The dangers of buying an engine that won't turn over???

Hello, I have an opportunity to pick up an engine for nothing. The problem is that it's locked up and won't turn over. I don't know why it's like this and neither does the owner.

I just don't want to spend all that time and effort of getting the engine home and find out that all I did was help this guy clean out his 600 lbs. of scrap metal.

Any suggestions as to what I could do to make sure this engine isn't a true boat anchor? I do have a portable bore scope that connects to my phone. The engine has supposedly never been apart and is still in the car.

 

The car hobby is just like gambling,....I've got several boat anchors, have paid good money for some of them

 

I'd take the engine anyway, to me it would be fun, especially knowing I got it for free!!

 

you know the dangers. its either junk or it isn't...

 

I know. I just hate to spend 2-3 hours wrestling this thing out of the car just to get it home and find out I just picked up $12 worth of metal for the scrap bin. I think I'll pull 4 of the spark plugs and put the bore scope down it and see if the cylinder walls are rusty or not.

The carb is still on it and the distributor is still in, so that's a good sign to me. Hopefully it's just the rings that have frozen to the bores.

 

Cut any belts still on it. If an alternator or pump or compressor is locked up it could keep it from turning easily

Pull all the plugs

And of course use a breaker bar on the balancer bolt to see if you can get it to move. If it moves even a little there's hope.

 

If he will let ya "part" it. Pull intake and heads. Take a peek and decide on what ya see.
On another note, almost all engines have something salvagable on or in em. Oil slingers, windage trays , acc brackets, oil pans, intakes, valve covers, all of which can be sold as is or prettied up and sold to recoup any effort or gasoline expended. Jim

 

What happens when you try to turn it over? Are you doing it by hand? If so remove any belts as sometimes they stick to the pullys and then won't allow the engine to turn.

 

Is he saying he knows it ran at some point or did he get the car with a seized engine?
I wouldn't spend one second pulling it for him unless the engine at least was something that the basic castings were desirable.
I'm assuming a B455?
Adjust your thinking away from the price of scrap and know that any shop makes money unsticking and de-rusting things, much of which you can do too (best profit in the shop).
I can't say for hobbyists but I value my wrench time same as shop time, well over $100/hr.

I wouldn't worry too much if an engine doesn't turn or what the cylinder looks like. I'd be more concerned about it being severely overheated and everything important cracked.
You can expect that all of the soft parts are garbage, along with valves and springs.

 

Drag it home! They're not making any more. (OK... but not Buick.)

Most people overbore on a build, anyways.

What year and model car?

 

It's not a 455 guys. Sorry. It's actually a 1969 351 Windsor for a possible GT40 continuation car I may do as a retirement project. I'd make it into a 408. So light rust in the bores I'm not worried about. But heavy rust would concern me as even a .030 overbore may not get it out.

He said he got the car this way. He was parting it out and just wants it done and gone now. There are no belts on the engine, and I didn't want to just put a breaker bar with a 3' cheater bar on the crank bolt. I'm concerned about something cracked inside from an overheat like was said above.

Maybe I'll just pass and keep looking. I've got a year or two before this would even happen. Just trying to be proactive and if it doesn't happen, it could be sold off as a core...........as long as it's not a boat anchor. I would love to pull the intake and heads. But I don't think he's gonna want to let me do that.

 

If you can get it out quickly, it's almost certainly worth that amount of time.
There isn't much not rebuildable.
The other way of looking at it is, let's say...your work time is appx. $30/hr then you only need to see $100 in castings to break even. Pretty easy to do with that engine.
Should be able to have it out in 1 hr.

 

I'm not sure I would ever build a SBF or SBC too many crate options out there with warrantees

 

The reason to build one of those yourself is you can build twice the engine for all most half of what a crate would cost unless you get the 150 HP Mr. Goodwrench made and built in Mexico with Mexican castings and Chinese parts sbc 350, but who only wants 150 HP? Any alterations to the 150 HP engine to make more power and there goes your warranty!

 

Most every crate performance engine sold has the replacement price built into the initial cost.

 

I can certainly relate to bellybutton engines being considered expendable time bombs.
351W blocks are pretty tough, and take to strokers well.
There's also a certain stigma with the wine and cheese magazine reader resto-buck crowd about the block being a '69.
So there's definitely value there.
If a guy wants to ensure his time not be wasted on a junk block, there's a stronger chance of it's success seeing some history of it's being driven (first hand preferred).

 

as stated, they aren't making any more '69 351w engines. I love a challenge and if you have the time this fits the bill. Get it to the garage, on the stand, fill the spark plug holes with acetone/trans fluid and let it "bake" . If you cant get it freed up, pull the heads and with a 4x4 or whatever size wood fits over the piston do some hammerin' on it to get the pistons moving. My grandfather and his brothers did the head pull and beating the pistons loose every spring on their Allis Chalmers to get it ready for the field after it sat over the winter. Or at least that was the story I was told .
plus a car project with out some side stories isn't much to talk about.

 

Don't hammer on your pistons much or you'll split the cylinder bores. They aren't as thick as ag/industrial blocks.
No harm in pulling the heads and it only takes a couple of squirts of juice.
IF need be ... you can drill connecting holes into a piston to collapse it, but most likely you can work one loose with some heat to draw in the fluid, expand to break the rust bond and turn a breaker bar. Light tapping with a wood block is OK to get them moving.
Sometimes lighting some diesel fuel on top the pistons after soaking will free them.

 

TAKE the thing.

Yank it apart as time permits. The worst that can happen is that you can sell it for scrap later. It won't be a money-making deal, but you won't lose money, just time 'n' labor. It's more likely that you'll find that it's salvageable with some additional labor over-and-above what it would take to rebuild an engine that isn't seized. Even if the entire engine isn't salvageable, you can probably discern the major parts that are, and potentially use or sell them.

True story: a guy I worked with was something of a destitute case. He and his wife were now working, but recovering from previous debt 'n' unemployment. His brother was still unemployed. They VERY much wanted to sell me a bunch of core Olds 425 and 455s as soon as they figured-out I was an "Olds" owner. They'd been "stored" in a shed with mice pissing in the intake manifolds. I took 'em all, paid them what they asked. Went home with four or five engines and some additional brackets and pieces.

Had to dynamite some of the pistons out of the bores with the biggest hammer I owned. A few pistons came out in shattered pieces.

Rebuilt one (needed a sleeve...or two, due to bore corrosion) It's in my '66 Toro right now. That engine had a forged 455 crank, only used in the first couple months of production in late '67 for the '68 model year. After that, the forging plant was shut down and EVERY 455 afterwards got a (nodular) cast-iron crankshaft. Those rare forged cranks are worth more than what I paid for the whole lot...but I didn't know it was there until I yanked the engines apart. Another 455 short-block is still in my "stash" of parts. And all the other stuff--the 425 engines primarily--went to a guy who drove from The Big City with a U-haul to pick 'em up.

EVERYONE won on that deal.

 

If it's free take it. You could use the parts or sell it as a core in a junk yard for another buick motor. Hard work and heaving lifting is just part of the game...
It might be good just need some penetrate oil and time, but either way it sound like a fun project.