Here are some pics of the manifold I am working on for my 350, should have the valley on and thermostat housing mocked up soon as well. Also in the pics are my roller rocker setup on a mockup shaft, should work pretty good! My next part to figure out is the FI and timing, I had intended to go with the MS system and need whatever advice those that have gone down that road may have! Any advice, links for information or places to pick up the parts would be great
I get all my MS stuff and wiring harness stuff from DIYautotune.com. They are good guys there. You'll probably have to have more specific questions to get decent answers, otherwise I'll I can say is to be sure to read the MegaManual extensively and repeatedly.
interesting rocker set up What type of arms are they ? what ratio are they ? Nice work on the intake Dave
The rockers are stainless steel roller tip, 1.6-1 for SBC I am making shafts to fit the SBB. I can use roller bearings or bushed, I was leaning toward bushed just in case of major failure I can just replace the rocker and not have needle bearing floating around.... what do you guys think? Maybe someone out their can help me with the shaft material selection, I was going to use stainless steel, but was not sure if it would be hard enough? I guess I need to re read the mega manual a few more time since it has been a while, then I can ask more specific questions. Thanks!
I didn't see any injectors or bungs. How will they go? With multiport you could go sequential, but will need a "cam sensor". High impedance injectors? good luck, Bruce Roe
I have not drilled the runners for the bungs yet, they will be very close to the cylinder head. I can get them aimed pretty close to the back of the intake valve. I am looking at doing sequential FI now that the MS3 will do it, I think. Has anyone found a good way to put a cam sensor on a 350? Thanks!
Plan A: Assuming you are using a crank trigger for the MS3. Get a MSD reluctor PN 8627 and a MSD Magnetic Pickup PN 84661. Grind off all but one pole on the reluctor. Remove point cam stuff from the distributor shaft. Install the reluctor on the distributor shaft.This may require some machine work. Temporarily use a set screw to position it on the shaft. Install the pickup on the distributor base. Install the distributor on the engine and set the crank at the timing mark for maximum boost. (that might be around 20 degrees BTDC). Set the distributor rotor so it is phased right at the cap post for that setting and lock it down. Now move the crank to 70 degrees BTDC and position the reluctor pole to point right at the center of the pickup and tighten the set screw. We usually do a single tack weld to hold the reluctor in place at this point. We do MSD distributors but have never done a stock Buick The only question is if there is enough room height wise for the pickup. Plan B: Since you are using a MS3 with 8 ignition coil drive outputs, go distributorless. Distributor phasing problems go away. You can install the MSD reluctor and pickup without rotor clearance problems. Just make an aluminum cap to replace the regular distributor cap. I hope you don't mind such a detailed post Paul
more detail the better, I have the ability and am gaining the knowledge. I am running a MSD dist now. Would I still need to do the mods to it? Thanks!
Are you doing a crank trigger so you can use the MSD distributor strictly for the cam sync? Which MSD distributor do you have (Part Number)? Sorry I don't have any pictures. I did these mods on customer cars. Paul
MSD dist part #8548 I need to re read the mega manual a few more times to get a handle on all the parts I will need, I thought I needed to get one of the for wheels for my crank trigger, I am open to use whatever works best also keeping an eye on the $ Has anyone looked at the cost of going distributor less?
You can use the MSD 4 magnet trigger wheel on the crank with the MSD non-magnetic pickup. Then use the VR input settings on the MS3. Now you can use the MSD 8548 distributor for the cam sync signal. You will still have to modify the distributor so it only puts out one pulse per distributor revolution by removing 7 of the 8 poles on the reluctor. The problem is the remaining pole is not in the right position timing wise if you are using the rotor and cap with ignition wires. Explaination: The MS3 needs the timing pulses from the crank trigger to be at least 10* before the most advanced timing you are going to map. So lets say the timing can go out as far as 45* BTDC meaning the crank trigger must be set to at least 55* BTDC. The cam signal must be set to at least 10* before the crank trigger which brings it out to 65* BTDC. I usually set the cam signal at 70*BTDC. The next timing event to consider is the rotor to cap phasing. The spark energy needs to be maximized when the cylinder pressure is the greatest or at max boost. For 16 lbs+ of manifold pressure the timing is usually in the low 20s so the rotor must be pointing dead center on the cap tower at that point. We need the rotor lined up with the cap tower at around 20* and the reluctor pole to line up with the pickup at 70*. You may be able to get everything aligned by using the MSD adjustable rotor. If not then the reluctor must be rotated on the shaft and reset. I have not been able to salvage the original reluctor and found it easier to get the replacement so the original can be machined off. We install the new one (after removing 7 of the 8 poles) with a set screw and after getting it timed, just do a single tack weld to keep it in place. Of coarse the rotor phasing is eliminated by going distributor less. The cheapest way is to go to the auto salvage yard and get a used set of LS1 or LS2 coils with the wire harness so you have the connectors. The MS3 will trigger them directly. I saw the cleanest setup 2 weekends ago where the coils where mounted on a plate attached center on the firewall. Paul
So if I get the coil packs would I still need to use the dist as my cam sensor, or would it just be to run the oil pump? Thanks!
Yes, you would still need to use the distributor as the cam sensor the difference would be that you would remove the 7 out of 8 poles on the reluctor, install the distributor on the engine, set the crank to 70* BTDC, turn the distributor till the pole lined up with the center of the pickup, lock the distributor down and you are done. No rotor to cap phasing to be concerned about and maximum spark throughout the timing range with no worries about spark arching over to the wrong tower on the distributor cap during high boost. Paul
You can buy an EFI distributor with a cam sensor included. One other approach is get an HEI from a 76-79 Seville or 79 Eldo. Their HEI has a couple extra switches (speed sensors) which close once per cam/HEI revolution. The original intent was to fire the 2 banks of injectors, but I was able to use one as a cam sensor when converting my 79 Eldo (403) to sequential injection. And i have one EFI from a couple decades ago (FIRST). It put a sensor around the #1 plug wire, guess a timing light pickup could be used this way. Bruce Roe
Ah I see! The 8 coil pack system to spoke of earlier that was mounted on the firewall, did they just use long wires to each spark plug? I was thinking of making a bracket to mount a coil on plug system that bolts on the head in the unused threaded holes on top of the exhaust ports, it would also double as a head shield...... Thank you guys for all the help and knowledge!:laugh:
I have a few questions if you don't mind sharing. What size and brand turbochargers do you have? What are you going to use to control boost? What boost levels are you looking at using? Paul
I will dig the turbos out and let you know what they are. I was looking at running a EBC electronic boost control solenoid, probably one from diyauto and controlling it with the MS3. I am looking at 12-15lbs of boost but trying to set it all up to allow up to 20lbs.... we will see how that goes. In addition to the air to air intercooler I would like to install a water/methanol injection system. All budget petmitting:3gears:
I am about to weld this intake together, but before I do can anyone point me toward more information on plenum volumes? Just want some more input.... Thanks!:beer
