Who can tell me what the correct header bolt length is for a 455 using TA Stg 1 alum heads, TA headers, and remflex gaskets?
Are we sure 3/4" is long enough with the TA headers? I don't remember how thick their flanges are and I don't have them here at the moment to measure them. There is a review on summit about a set of Buick header flange bolts that are 3/4" long and the guy complains they are too short with remflex gaskets and Dougs headers (I looked them up, they're 3/8" thick). https://www.summitracing.com/parts/arp-120-1201/reviews/make/buick?prefilter=1
1" might be better. I believe mine were that long. Maybe just thread a long bolt in and measure, it's 3/8-16.
The Arp's may be 1in but I do remember with the reflex gaskets they only had a thread or so to work with getting them started but obviously once the gasket crushes and they are tight your good.
My MT headers have a pretty thick flanges. I'm pretty sure I used 1" long bolts. I would just check by threading in a regular bolt and measuring, easy to do.
I use the 3/4 length bolts all the time at the dyno.. I like this set.. https://arp-bolts.com/kits/ARPkit-detail.php?RecordID=2023 Now, I do not recommend any header gasket for a Stage 1 application.. use the exhaust manifold gaskets, with just a touch of sealer.. they will never blow out, and you will never have to re-torque. The smear of sealer on the header side will help seal any reasonable flatness issue.. in your case Nick, I think your headers are brand new, so that is no issue. I hate header gaskets.. if the headers are so bad they need super thick gaskets, the header needs to be addressed, not bandaided with thick gaskets, because that is typically a temporary fix. With Stage 2 heads, I use sealer, no gaskets at all... for my own stuff.. for customers, we adhere the best composition gasket there is to the head side, and then use a smear of sealer on the header side.. the sealer is required on the bottom side of the center ports, or they will leak there.. every one does.. They will blow out eventually, but Stage 2's are way easy to change, vs the Stage 1 stuff. JW
So Jim, when you say no header gasket for a "Stage 1" application, forgive me but I'm just trying to be anal here for anybody else that might be reading this thread. Are you talking about about TA Stage 1 aluminum heads (what I have) or are you talking about stock Buick cast iron heads? So for my application where I have TA aluminum heads and headers you're recommending I use exhaust manifold gaskets and not remflex header gaskets?
Correct.. this is exactly how I did your motor on the dyno. but with no sealer.. since my dyno headers have been trued up, and it's not a long term deal, with heat cycles and that.. Done it many times on the dyno, with no sealer at all.. they seal up just fine.. and several installs in cars, that are years, some even decades old.. The issue with composition gaskets is that they get brittle, and shrink, and then they crack and blow out.. so folks go to those expensive metal gaskets.. I don't think that is required.. the exhaust manifold gaskets won't blow out, and will seal up just fine with a touch of high temp sealer.. since the bolt holes are slotted, they are also a snap to install. Start the header with a front and rear bolt.. just a thread, no gaskets.. now install all but the center bottom bolt.. again, just get them started.. Now coat the metal side of the gasket with a smear of high temp silicone. And slide the gasket it place.. they re 3 pieces for each side, with slotted bolt holes.. Put the metal side with the sealer toward the header.. Once all the gaskets are in place, install the center bolt, and tighen all the bolts.. ..... This is something I learned from experience.. 15 years ago, I would have told you that you have to use header gaskets.. I got tired of them blowing out, after installing a lot of sets on customer cars, and my own stuff, and Ron over at the dyno suggested that I use the manifold gaskets and a touch of sealer.. and that has worked great for me over the years. JW
I prefer the 1” bolts on a Stage 1 header except for 2” primary tubes, and in that case I like 1” bolts in all locations except for that pesky middle one. For the pesky middle one, I use 3/4” bolts. I also prefer stainless, 12-point bolts. I use quality header gaskets (not those aweful Mr Gasket white ones), and no sealer. I will also start the final torque from the middle bolt and work my way toward the ends. Re-torque a time or two after some heat cycles never hurts, and flat washers help keep the bolts from loosening. Stage 2’s are easier - 1” bolts and good header gaskets, no sealer necessary.
I believe I used 1 1/8 on my stage 2 with remflex gasket. my motor is moved back and even after clearancing tubes I could not get #7 to not burn right through regular gaskets. I even cut the flange to allow more flex. but with my remflex no leak, but it's not easy to clean off either. the bolts that came with them were only a few threads in and I didnt like that
Jim, what's the torque value here with stainless bolts in alum heads? I'm also assuming anti seize should be used.
I would not be using a torque wrench on something like this. I make them snug, go by feel. Pretty sure exhaust manifold bolts are 18 ft. Lbs. Yes on anti seize.
I just put a set of 2” T/A headers on my T/A AL Stage 1 headed BBB. This is the 4th set of headers that have been on there (I’ve owned this car since 1982) and since using stainless header bolts, they never stay tight. I was missing 3 when I removed the old headers. This time I Loctited the bolts in with red Loctite. I’ve been around “nuts and bolts” everyday for decades, being in the auto service biz. No brainer IMO. ARP stainless bolts in AL heads will loosen themselves up, and fairly quickly, if you put any sort of miles on your engine. The other 3 sets of headers (all different brands) were not coated and didn't fit nearly as well as the T/A ones. Mike did an exceptional job with these. I like the way the collectors point toward the back of the car (tilted up a bit) when installed, unlike the others which were straight, so they point down (make sense?). I had T/A send them to me so I could “test fit” them and make any necessary adjustments prior to sending them to Jet Hot for coating. I was pleasantly surprised that no “adjustments” were needed.
Ok,I didn't see anyone address the bolt length with heads that have the 4 extra head bolts. There are 2 I believe that are in the flange area and on my aluminum stage1 i needed to use shorter that 3/4 or it would bottom out against the bolt. When this happens if you keep pulling to tighten it you will take some threads out.
