Fired up the 455 project over the weekend...

Discussion in 'V-8 Buick Powered Regals' started by 84ZZ4, Nov 15, 2004.

  1. 84ZZ4

    84ZZ4 Well-Known Member

    Another 455 Regal roars to life :grin: This one would be my '83 T-type that I got a while a back (a few regulars might have seen a post or two from me way back in the day, though the project has been on the back burner for a bit. I ran into a few snags and was unable to complete the cam breakin, so I just parked it. I'm hoping to get back to it at Thanksgiving.

    Last time I tried to fire it, everything seemed fine but the fuel pump didn't work. I ordered a replacement from Autozone and then got sidelined replacing the clutch in my Firehawk. On Sunday I pulled the original pump, and though I couldn't find anything wrong with it, I put the replacement in. After using a vacuum pump to pull fuel through the fuel pump, we cranked the motor over a few times with the carb inlet disconnected and got actual fuel coming out!!!

    So then I go to start it. First snag of the day goes to the battery. It had a HELL of a time cranking the motor. I don't know where I got the battery or even what kind of shape it's in, but it had trouble cranking fast enough to catch even with a charge booster AND another vehicle hooked up with jumper cables. It DID eventually catch though. I don't think it's a timing issue, I'm running about 10* of base timing and it didn't seem to have TROUBLE cranking the motor, it just wasn't cranking it FAST.

    Second snag was that the temperature sender I'm using is either incompatable with my factory gauge or it's on crack. I'm using a factory sender for an '85 Cutlass (dual wires in a single sender) to operate both the gauge and the idiot light. The gauge got up to about 220 after five minutes of cam breakin, and I shut the motor down, only to find out the thermostat wasn't open and none of the fans had ever come on (no idiot light either, and I know that works, because I grounded the lead and the light came on). Since the motor didn't seem to be that hot, I fired it back up and did 10 more minutes of breakin.

    When the temp got up to about 240 on the gauge the 180 thermostat opened... after it was pegged for a little while the primary fan switched on and off a few times (turn on temp is 195? 192? it's a GN fan switch). Everything seemed to be going ok; I had 25-30 psi on the mechanical oil pressure gauge even with the motor fully up to temp (I think I have 15w40 oil in it). Then I hit the second snag.

    I'm using a radiator for a 92 Camaro Z28, and it's designed to have the heater core return hose go to the radiator instead of the intake or water pump. It had a hose nipple held on with a band clamp, and the end of the hose nipple gave way and hosed everything down with coolant. The coolant didn't seem THAT hot--if it was anywhere near 280 it would have been obvious--so I concluded my temp gauge is useless.

    However, I don't have any easy way to block that hole in the radiator, so I might just run the hose to there instead. If I were to use the hose barb on the water pump and the return in the radiator, would that work? Or is the water pump the return and the back of the intake the send? I was thinking of blocking the back of the intake with a pipe plug and just using the water pump and the radiator. Unless anyone has any suggestions on how to block the hose nipple in the PLASTIC END TANK on the camaro radiator?

    Next question: What is everyone doing for a dual exhaust crossmember? My headers stop about 2" from the factory crossmember on the driver's side, and that ain't gonna work.
     
  2. gs_jimmy

    gs_jimmy Well-Known Member

    Ron,

    I used an A-body double hump cross member from a '68 Tempest. Had to cut 1/2 inch off each side, then bolted everything in place on the trans. Used a vise grip to hold the crossmember to the frame and drilled in 3/8 (9/16 head) bolts to mount thru the frame. The more expensive way is a G-force crossmember (about $190 or so) probley more correct, and is a very nice piece.

    As for the radiator problem, run the hose to the radiator and block off the motor with a pipe plug and teflon tape or sealant. Can't see a better way to "fix" the radiator since its plastic.

    Can you get the right sending unit for the gauge? That would solve the incorrect reading on the gauge. The better way would be to get a gauge pod that mounts on the A pillar (Summit or Jegs) and run a good after market gauge. Then you'll really know the engine temp.

    Good luck with the Regal

    Jim
     
  3. 84ZZ4

    84ZZ4 Well-Known Member

    I used a G-force x-member in my '85 442; I'll probably just do the same thing. As you said, it's a very nice piece. I'm just trying to find out if I need to order one for a turbo buick car or a 307/305 car...

    Thanks for the advice on the heater core; it won't cause any problems to run it like that? I can easily block the intake with a pipe plug. I'm still wondering why the hell it blew out, it didn't get that hot and I don't think the radiator cap vented to the overflow at all. Only thing I can think of is if exhaust is getting into the cooling system? What's the easiest way to check that, run with the cap off and look for bubbles?

    As far as the sending unit for the gauge, I'm going to do all aftermarket gauges in this car anyway. I can't stand the standard black on aluminum square gauges. It just gave me a hell of a scare is all. :shock:
     
  4. silvergs72

    silvergs72 silvergs

    The back of the intake is the feed to the heater core and the nipple on the water pump is the return. You would have to get one of those hose nipples :eek2: and put it on the water pump to block this off and then put the return hose on the radiator.

    Good luck
    Mike
     
  5. 84ZZ4

    84ZZ4 Well-Known Member

    I was afraid of that.

    Well, back to figuring out how to block the port on the radiator. Temporarily I'll probably use a short length of real heater hose (not the crap they had on there), a hose barb, and a pipe cap. That should work until I can figure something more elegant out.
     
  6. gs_jimmy

    gs_jimmy Well-Known Member

    Ron,

    If you see bubbles in the radiator with the cap off it may be rather severe. I found that particular problem in my ElCamino SS, turned out to be a blown head gasket, followed closly by a blown engine. Oh well, only $3500 down the drain (in 1982).

    Jim
     
  7. 84ZZ4

    84ZZ4 Well-Known Member

    The gaskets are new (the heads were off the block while it was on the stands). I did think about exhaust getting into the water jacket, but if that IS happening, it's probably more likely that I have WRONG head gaskets as opposed to blown ones.

    I'll see though. I'll check the condition of the oil while I'm at it.
     
  8. gs_jimmy

    gs_jimmy Well-Known Member

    Good plan. My motor only had about 3000 miles when it went. Oil was fine when I last checked, but radiator showed the little bubbles blowing in. Could be the problem, but if everything is fresh, I'd seriously look at the plug from the radiator. I've seen those things split rather easy. Radiators usually run about 15-17 lbs of pressure, that and heat could kill off the rubber plug.

    Just a thought.

    Jim
     
  9. Vern

    Vern Well-Known Member

    There was someone on the net selling a duplicate if you will of the G force crossmember for $100. But I don't remember where I saw it. I heated mine with a torch and beat it into shape with an 8lb hammer when I had it up on a lift. Some say this will weaken it and that it may eventually crack. So far mine has been fine. It took me about 30 minutes.
     
  10. 84ZZ4

    84ZZ4 Well-Known Member

    Yeah, I know. It didn't vent through the cap at all, even at operating temperature.

    I'm trying to think offhand what ISN'T fresh. The heads were tanked, and every gasket except maybe the rear main seal was replaced. Intake is a new Edelbrock performer 455. I didn't touch the rotating assembly aside from cleaning the carbon off the top of the pistons. Water pump is new, radiator is new, radiator cap is new.
     
  11. gs_jimmy

    gs_jimmy Well-Known Member

    This will sound stupid, so bear with me. Did the radiator cap get replaced? These things will fail, yet still look OK. I guess I would spend the 5 bucks on that before ripping things apart. Run the car and see what happens. Of course, do it after the new gauge goes in so you know what the real engine temp is.

    Jim
     
  12. 84ZZ4

    84ZZ4 Well-Known Member

    It sounds even stupider after I re-read the last line of my last post :laugh: Just messing with ya :pp

    Yes, the radiator cap is brand new. I replace them randomly sincc I hate bad caps. I think the first thing I'll do is fix the heater core lines and run it with the cap off to see what's going on. I'm goign to be a bit upset if it's an exhaust leak into the water jacket.
     
  13. 84ZZ4

    84ZZ4 Well-Known Member

    For the moment I just plugged the open port on the radiator with a piece of heater hose, a pipe nipple, and a pipe cap (held on with hose clamps of course). That seemed to fix THAT problem.

    I filled the radiator and the overflow tank, and fired it up. It had bubbles in the overflow tank the first time it got up to temp, and then it sucked the whole contents of the tank into the radiator when I shut it off and let it cool. It did that twice--I assume it was just purging air in the block. Since then, no more bubbles, just "waves" in the overflow tank from the cam lope :Brow: Damn this motor sounds goooooood. I can't wait to actually drive it. :grin:

    Motor seems to run good but is hard to start--cranks and cranks and cranks but doesn't want to catch, and so help you if you touch the pedal while cranking--it'll flood. I'm not worried, I've done NO tuning on the carb yet. The spark plugs are definitely coated with a little bit of soot (apparently from running rich). The exhaust doesn't actually smell too bad though. It has a little blowby out the fresh air tube from the valve cover until it comes up to temp, and then there isn't much at all--I am running a functional PCV system (no other emissions controls hooked up).

    Next problem is that I don't seem to have Drive anymore. I had it move forward once or twice (had to rev to like 2500 to get it to do so) and now I have no forward gears. Reverse still seems to work fine, so to get it in the parking spot I had to back all the way out of my driveway and back back in. And here I was hoping the 200-4R would at LEAST last until I got all of the work done to the car. I'm still waiting for the turbo buick trans experts to get back to me on a possible diagnosis.

    At any rate, that's the diagnosis. Summary is so far it looks like the motor is fine but needs tuning and the tranny apparently took one look at the 455 and said "No! I quit!" :pp
     

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