things like gaskets/fluids etc?

 

Depending on how much your machine shop will charge to recondition your stock rods plus buying ARP bolts, it may be more advantageous to pick up a set of our new stock replacement forged connecting rods that come with ARP hardware:

http://taperformance.com/proddetail.asp?prod=TA_1633C

 

Those are nice rods Mike, are they the same as the factory 6.600" length it doesn't mention that in the ad, thanks.



Derek