Stage 2 or 3 heads?

Discussion in 'Race 400/430/455' started by alaskagn, Sep 11, 2018.

  1. alaskagn

    alaskagn Well-Known Member

    I am thinking I'm trying to build a 9.5 sec car and was wondering at what point does it make sense to go stage 3 Heads over the 2's? Obviously new rockers, Headers (for both stg 2 & 3) and intake are required, but what else is needed? OR can this be done with the stage 2's no problem???
    How about stage 1's? I have a new set of TA 2 1/8" headers for the stage 1 in the box but that's not really a concern if they won't get me there. Car is a 71 Skylark.
    Thank you!
     
  2. hugger

    hugger Well-Known Member

    The SE heads be it stage 1 or 2 are plenty capable of 9.50s in 3400lbs, TE's are an slightly easier approach being they will need a little less "work" but in the end it's probably pretty negligible.

    I don't know if having headers alone would sway me to use the stage 1's. If I had TA standard rockers now I don't think I would go Stage 3 as you would obviously need new rockers. Hell I may not making any sense ha. I do know SE's can and have mid 9's on several builds, and TE's are more capable so,...

    The good thing about the SE's is the SPX is a bolt on with no epoxy work or anything, and while it's not as good as it could be for a race BBB, it's better than the SP1/2 intakes. But then you have guys like Doug who fly with a SP/2
     
  3. GS Kubisch

    GS Kubisch THE "CUT-UP" BUICK

    300sbb_overkill and TORQUED455 like this.
  4. Bens99gtp

    Bens99gtp Well-Known Member

    Easy button easy button easy button.......nothing just appeared, mine must be broken.....
     
  5. Bens99gtp

    Bens99gtp Well-Known Member

    The stage 3 heads will also net you about 1 pt of compression of the stage 2. I only point this out due to rising cost of fuel used with high compression motors, sometimes going near 15 bucks a gal. It might not be much and depending on how many times you plan to race in a year. If looking to go every weekend you could be making 5 or 10 passes a week. This could be an extra 30-50 bucks.

    We are running 12:1 on 100ll avgas with no issues yet, it's only a tick over 5 bucks a gal

    By some calculator's you need about 800hp at the flywheel to get 9.5s in a 3400lb car on average
     
  6. Briz

    Briz Platinum Level Contributor

    Was 700hp at the crank with mildly worked S3 heads and 13-1 comp in a 2900 Lb car. Went 10.50 2 weeks ago. Should have the rebuild done around the first of the year with cnc port job on the heads and a bigger carb. 9's on a stop is where Im looking to go.
     
  7. greatscat

    greatscat Well-Known Member

    Scat runs 9.9's on the stop for a short time, 3400 lb with me in it, 700 hp, TA SE stage2 heads flow 330's on intake with a 308s cam and 12.3 compression.E85 fuel. $2.00 or less per gallon plus runs cooler.
     
    300sbb_overkill likes this.
  8. Bluzilla

    Bluzilla a.k.a. "THE DOCTOR"

    As stated earlier in this thread, ..... the ET will hinge on the cars entire combination package. Higher horsepower "Potential" seems to be the benefit of Stage 3 heads.
    I find that trying different rocker ratios can be a benefit, and there are more guys selling their used standard rollers than Stage 3 rollers, ... so for me the Stage 2's have been the ticket.

    Larry
     
  9. Bens99gtp

    Bens99gtp Well-Known Member

    My te2 heads after cnc from finishline flow 380/269. Our 464 is about 12.2, our car with me in it is 3800, give me a few weeks and I will have some true ets. Just got it fired 2 days ago, but cant yet find any place open this weekend in Ohio to go shake it down some.

    But we are guessing hp to be in 750 to 775 area once fully tuned in
     
    Nailhead Ronnie likes this.
  10. ken betts

    ken betts Well-Known Member

    9.5 0r 8.5 or 7.5, How fast do you ant to go? Have you read the thread "Look Ma, it fits" in this forum? John Everett has the GSX iron motor and went a 7.62 at 191. Wait till the billet heads go on this winter! These heads have been available for almost 2 years.
     
    Last edited: Sep 12, 2018
    Bills72stage1 likes this.
  11. Briz

    Briz Platinum Level Contributor

    I didnt know they were ready for retail sale.
     
  12. alaskagn

    alaskagn Well-Known Member

    Thanks for the replys. Nothing is set in stone yet for how fast I am wanting to go, just looking for ideas...
    I have TA 1.6 rollers that are off the stock iron heads already. So that would also be money saved with going stg. 2. The headers aren't that big of a deal if I have to buy new ones to fit new heads.
    The intake I have doesn't have anything on it saying what it is but looks just like the SP1. Just blank..
    It'd be nice to be able to drive the car on occasion. It'd be nice to drive to the track that is 15 miles away. but not a huge priority. 100LL is readily available so that is what I am hoping to run for fuel..
    The car probably wont be a lot lighter than stock. Just missing the rear seat is about it for light weight parts.
    Built 12 bolt, Turbo 350 trans, running 30" tall tires...

    What should a nice set of ported heads cost that will do what I'm looking to do?
     
    billiegoat likes this.
  13. alaskagn

    alaskagn Well-Known Member

    Man if I didn't have a hefty deposit on the motor I'm having built already I would be all over this. I about crapped when I did see this a couple days ago.
    Obviously a great deal. I know I'm going to have way more $$ invested in my motor than your asking price for sure. and probably wont be as quick.
     
  14. alaskagn

    alaskagn Well-Known Member

    Sent you a PM
     
  15. hugger

    hugger Well-Known Member

    $3500+
     
  16. Bens99gtp

    Bens99gtp Well-Known Member

    I had about 3000 last year at TA for te2 heads with bigger valves(but no springs), sp2, and headers. I think I had another 1500 or so at finishline in the port work, springs, retainers. I also had them port the sp2 intake while it was there so everything matched and worked together, forget how much that was.

    So 4500-5000 in the top end. I too already had 1.65 roller rockers on my stage heads, that plus the fact I didn't want too much compression is why I didn't go with stage 3.

    I know Bob had a bigger set of te2 head there that used the jessel rocker setup that he didn't let out actual numbers or price but he did say the were a good bit over 400 cfm.

    After some talking on here last year it sounds like an spx with adapters or a mopar style intake would be better suited for the vigour and rpms seen racing.

    http://www.v8buick.com/index.php?threads/spx-vrs-sp2.328171/
     
  17. greatscat

    greatscat Well-Known Member

    Thompson Raceway Park in NE ohio is open,my home track
     
  18. Bens99gtp

    Bens99gtp Well-Known Member

    Hmmmmmm, I tried calling with no answers, are you going? I really want to get the new spool and axles in b4 going, hopefully tomorrow. Don't plan on any full out passes just shake down

    What is Zulus there??
     
  19. greatscat

    greatscat Well-Known Member

    Its going to be T&T all day, $20 car and driver, get a lot of passes. The Zulus are a motorcycle club that usually reserves the track on a sunday, bikes only.
     
  20. ken betts

    ken betts Well-Known Member

    They were ready for sale the day they came out of the machine. However everyone is waiting for a Dyno run. Either way I will be in BG this year!
     

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