The axle flange retaining bolts are specific to the bolt in axle rears. Buick has different bolt heads than the Olds rears and GS 10 bolt 8.2 has specific bolt heads also. It is amazing all the trouble Gm went through using different bolts for all these rears. The Buick 8.5 10 bolt rears have a elongated oval slug head and look like a T when out of the housing laying on a table...so when you tighten or loosen the nut the stud will wedge against the tube keeping it from spinning. I have seen some guys take a hex head bolt and shave a 1/4 of the head down to the stud stem so it will wedge against the tube. It will work good. 3/8" x 1" should do it fine thread is better but coarse will work too. lock washers can be used but again is not necessary as GM did not on the bolt in axles. The c-clip backing plates they did. ?? The nuts were flared also for the bolt in axle bolt and nut system too. I have extra original GM nuts and studs for the rear if you need. Just PM me. crush sleeve... Hard to give an exact foot lbs. that a crush sleeve will collapse ...reason one there are a few different designs inny and outty bubble crush area on the sleeve... The length of a crush sleeve the thickness of the tube material ...ALL these things affect the crush. oil the crush sleeve touch areas so you get an easier crush ...IT DOES make a difference. Another thing is a dot of oil on the washer sides too so the nut spins free and the washer to against the yoke .... AGAIN it helps. NOT ALOT...just to supply some slip. Preload - used bearing will have LESS preload than a NEW bearing. .010 inch pounds for the used .015 to .020 NEW Just make sure the stake the nut to the pinion thread...Not crazy like, just enough to cause a burr so the nut does not back off. YES still use lock tight. Good luck. Jim J D
I just always try to be absolute... I saw your pattern on the .034 and the pattern from the .041.... To me they look equal and opposite of each other so slip the difference and it should be DEAD on... JIm J D
OK update #4... .038 shim Backlash is .010. Carrier bearing shim ring gear side is .242 Other carrier bearing shim is .248 So, how's this look?... Edit...Jim/monzaz, PM sent... Again, thanks to all for your help and input...
Ok too me it appears to remove the most compound ...cost side appears a bit high on the tooth....But the drive side is better...Again looking at USED gears is alot of guess work. How does it feel when you spun the ring around compared to the other set-ups. Your looking /feeling for nice smooth spin in BOTH directions. stick the axles in each side NOT bolted in just for drag and look again see if the pattern squashes more . also if you have the ability put the backlash at .008 and Squirt more gear oil on the teeth too and see how it swipes. AGAIN it is your rear. You pick a pattern and go with it. I am ALL IN on the .038 ...Little Cavs pun there. Jim JD
Question: You now have a .038 pinion shim. You still have the same .242/.248 carrier shim combination,and yet,you still have .010" backlash? The backlash should have opened up a hair by decreasing pinion shim. It would be a slight amount,but it would be larger. Do you have a pair of .245 carrier shims? I would try that with the .038" pinion shim still in there. I think you would be golden. I have a bunch of those T-bolts,if needed.
Jim, you know I never actually free-spun using the pinion to turn it. I spun it by turning the differential and held my other hand on the pinion for slight drag. I didn't feel any binding and it seemed smooth. This last time I had slightly more pre-load on the bearings than before. I'm going to try to reduce backlash slightly and see what it looks and feels like, and also try it with axles installed. Stay tuned, will try this later this evening. Brian, I kind of rounded my backlash numbers slightly. With the .041 shim, I was between .009-.010, and with the .038, I was at maybe slightly over .010, just kinda of hard to tell with trying to hold pinion in place and rolling ring gear around. Thanks for the offer on the t-bolts. Jim has me covered.
Just for the sake of educating yourself,and others,leave the .038" pinion shim in there,and try a pair of .245" carrier shims,and what the pattern does when you decrease the backlash.
That is exactly what I was planning on. I've settled on the .038 pinion shim, just going to reduce backlash slightly and see where I end up. This V8Buick forum has to have some of the best most knowledgeable and helpful people out on the interwebs. I've learned alot doing this gear swap.
Update #5 .038 shim Backlash is .007. Carrier bearing shim ring gear side is .245 Other carrier bearing shim is .245 I'm thinking it's good. What say you guys?
Yep this is true... Dirt and oil and compound will be a factor. To get a TRUE backlash reading you need to have the correct preload on the carrier and a CLEANed (from all oil compound dirt debris etc.) ring to pinion contact area
D'oh! Just realized I hadn't been cleaning the marking compound off of the pinion gear this whole time EXCEPT this last time. Wiped it off of both the pinion AND ring gear. Lesson learned. I should've known better. So I'm guessing I'm golden now. Swap the setup pinion bearings out for the final assembly bearings. Install the crush sleeve, pinion seal and tighten and crush to spec(15-20 in/lbs for new brgs?), recheck the pattern and I should be good to go? Do I loctite the carrier bearing cap bolts?
Yes,you are good with this last setting.See what a difference a few thou can do?It's not real hard,just a little time-consuming.Do not Loctite the carrier caps.Coat the threads in oil,and torque to 65ft/lbs. I like to coat the pinion splines with white Teflon sealant,to prevent any oil from wicking through,and I use red locktite on the pinjon nut,for extra insurance.
All Sounds good. Now we just hope the gear does what it should from the pattern it should be quiet... But you can also see how used gears can be a bit off the normal NEW pattern. It will have its own pattern...you have to find a reasonable happy medium.... Sometimes you will get a used gear that just will not pattern up goo at all and you will need t make a decision of whether to try it or ditch it...???
Final update(I hope!)... Swapped setup bearings out. Put pinion in with new crush sleeve. Had it right at about 15 in/lb pre-load, tried for slightly more and ended up at about 25! So, out comes pinion, back in with new crush sleeve, got it crushed down and now have about 17 on the pre-load. Backlash .007 Carrier bearing shims are both .245 What is the torque spec on the stock cover supposed to be? And also the torque spec on brake backing plate/bearing/seal retainer?
OK. Everything is together, axles are in. Putting my in/lb torque wrench on the pinion nut and checking pinion pre-load with everything assembled, I'm getting about 35 in/lb to rotate it. It feels like a lot of drag to me, but I don't know. I'm assuming it will loosen up. What do you guys think? Let me know... Thanks!
