Duffey, The springs create the valve spin. The keepers I listed above are for the 2.3 valves you have. You will have to cut the guides in the heads down to .530 to use the Viton seals. I had the valve spring pocket cut to 1.4 also to fit the Chevy Z28 springs. The small diameter Chevy Vortec Beehive springs will also work but for more $. Steel cup and hardened shims are also available at Alex's Parts.
Duffey These keepers may also work: https://www.alexsparts.com/hardened...groove-set-of-32-pieces-full-set-of-16-pairs/
Duffey, Retainers: https://www.ebay.com/itm/1-250-7-De...bYd9G:sc:USPSFirstClass!86409!US!-1:rk:7:pf:0
I like these retainers better: https://www.alexsparts.com/retainer...or-stock-od-springs-w-1-720-installed-height/
So I got thinking about possible inference with the roller cam. I'm guessing I should wait to have the roatating assembly balanced until I have the cam? Also, the machine shop is trying to talk me into line boring the block because of the close tolerances desired on the main bearings. How do they compensate for the larger hole? Just larger bearings?
Duffey, They take material off the caps to line bore, so start with a smaller hole. Sometimes you need an under size timing chain to compensate as the new bore is slightly higher. That said, it doesn't have anything to do with the clearance between bearings and crank and rods. You can get undersize bearings at .001, .010, .020 and .030.The amount the crank is turned down decides the bearing clearance. I think I would look for another machinist. Can you really justify the roller cam/lifter expense for your budget build?
Most/many machinists want to align hone/align bore as it's easier than setting up the nec. equipment to actually check the roundness/alignment of the main bores/saddles. IF he's really good after boring ( not honing) right at the bottom of the block saddle you will see a very tiny witness line where there was NO material removed from that saddle so the center-center distance of the cam & crank will remain the same or else you will have a FOREVER loose timing chain & we don't have an option with our Buick engines to get a timing set to match. In actuality Buick's machining process was pretty good in most/many instances especially relating to the mains. Everything else is a crap shot especially on the cam bearing alignment. That's why I ALWAYS suggest to install the last two cam bearings 1st. & install the cam to make sure it lines up & spins freely. Then the center & install cam again & so on & so forth. IF the cam is hard to turn I check to see where the side is that's tight & take a scotch bright pad & rub in that area ONLY until the cam fits. If he ends up reaming it the clearances become greater than nec. at the loss of idle oil pressure. Just my thoughts. Tom T.
Cloyes has an undersized timing chain that fits the Buick V6, 215, 300 and 340 V8 motors. I would think the stock main alignment is probably fine and could be checked instead of align bored if not necessary. Is that the same shop that is going to turn down the mains on the crank? Also the main oil holes will need to be chamfered back to center to align with the center of the bearing.
Good insights, I haven't settled 100% on a shop so I will keep looking around. My main concern is finding one locally that can grind the crank in house so they can get the tolerances right. Most places I have checked with want to send the crank out, but my understanding was that they would need the block to ensure proper clearance. Am I mistaken? I'm trying to be as frugal as I can so that I can afford the roller cam and EFI at the end. Come to think of it, I didn't make sure the options from TA and The Wedge Shop were hydraulic and not solid... I will have to look into that.
Shouldn't be a problem with factory rods. If you do get a roller cam and the rods do need some clearancing(unlikely), you will be better off getting it balanced AFTER the clearancing because that will change the weight of the rods. So yes, do a mock up to check cam to rod clearance before balancing. If you're sticking with factory rockers then you won't be able to go much passed .500" lift so very doubtful you will have any clearance issues with that small of a lobe. Mart's roller cam in his sbb 350 has .584" of lift and over 240* of duration @ .050" and didn't have any clearance issues with factory nut and bolt sbb 350 rods with the factory stroke. Oh, and the chain stays the same size, the gears are made larger for line honed/bored main housing to take up the extra slack.
Duffey, I think a lot of guys just exchange cranks for off the shelf undersize and you end up with .oo2 SBC clearances that most run. In your case you are having the crank custom ground. What are the crank rod journals now? You can mic and see or if you have the old rod bearings the size is stamped on the back. For instance if your rod journals are standard size, have the rod journals turned down .009. After polishing will be around .oo95. .0015 clearance for .010 undersize bearings. If .010 go to .019. I usually have the mains and rods the same, but in your case you could go down to standard size for the mains. You have some good people on this site to help you. Tom and Derek have much more machinist experience than me. I am fortunate to be able to farm my stuff out locally to guys with experience. Derek, I should have said timing set, not chain. I wasn't sure how they did it.
Derek, do the capscrew rods have more or less clearance than the nut and bolt rods? Isn't the crank to cam distance the same on the 340 and the 300? Why did the HRM build have to clearance the rods? Jim, I have standard rod journals, so I was thinking the same thing--standard on the mains and .010s on the rods. So does the shop doing the grinding need to have the rods and block available in-house or does it not matter? I just can't imagine for the tolerances we are going for that it would work otherwise, but then again I'm no expert.
I would say the nut & bolt style have more clearance, due to the custom headered rod bolt with the thin style head configuration.
Duffey, Chris brought the 300 crank in with the 350 crank and gave the machinist instructions. No block or rods. Have the rod journals ground .009 under and polish to .0095. Your rods are already resized and with .010 bearings will be perfect. Standard size on Buick 300 spec mains will give proper clearance for the standard size main bearings at .0015 also. Chris had more clearance with the capscrew 350 rods vs the Hot Rod build which used the shorter 300 rods and taller, heavier Olds pistons. You do have to lose most of the balance pads on each end to lighten. The only clearance issue was using washers between the windage tray and block and a little ball peen hammer work in the shallow front of the oil pan.
In this pic of Bruce (Chris's ma chinist) Look at the rod on the bench. Not much balance pad left. Also your pistons already have modern thin rings vs the Hot Rod build which used spacers:
The deal with having to clearance the rod bolts on the HRM sbb 300 stroker build is that they used sbc 283 rod bolts because they were cheaper than the sbb 350 rod bolts with the clearance formed it the bolt head already. The shorter stroke of the sbb 300 didn't need the sbb 350 shaped heads on their bolts(talking the nut and bolt style rod bolts and not sure if the sbb 350 nut and bolt rod bolts were 11/32" like the sbb 300 bolts were?)because of the much shorter stroke, 3.400" vs 3.850" for the sbb 300 and the sbb 350 respectively. Might be why they used the sbc 283 ARP rod bolts and ground what the factory shaped the sbb 350 bolts too, but not as strong when grinding the clearance.(but strong enough for the 400 whatever HP they made with it) Make the holes bigger in the rods and make them weaker or grind the clearance on the sbc 283 rod bolts?(that is if the sbb 350 ones are 3/8" and the sbb 300 ones are 11/32"?) If you look at the 300 rods from the core you took apart you'll see that they don't have the steep angle on one side on them like a sbb 350 nut and bolt style rod bolt would have, IIRC they are slightly chamfered on a 45* on both sides. If the sbb 350 old style bolts were 11/32" the HRM article should of used them to not confuse people all these years later.
Good to know, I will probably hold off on balancing just to be safe. So I got thinking about my quest for maximizing low end torque, and I realized I may not be accurate in my beliefs about what will contribute to it. Obviously the long stroke and high compression help (all over the rpm range) but I assumed minimal porting on the heads and intake with larger valves to help mid-lift flow would be best. Does this sound right?
Duffey, What I do is clean up any casting flaws. Port match, not gasket match. Use a intake gasket as a guide and use a fat (red) permanent marker. Grind out to the mark on both intake and head. Blend in about an inch. Clean up the bowl and taper around valve guide. Flatten slightly the short side radius. Use a head gasket as a guide and mark to blend the chamber on the outside of valves to unshroud. You can use an inside caliper to gauge so the ports are the same. Smooth the chambers of any sharp areas. You will have to grind out the lug in chamber like Chris did also. CC the chambers so they are the same. Basic Stage 1, cleanup and mild porting. With the mild porting you won't remove too much material and strike water. You will save a bunch of money by DIY. The larger valves will help power throughout the range. The stock valves are tiny for a 350.
Sadly we are moving and won't have space for the old girl. Its all posted for sale in the classifieds if anyone is interested.
