For those who are interested or follow this topic, I have an update. Yesterday, I received from GM Schematics and Blueprints for the following parts: Side marker lamps (917617 and 917618) 455 Fan Shroud (1238973) 70 GS Grille (9722787) 71 GS Grille (9852564) 71 Tail Light Lenses (5963643 and 5963644) and a couple other Turbo TA and GN items not of interest to most people on this list. The blueprints have detailed design specs and measurements. Copies will be made and forwarded to all of the manufacturers I have been dealing with. Can't promise anything, but the detailed specs should help with the mold design process. Alan
Al will any of these schematics (copies) be sent to the BPG. For Archiving for future needs? Don't flame me on the copy issue as I do not know the rules with GM, however it is just a suggestion.
SOUNDS GOOD ALAN NOW WE NEED MANY ORDERS FOR THIS STUFF ESPCECIALLY THE 71 STUFF YOU SHOULD PUT UP A POLL SEEING HOW MUCH THE MARKET WILL BEAR ON ITEMS LIKE THE 71 GRILLE
Poll Not totally sure, but I would suspect that 100 is the absolute bare minimum number. A couple of years ago, a manufacturer that I have a quote from had a 250 item minimum quantity on a piece this big. Also, Price is GREATLY affected by the quantity because of the Mold prices. The mold costs the same whether you do 1 grille or 50,000 (the max # the mold can make before retooling is needed). The mold estimate I received for a 70 grille was $250,000. Sounds like a ton of money I know. BUT, spread out over just 1,000 grilles, it only $250 per grille. Add in $200 more for the painting and molding and the cost per grille is around $450. I figure at least a 35% margin (10% for GM, 20% for me and 5% for miscellaneous expenses) and you get a sales price around $600. If I had the $250,000 to throw away, I'd go ahead and price grilles on the total number that could be made (50,000). That would reduce the per grille mold cost to $5. And the price would be about $240 less also. On the poll, I don't know how to set one of those up.
That's good news Alan, those are important items that now belong to someone who may actually try to do something with them. I'm just curious, I know this has been gone over many times but I have to ask. We know that GM destroyed the stamp for the 1/4s, and other misc things... but did they destroy ALL GS related molds? Is there a chance that the grill molds and some of the other smaller stuff is still around? I'm sure you have thought of this and come to a dead end already, but I just have to ask.
Ah,come on Al, some of us have Turbo cars too. What'cha got brewing for those cars :laugh: ? On the fan shroud, I'm assuming it's the 1970 model?( I hope,I hope,I hope).
I would like to see a poll for the 71 stuff and I'm willing to give ya the CC info up front Al:TU: I have a good grille but would like a better one or a spare and I NEED tail light lenses bad. Maybe a year down the road we will all be lucky. Bring on the 71 Parts and lets see how many people are wanting these.
Hey AL! :moonu: :moonu: :moonu: heh heh... Where ya been? As for archiving documents, I am more than willing and happy to pay an annual fee for a safe deposit box and will store them. With the inherent risk involved in keeping special documents in a file cabinet in a house or garage, a safe deposit box is probably a good idea.
AL, Glad to hear the '71 stuff is on the list....I know you've heard this a hundred times, but I'd definately be in for a set of '71 taillight lenses...and I am willing to put my money (or credit card:laugh: ) were my computer curser is! I have been wondering for a while now if you have tried to get your repro products carried by any of the major retailers of Buick parts(Year One, Cars, Poston, TA, etc.). Seems like getting your parts in their catalogs would help out tremendously. You mentioned that the '70 tailight lenses are GM licensed and since you are working with GM on future parts, I'm assuming they will be licensed as well. Will they then be in the GM Restoration Parts catalog? I know many other licensed repro parts already are. Just some thoughts. I'm sure you have problably looked into most of them, but thought it wouldn't hurt to mention them.
I think you will find a good market for the 70' 455 fan shroud, depending on cost. I could use 3 right now! And they have to be less expensive to do than any grill. JW
I also need a '70 GS455 fan shroud. But, I would like to see it before I would put down the CC info. I have one on my car right now, but I still think it is incorrect. I need to check that when I get it back....
Al, I would commit to buying (2) 71 grills if ever repoe'd .I heard that the '71 grills would be the hardest to manufacture because of the detail as compared to the 70. Next would be fan shrouds & maybe '71 taillight lenses. Let me know when you need a CC Number! It looks like there is hope getting some parts made! Randy
copies Phil, I've gotten several requests from people for copies of these. I'm curious what the desire is? Just so you know, they look like a house blueprint. Lots of lines, measurements, angles, etc. Very detailed. I don't mind sharing them. But I will have to check with GM and make sure it doesn't violate my licensing agreement. Alan
Al, knowing the quality of your parts, I will take at least one set of 71 taillights and at least one 71 grille (hopefully under the 500.00US dollar mark) should you make them. Let me know when you want my CC information. Thanks Tim
Couple of questions... Hey, I'm new here, so if these have been answered before on other repro parts, excuse my ignorance... Al, How would you propose to fund the tooling? I'm assuming you would do it with upfront grill payments. That's probably the only way to raise thet big chunk of cash! :eek2: If that's the case, I assume we would need to wait about six months to start seeing grills? I work in manufacturing, we buy and run molds, I know how these things go... We (my company) are thinking about sourcing our tooling overseas. Lots of companies are doing this now as a way to stay competitive. The prices are substantially less than stateside, and the quality has come way up over the years. At $250k, I'm assuming a stateside mold build. Have you or your supplier considered looking overseas for tooling? You could run it stateside, but if built overseas it could cut down on the capital outlay. Disclaimer: I'm 100% for American jobs, but if the tool is too pricey stateside for the build to be supported by this group and its never made, then what jobs would be affected anyway? I'm trying to be helpful here, I hope I come across that way. BTW, I give you a lot of credit for having the courage to honcho a project like this. I admire your dedication and appreciate the fact that your stepping to the plate. Oh yeah, I'd be interested in a '71 grill. Mine is in good original shape, but I'm way paranoid about damaging it after reading about replacement value on this forum!!! Thanks,
Re: Couple of questions... My chinese connections have quoted me $50,000 on a 70 grille mold. Big price difference. Alan
