Killed a con-artist repair shop big time!

So one of my old girl-friends calls me up the other day, says the starter on her mini-van is going out.

Not a big deal, I helped her buy said mini-van, and made sure she got the extended waranty with it. It's not a "factory type" warranty, but one of the aftermarket outfits. Cant remember the name of it right now.

So she uses her AAA card [which I also got for her] to tow it to a rinkey-dink little repair shop up the road from her.

Keep in mind that I'm doing all of this long distance, as I'v been in the NYC-Philladelphia area for the past month working.

To make a long story short, she calls me yesterday crying and says the repair shop wants $180, and they wont even start the repair work untill the waranty company approves the repair.... Hmmm... So I'm wondering what's up.... Shady waranty company or what.

I got back into Louisville yesterday, and this was one of the first things I wanted to get taken care of, so I make a visit to the reapir shop, and here's how the conversation goes:

Me:
I'm here about that mini-van, can you explain to me why it's going to cost $180 when there's only a $100 deductable on the waranty?
them:
Because the waranty co. will only cover a certain percentage.

Me:
That's not the way I read the waranty, I'm quite sure it's only $100. Could you explain it to me a little better?
Them:
Sure, the waranty co. will cover $55 for the labor and $130 for the parts maximum, so in addition to the $100 deductable, you will be responsable for the additional charges that come to another $80.

Me:
OK then, lets break this down, Autozone sells the starter for $64 and....
Them:
[interupting me] Oh no, we never do business with autozone, we have had really bad luck with them.

Me:
All right then, who do you use?
Them:
We use Bosch because it's a much higher quality product.

Me:
Bosch is a manufacturer, not a retailer, I'm asking who you buy it from, and how much it costs.
Them:
Oh... [hesitates a moment] We buy it from bumper-to-bumper, and it costs $185, and the labor comes to $90. Your responsable for the first $100, plus the ammount over and above what the waranty co. covers which is $80, so it's $180

Me:
I think you need to do business with someone else because the dealer only wants $120 for a new starter...... Wait a minute, isn't Bosch a RE-MANUFACTURER???? And something else, why do you want $90 labor to replace a part that's held in with 2 bolts and 3 wires???????
Them:
Well, er, um.... I... [he hesitates and realizes I'm no dummy]
The book says it requires 2 hours labor, and our labor rate is $45/hr. I cant do anything about that, and our mark-up on the starter is um.... [hesitates again and shuffles papers on his desk]

So I get out my cell-phone and I have bumper to bumper on speed dial because a friend of mine works there, I call them and put it on speaker phone. The conversation goes like this.... ON SPEAKER PHONE, right in front of the repair guy

*Bumper to bumper, can I help you?
*Is Allen there?
*Sure, just a second....

*This is Allen, can I help you?
*Allen, This is Darryl Roederer, how you doing dude?
*Hey Darryl!!! How you doing big guy? Long time!
*Yea, it has been a while, we ned to get together for a brewskie... Hey, listen, Kelly needs a starter for her minivan, do you sell Bosch starters?
*Yep, we sure do, Her van is a 1985, right? Just a moment here, it's gonna beeee...... $64 and we got it in stock. you gonna put it on or do you need someone to do it?
*You got someone cheap?
*Just a second, let me find out... [overheard yelling in the back-ground] Hey Kenny, you want to put a starter on a mini-van tonight??? How much??? Ok... [then back to me] Kid here in the shop named Kenny will do it for $30, and he gets off work at 5:00.
*You got a deal, send him over to Kelly's when he gets off, you want me to pay for the starter now with the credit card?
*Sure, or you can just send the $$$ back with Kenny.
*I'll just send cash back with with your guy if it's ok.
*Yea, sure, no problem Darryl, talk to ya soon.
*thanks Allen, see ya, bye.

So I hang up the phone and the repair shop guy is sitting there with a blank stare on his face and his lower jaw in his lap, and I said:

"Shame on you for trying to take advantage of this sweet innocent little girl.... SHAME ON YOU!.... I'v got half a mind to report you to the BBB"

I turned around to see Kelly grinning from ear to ear, and 2 other employees of the repair shop with shocked expressions who heard everything staring at me, and I said to Kelly "Let's get out of here" p

As I'm about to walk out the door, I turn back to him and said "$180 for a $60 part???? That's a 200% mark-up, you ought to be ashamed!!!"

Walking out to our cars, the guy comes out of the building and says "I made a mistake with my math, you were right, it's only going to cost you the $100 deductable, I'm so sorry, you want us to fix it?" ....to which I replied: "F#$%* you, you stealing, lying son of a #$%&*#$, and $%^&#$%#$, and you can #$%&*^%$#, and the $%^&* horse you rode in on!!!!!!"

The kid named Kenny showed up @ 5:20, and it took him about 15 minutes to complete the repair.... Total cost including tax came to $99.

Kelly, who is sooooo very sweet, but not quite so innocent, showed her appreciation for my looking out for her shortly there-after :Brow:

 

starter

so the shop diagnosed the problem, spent time on the phone with the warranty company, and they didnt get the job? did they charge you for checking it out? most shops that quote a labor time on a job also factor in the time to diagnose it.

 

They did absolutely nothing at all.
My brother diagnosed the problem, and the shop manager made Kelly call the waranty company. Kelly says she showed them how the starter was gringing slowly, and every 3 or 4 starts, it would do nothing untill you taped it with a hammer.

I just got off the phone with the warranty company. I called them this morning to "discuss this situation" with them, and they agree with me. It's a 1 hour job, and $130 for the parts includes a 100% mark-up.

Bottom line here is that they "doubled" their mark-up, and doubled their labor rate. [mighty convenient that everything they quoted was exactly double what it should have been]

Also, why would that guy follow me outside to "re-quote" his price once I called him on it??????????

Plain and simple, I busted a con artist, and I'm proud of it.

$275 to replace a $64 starter...... Who do they think their kidding?

 

Darryl, Great job bud! :beer

 

Love a great story....Well worth reading!!! Randy

 

I was working for Rose Auto in Tampa in the mid 90's and a woman walks in and asks how much a master cylinder for a 90 Delta 88 is. I tell her $16.99 with the core, rebuilt, lifetime warranty. She asks me how much for brand new, I tell her brand new Bendix also lifetime, $39.00 She looks at me kinda funny and says "Is there any way that part should cost $180.00?" Well, if it has hydroboost, and installation time, labor, brake fluid, maybe. She said, no. standard brake system and labor and stuff was additional, I just paid the shop down the road $180.00 for the master cylinder and another $100 or so to put it in. Wow! He, wow, I don't know lady,,, She says, "My husband owns a trucking company here in town and once in a while I pick up parts for big rigs and I don't think I paid that much for one on a Kenworth! My husband will be paying this guy a visit, and he's a big guy." I would have loved to see that confrontation. Just another example of how some shops screw chicks just because they think they are clueless. Honesty is the best policy, you will never get in trouble for doing the right thing.

 

where i come from that's called double dipp'n. the get money out of her and money out of the warranty company. of coarse the paper work looks different on both ends uzzled:

 

starter

you may be proud of yourself darryl, but at our shop we would of shown you the door. you have no clue of the overhead that is required to run a auto repair shop. if your brother diagnosed the problem why didnt you have him replace the starter? have you ever heard of frozen or stripped threads? a repair job is always easy when you have someone else do it.

 

Once, back when I was a teenager the master cylinder went out on my Regal. Being completely inept at the time (now just mostly inept) I had Midas do the job. $180($80. for the part,100 labor) that lasted a couple of years 'til it went out again. That time I decided to call around, $20. for the part and this time I would see how to do it. 15 minutes later it was installed. No more Midas for me. :spank:

 

Almost every time I pay someone do work for me, it's not done right. I'd just as soon do it myself, save a little and learn from it than to have to deal with the mess! :af:

 

. Honesty is the best policy, you will never get in trouble for doing the right thing.[/QUOTE]
It never got me into trouble, and don't have to go to bed with a bad concience
A starter is a 1/2 hour job in many cases!!! Accessability can be an issue though.

 

it all depends on the job, as far as what it costs. some jobs look way high, but are right on target with price. that however is b.s.

that guy was going to charge her 180 + what ever he got from the waranty company, the way i read it. that is not acceptable if you had been the this guy that darryl writes about, i would find the door myself... i would be wait'n on you. there is no defending that pricing. that was less than a 180 dollar job to start out with. just a starter.

 

trouble,here we come!!!

well, i can see both sides of this story.you have to take into consideration the overhead of the shop just to turn on the lights in the morning.then you have whatever training programs the techs go to(hopefully).most shops nowadays charge flatrate right out of the book.you usually wont find much diff between shops on that.say a shop quotes 1 hr of labor on a starter job,that should include the initial test,r&r the unit,and testing afterwards.sometimes that job will take 15min & sometimes it can involve half a day.what caused the unit to go out,poor ground,bad cable etc.also,the owner had been comunicating with the gal,not you,and you walk into HIS shop and buy a unit from your buddy at HIS cost,and then cuss him out for trying to make a living,have in your words"some kid in the back"take the job on"?i have reason to believe the kid isnt ase certified,tech school or trained in the repair field at all,just a guy looking to make some quick cash.will he pull it at his expence if it fails,or isnt the root of the total problem?man that takes balls!like john said,what if someone had changed it in the past not finding the true nature of the failure,and stripped the bolts on the install(a ground out 3/8 is a 10mm right?)also you state it was pre-diagnosed.did whoever check the battery,volt drop,ign swith,connections etc?or was the starter bad because it "wont start"?unless you have been an owner or manager,you have no clue how much a shop loses on such "simple"jobs.those rare ones you beat flatrate on make that difference up.now when it comes to parts markup,rule of thumb is 40%.some shops double the price,some parts stores show a "list"price in excess of that!yet the retail guy can buy it for less than "list".its a numbers game to make the end buyer think he got a deal.bosch used to reman a good product,not anymore,better than most mass production rebuilders though,but they do have a nationwide warranty,which a lot of shops like.in this case the list price was over the top.maybe they were trying to "double dip",but dont go off half cocked just because you dont agree with the price,there are behind the scene mixups.with so much offshore-third world country crap on the market,price should not be the determining factor on your decision.now on that particular minivan,my starter would have been $85.00+1 hr labor @$42.00 if it took 15 min or half a day due to unforseen problems.if shop owners get too many people ragging at them,cussing them out for an estimate(thats what it was,it hadnt been approved yet)they say,screw it its not worth it im gonna close the doors and work at wally-mart,who is going to be around to repair your wifes/girlfriends/kids cars when they are in a jam?lots of shops stay open late open early pay techs time & a half,just to make the customer happy and get the car on the road.take that into account before you blow up next time.if you talked to me like that when presented with an honest estimate,then bending over backwards to make you happy(which he did by following you out the door,but you didnt give him the chance) i would throw your ass out the door,and invite you NEVER to come back.ok have i started some trouble now? :spank: just my EXPERIENCED opinion,take it with a grain of salt,just try to see both sides before you freak out next time p

 

2 soloutions:find a good mechanic that doesn't need to make a 95 percent profit out of eveything; or, do the work yourself-that way you know what you did, you learned from it(if you didn't know how to do it before), and there is no thousand dollar profit being made.

I have a good mechanic(he's a good friend as well) that does some of my work, and everything he has done to the '76 in the past, has held up and worked really well, and he even rebuilt my tranny for 200 bucks! Shifts nice firm and crisp, like a new tranny should! Even has a good kickdown as well, lots of passing power! :bglasses: After doing a few things myself on my car, I found out that it isn't that bad after all, especially if you have someone helping you that can teach you how to do certain things if you don't already know them! Some things I have done on my own and I learn pretty easily just doing it myself as well. I put the car in primer myself, first time every painting a car(a real one anyways ) and I must say, it looks pretty good for a first timer thing. I learned a whole lot from it! :TU:

 

the bench?

hey dave/jim,might we want this in "the bench" section?it might get more responses there,and i would love to see some more opinions on the story.perfect example of behind the scenes...jim is looking for a chunk of frame right now for a customers car.he didnt catch the damage on the initial inspection,yet he is trying to fix it,while staying within his estimate.i am quite sure that time/part is costing him money...not all jobs are money makers :laugh:

 

hi, i,m new here but i'd have done the same thing for a sweet not so innocent little girl named kelly. hope you had fun.

 

aftermarket warranty

i to can atest to dealing with mickey-mouse aftermarket warranties, since i
deal with them everyday..they suck..20 min on hold just to talk with some
yo-yo who wants to grind on parts and labor pricing. our labor rate is $82.00
per hour but ext warranty has a $72.00 cap..guess what..customer pay's the
diff or tow it out.
plus i wish i has a $1.00 for every customer that comes in with there vehicle
that someone else diagnosed 98% of the time there wrong..if i put on what
the customer said was the problem and the problem still exsist than what??

i'am dealing with one right now...customer need's new transmission..slip's in
every gear..mickey-mouse warranty say's they will send me a "used' trans
or the customer can apply $1985.00 toward new trans..$3100.00..customer
elect's to go with used trans..we intall it..guess what..car wont move.
mickey-mouse warranty also has 3 day rental car cap..cars been there 2
week's now and still wont move.. ou:

 

Something like this has happened to my sister. The car (a 89 caviler) needed a muffler. The dealer told her it needed it because it was broken inside and some othee crap. My dad was in work up to his arm pits and couldnt do it so he told her to take it to the Midas in town becuse of there large name and sears was to far away. He would have fixed it himself but it just a stock car and no time with 12hour 7 days aweek work. Any way they test the muffler and cat by drilling hols in them with a hole saw and then put one on for a v6 car and not the 4 bannger. well she charges it to my old mans card and when he get home and sees the bill it back to midas in the morning and let me tell youme my dad and older brother are no small guys. but me and my brother have a coler head then my old man and lets just say when it hit the fan the owner who has only been in the shop twice fired all the employees right there and closed the shop. 2 weeks later it was open with new people and the have this story of anyone that was treaded wrong or feels riped off to come on down and they will make it right.An to think they were just going to take my sisters money and laugh about it

Doug

 

starter

jamie, exactly what i was trying to say! i cant tell you how many times weve had people, not regular customers come to our shop requesting we do a QUICK repair or diagnosis on their car. what they dont tell us is their brother or father or uncle have tried playing mechanic on the car and totally messed the repair up. then they wanna dump the car on our laps, yet they scream bloody murder if they have to spend over ten dollars! why is it that plumbers, carpenters and electricians can make a profit, but a mechanic is considered a crook? our shop labor is 85.00 an hour. weve been in business 38 years so i think were doing something right. cars are hi tech machines, and require expensive equipment to properly diagnose problems. you wont get very far with a hammer and a screwdriver.

 

My ex mother in law had a 1996 Nissan Altima and her battery went dead on her one day leaving work so i told her to get a jump and bring it home which she did.She was not only a woman but from Europe as well.Well i tested the battery and sure enough it needed replaced.I told her i would get her one and she said she would just go to Sears and buy a battery and they would install and check charge system.Well she calls from there saying she had a bad alternator and it would cost 269.00 for a new one-then told her if she left without them doing it with their new battery in her warranty would be void.I called CPW and they had one for around 100.00 so i went and talked to the service manager to see if we could work something out.I took my load tester with me to make sure the alt. was even bad and guess what?It was fine!!!!!I blew a gasket and all the manager could say was "Well when it was in here our machine said it was bad".Bull!!!I was so mad i notified the local BBB and within 2 days he called me asking why i called on him.In any event,they ended up sending her a 100.00 gift card-hush money?Who knows but i never did like them.All these guys who work in shops can say what they like about overhead but there ARE good shops with honest people who will not mark up repairs 200+ percent.And the best place i've found good mechanics to rebuild carbs and other stuff i can't do is at the local-been around forever-auto parts stores.