Buick 215

Discussion in 'Small Block Tech' started by Moyock13, Mar 5, 2017.

  1. pmuller9

    pmuller9 Well-Known Member

    So it looks like the 300 crank can be modified to fit the 215 block.
    Is that a direction that you might consider?
     
  2. Moyock13

    Moyock13 Well-Known Member

    I'd actually like to try several different builds. Nothing to bold with the Buick blocks. But if I can come up with an Oldsmobile 215 I might consider stroking that block. I'd really like to find a 4.0 or 4.6 Rover motor. They are basically a stroked 215, but they are a little thicker and 4 bolt main.

    The Oldsmobile has 6 head bolts per cylinder, where the Buick only has 5. That's why the Buicks tend to leak and blow head gaskets. If I can get the picture upload to work I'll post some pictures showing the difference.
     
  3. Jim Blackwood

    Jim Blackwood Well-Known Member

    I based my blower motor on an Olds. Double-helicoiled the head bolt threads, still loosened up.

    You are way off on your weights. The Buick 215 is 318lbs. The '64 300 is 80 lbs heavier, the 340 block is 2 lbs heavier than the 300 block. The 350 is the same as the 340, so that leaves the extra weight of the iron heads and intake. That extra weight is much less than you think. As I said earlier, the iron 350 is right at 450 lbs. Oh, and the Rover being 30 lbs more than the Buick 215 makes the iron head 350 only 100# heavier, not "hundreds".

    Jim
     
  4. Moyock13

    Moyock13 Well-Known Member

    Jim, I stand corrected. Thanks for pointing out the weight differences. I'm still intrigued by unusual engines and the 215 just has a hold of my curiosity presently. I have a 53 Hemi motor that weighs roughly 700# and several Ford Flatheads that weigh in at about 550# each.
     
  5. Jim Blackwood

    Jim Blackwood Well-Known Member

    Yes, the 215 really is a light engine, and is capable of good power. In your Luv truck, even the stock build with something approaching 200 hp is going to be a pleasant experience for you. Around 250 it will be quite lively. But beyond that I'd go for a more durable block. (and have) Unfortunately the Rover blocks have their own set of problems and building power can be a frustrating and expensive game of Russian Roulette which I've chosen not to play. Plus 30 lbs. For the 50 lb difference between that and the 300 iron block it becomes an easy choice.

    I ended up with the 340 and an Eaton M112, liquid intercooler, port injection, and EDIS, eventually going to COP, maybe this summer. But the 340 has 1-3/16" taller decks than the 215, 5/8" taller than the 300. Not as compact then, and not a good fit in the MGB. The 350 or the 300 or the 300 stroked to 350 are all better choices in most cases.

    Blowers are great, there is no denying it. Anyone who thinks not is just jealous or inexperienced. But, given the choice between a blown 215 and a N/A 350 I'd have to give the nod to the 350. For the cost of the blower you can buy the TA heads and intake and now the weight is very similar, certainly within less than 50 lbs and any car is going to take that on the front end without complaint.

    Beyond all else though, you are going to love the power under the curve. Compared to that old 4 banger, well there is no comparison that does the experience justice.

    Jim
     
  6. sailadams

    sailadams Platinum Level Contributor

    Hey, Jim. One of the 215 engines I have has a Buick Dual Path transmission on it. I was thinking of using the bell on that to build a converter for a 200-4R. What do you think?
    Also, Moyock, I have a couple of Olds 215 engines that I picked up from Tom Cotter, one with a flexplate & 2bbl intake, one with a flywheel & no intake manifold. You could have either or both of these for a low price, or trade for a buick 215 block. I'm going with lowest weight 215 for a Corvair swap and Buick 300 for MGB.
     
  7. 300sbb_overkill

    300sbb_overkill WWG1WGA. MAGA

    PLUS, with a 300/340/350 engine its much easier to get a trans that will directly bolt to them or cheaply adapt to as well, a BOCP to Chebby adapter is around $40! So a whole lot more transmission options without an $850 adapter!

    If you choose a sbb 300/340/350 you can stroke those using nascar take out rods with a set of the customizable AutoTec pistons to get even more cid out of them. Depending on how good the block you source sonic tests will determine how many cubes you can go to. With a 3.990 stroke and a 3.905 bore you can build your very own sbb 383 stroker if you get a block that can be bored that much. A sbb 350 with minimal core shift will be your best bet to be able to go that big on the bore because the sbb 350 starts at 3.80" while the 300/340 start out with a 3.750" bore. I have read that the sbb 300 block's cylinder bores are quite thick, so you might get lucky with a 300 if you can find one of those. The bad part about choosing a sbb 300 is you still need to source a 340/350 crank and have expensive main journal grinding done to it to make it into a stroker, so keep that in mind as well. The 340/350s only would need the offset grinding to stroke them the extra .140" for a set of nascar take out rods that can bought for pennies on the dollar of what they cost new that will still hold up to almost anything you can throw at them.

    I think you wrote that you already have the 215 engines so might as well use those, so when you source your sbb 300 engine for the crank to stroke the 215 you can also stroke that crank an extra .140" to use with a set of 6.00" nascar take out rods, but would have to figure out pistons or get custom. Don't scrap the 300 after you take the crank out, save it to install a sbb 350 crank in it if you were to acquire another project? Or don't, dealers choice but a sbb 300 stroker with a set of ported TA Rover heads would be a REALLY fun engine to run in just about any car and would only weigh in at around 400 lbs!(IIRC) At least sonic test it before you scrap it, if it tests well you probably would be able to sell it to an MGB guy that doesn't want the 300 crank anyway. GL


    Derek
     
  8. DEADMANSCURVE

    DEADMANSCURVE my first word : truck

    I know - it's not a buick and there are some dif's . it's an interesting article though , april 2017 hot rod page 62 : "flyweight fueler" . lightest top fuel car ever . injected olds 215 . without driver , with fluids = 720 lbs total , hand loaded into a pickup , 7's at 195 and spankin blown hemi's until tire technology caught up to the power . not a lot of tech but some real interesting insight into how they put that together and their thought process .
    so what i'm kinda sayin is - light makes might ! but we all know that I guess .
     
    Last edited: Mar 11, 2017
  9. Moyock13

    Moyock13 Well-Known Member

    Sailadams, lets talk! If you're interested I've got an unmolested Buick 215 Hi Compression motor with the DynaFlow still attached in the garage. I may consider trading.

    I've been looking for a Buick 300, I would love to stroke an Oldsmobile 215...! That sound a little less than PG! :shock:

    One of the many ideas rolling around in the old mellon.

    Deadmanscurve, I'll have to look up the Flyweight Fueler article. Sounds interesting. Thanks.
     
  10. Jim Blackwood

    Jim Blackwood Well-Known Member

    The biggest thing with using the Dual-path bell on the 2004r is that the 2004r doesn't come with a removable bell. You'd first need to get your longitudinal dimensions sorted out. Find the stack-up for your converter and flexplate and see if anything is left between the 2004r bell and the engine.

    The reason the SBC-BOP(SBB) adapter is such a sweet deal is because it's only 1/8" thick and you can make that up with washers between the flex plate and converter if you have to. That's the way to do it if you can make it work. Warning: Do Not bottom the converter bolts out as you will damage the lock-up clutch. BTDT

    It's possible the locating dowels could match up between the BOPR and BOP/SBC. I'd check that first as it'd make the job way easier.

    Jim
     
  11. ihatepunks

    ihatepunks Member

    Information: Prepare to spend (waste) tons of money. Prepare to spend (waste) tons of time searching for non existent reasonably priced transmission solutions,
    prepare for lots of stress and prepare to call the junk man when you get tired of it all..............lol.

    Experience: "Had" a 63 Skylark with a dual path tranny." Sold it. (see above)

    Solution (at least for me): Went back to Classic Impalas.

    Possible solution: Find more common Buick motors to tinker with in order to save your sanity...lol.:Dou:

    I wish you the best
     
  12. 724wd

    724wd Member

    I have a Kennedy Engineered 215-to-GM trans adapter. Not mounted yet (LOOOONG term project), but 1/2" thick adapter. SEEMS well made. Been a lot of years, but it was under $300 at the time.

    "REF# 9100 Aluminum V8 to Toronado or Turbo 350/400 and 700R4 and Powerglide. The '61-'63 Buick-Olds 215 V8 did not come with a good transmission. Using our adapter, you can fit a reliable Turbo trans to the engine. It also fits Powerglide if you specify when ordering. If for a Turbo 400, the 350 converter must be used. Comes with a modified flexplate. A Buick flexplate core is required."
     
  13. Moyock13

    Moyock13 Well-Known Member

    So, to build the Hemi I've got in the shed will cost big $$$

    I'm in the middle of building a LM7/LS6 motor that is costing big $$$

    Got a couple of Ford Flatheads in the shed that I would like to rebuild, big $$$

    Built a GM 350 a few years back for my Nova, big $$$

    Sold a Buick 350 a few years back because it would have been big $$$

    I'm not seeing the difference in building the 215's or some other motor, because it going to be big $$$

    Someone help me out here if I'm missing something.
     
  14. sean Buick 76

    sean Buick 76 Buick Nut

    Maybe you would consider selling to this fellow here who started the thread? He would put it to good use it sounds like...
     
  15. sean Buick 76

    sean Buick 76 Buick Nut

    I wish you were closer I would trade you my olds 215 for your Buick 215...
     
  16. sailadams

    sailadams Platinum Level Contributor

    If you want to sell it, I'm game. Fellow who started the thread would have dibbs first, of course.
    Also, I've got a Kennedy Eng 215 to Corvair adapter that I don't need in case someone out there is interested. Unless someone has the reverse camshaft etc needed to change the Buick 215 to reverse rotation like a Corvair.
     
  17. sean Buick 76

    sean Buick 76 Buick Nut

  18. Jim Blackwood

    Jim Blackwood Well-Known Member

    Wasn't there some way they either flipped over the diff, or put the engine in the back seat? Seems like on VWs they somehow managed to put the ring gear on the other side. All of which sounds difficult, but finding a reverse ground cam and backwards starter seems worse somehow.

    Jim
     
  19. 300sbb_overkill

    300sbb_overkill WWG1WGA. MAGA

    Wasn't one of the 215 engines used in a boat? If so and its a reverse rotation engine which most were back then for boats perhaps trying to source a cam through that route may make it easier to find a reverse rotation cam and even starter?



    Derek
     
  20. Dan Jones

    Dan Jones Well-Known Member

    Moyock13,

    A friend of mine has some serious health issues and is selling off his MGBGT V8 project. He's selling the engine bits separate from the car. Some of the parts that may interest you are an Olds 266 stroker short block kit (Oldsmoble 215 block, Buick 300 crank with mains turned down to fit 215 block, narrowed Eagle 5.7" SBC small journal forged steel H-beam rods, Venolia forged pistons). He also has a bunch of MGB V8 swap specific parts, including stainless headers. He also has the bits for a T-5 5 speed installation and there's also a Rover 3.9L EFI set up. Parts are located near St. Louis, MO. If your interested, let me know.

    Thanks,
    Dan Jones
     

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