Big Block Buick twin turbo

Discussion in 'High Tech for Old Iron' started by Ergot, Oct 2, 2003.

  1. Ergot

    Ergot Fast with cash.

    Has anyone done this? There is a trend ( for those with the green ) amongst the Chevy clan involving big cubes and twin turbos. Ive heard of some of these pro touring cars ( like Chicane ) that are well over 1,000 horsepower with this setup. There are several 57 chevys with the big block dual hair dryer setup. ( Bob Reiger and Hayden Motorsports to name a few )

    http://www.promodifieds.net/Photos/Reiger/HTML/

    I dunno if you guys have seen the Chicane car anywhere ( we saw it at the last Autorama here in dallas ) but those custom turbo headers look SO friggin beautiful. On top of that the car itself is just gorgeous.

    I just want to do something different. I wonder what kind of power this sort of setup would make coupled with a Trishield level four race engine. :Brow:

    Suddenly it is possible that I could afford something like that so im doing a little virtual shopping.
     
  2. bobc455

    bobc455 Well-Known Member

    I'm aware of one guy on the board who is in the midst of this setup.

    Once the new blocks come out, I think you'll see a lot more engines like this. I got a quote on doing it to my 455, $7,000 (I already have FI) including twin intercoolers, custom headers, etc. I think a turbo setup would be wicked cool, but a supercharger would be easier.

    -Bob Cunningham
     
  3. alan

    alan High-tech Dinosaur

  4. AZ-69 Skylark

    AZ-69 Skylark Well-Known Member

    I'm looking forward to seeing forced induction Buick bigblocks. A centrifugal sc is easier, but turbos are better/more effecient. I think the fullsize Buicks would be best for turbos as they have more room in the engine bay. Me, I've changed my mind and decided to try a smallblock with twin turbos and fuel injection...it will be a while though.
     
  5. Ergot

    Ergot Fast with cash.

    Oh my God that is a beautiful/amazing/wood inducing/eyeball grabbing work of technological mastery! Hail the Dinosaur Gang! You guys own my new favorite Buick. :D

    I know some folks are touchy about their numbers but I'd *love* to know what kind of torque that bad beast puts out. Im thinking the 455 would be very happy with the extra airflow. Yeehaw!

    What an amazing machine.
     
  6. Ergot

    Ergot Fast with cash.

    Allot more engines like that would be awesome. Watch out twin turbo G bodies! The big guys are coming for yah! lol

    Of course we'll have to have an extra parachute or two on the back to stop after running those mid 6 and 7 second quarters. j/k :)

    7k.. Buick stuff is expensive. Worth it though for certain. Though 2600 for the xs procharger kit is quite reasonable. Maybe two of those would be the way to go. Can a centrifugal be two staged?

    hehe
     
  7. Mike T

    Mike T Well-Known Member

    Dual centrifugals, its been done. But its REALLY unneeded!

    :)

    An associate of mine builds custom turbo setups for a living and on several occasions we have started to build them...usually followed by a why? and then a never mind.

    Turbos are more efficient, no doubt, but the complexity and cost of such systems, plus the HEAT, just really outweighs most other considerations. Unless you just GOT to have 'em! Sometimes its hard to beat the wow factor.

    Kinda like an Offenhauser with dual quads, the single four is probably gonna run better with less work, but it just doesn't look as cool.:cool:

    Mike T
    XS Performance
    http://www.xsperformance.com
     
  8. AZ-69 Skylark

    AZ-69 Skylark Well-Known Member

    Mike, I know for the exhaust manifolds you can get an internal ceramic coating so good at blocking heat loss, they're actually only warm to the touch! The fact that you can touch them at all is a huge improvement. I'm not sure how effective turbo housing heatshields or coatings are for heat reduction.
     
  9. Stg1Regal

    Stg1Regal Yep Traction Issues!:)

    But what if it's a Twin Turbo Big Block Buick in those G-bodies?

    That would be SWEEET!! :laugh: :bglasses: :TU:
     
  10. Ergot

    Ergot Fast with cash.

    Yea, I'd have to agree in the end that its major overkill. Especially when a single large turbo can produce enough boost to blow the heads off. Probably true for centrifugals as well. Lol.

    There is that wow factor to consider but the XS Performance ( .net ) kit has plenty of wow going on as well. Richs car is brutishly beautiful! The price is very competative as well. Be nice to see more Buicks competing in classes allowing power adders like that.

    :)
     
  11. Ergot

    Ergot Fast with cash.

    Oh hell yes! Sweet Regal by the way. A buddy of mine had an 86 Monte SS with a stroker 383 in it. Holy mother of flaming pearls that bitch was almost scary to ride in. I bet your regal rips some serious ass!

    Your cardomain site is gonna be really helpfull to me here in about a month as im swapping a 430 into a 66 skylark.

    My trans is a longtail 400 though so Im still screwed out of a driveshaft. Balls!!!

    later
     
  12. Stg1Regal

    Stg1Regal Yep Traction Issues!:)

    :Brow:

    Thanks Jason on the compliment....

    Yep it does get up and move fast, but got issues with it being a peg leg 8.5 GN rear wich leads to big "lack of" traction issues:laugh: .

    When I turn up the wick on her , I hope to have a scary ride also, right now if your a passenger in it and I nail it, it is scary , I've managed to catch a few off gaurd!!:TU:

    Good luck in your project, touch base with me on any questions ,I'll do my best to help or answer.

    Later
     
  13. Ergot

    Ergot Fast with cash.

    Your welcome Chris!

    Oh man... posi, and some 10.5 inch meats and I bet the Regal will be squishin spines and causeing riders to soil themselves if you even *think* about hitting the pedal hard enough to open up the secondaries in that big ole carb.

    Gawd I love the Big Block community.. The scope of thinking is soooooooo different than most other arenas. I mean.. You dont see people with Nissan 240's dropping big blocks in them. Although I must admit to having had our asses handed to us in a very built 78 z28 by an old Z with a small block chevy wedged in there.

    Talk about a go-cart with an attitude.

    Thanks for the luck, I'll need it for sure. Definately will keep an eye on your cardomain page to see what you do with the Regal. :TU:

    Later
     
  14. BP_Motorworks

    BP_Motorworks Ragtop Racer

    Well,
    I have a BBC Chevy that I am supercharging by a centrifical. (Very far from being done) There are a few reasons why I like the centifical over the turbo.
    1) Less plumbing
    2) It is about the same price and can be less depending on
    application
    3) If you are drag racing, you have to spool up a turbo at the
    line. This causes inconsistent 60 foot times and plus, you
    are usually on the trans brake when you are doing this
    which causes excessive heat to your trans. (NOT GOOD) A
    centrifical does not require the spool up like a turbo.

    The only draw back I see is that a turbo is about 90% efficient,
    while a centrifical is only about 70 to 75% efficient. (The best roots are only 65% efficient)
    Keep in mind a big bore short stroke is recommended unless you have a heavy car. (3200 plus) Mine has a 4.350 bore but is only 439 cubic inches. Just a thought.

    Blair

    :stmad: :stmad: :stmad:
     
  15. 69RivieraGS

    69RivieraGS Well-Known Member

    Reviving this thread from a while back:

    I've been giving the Twin Turbo BBB idea some more thought. I'm currently working on converting a BBB to EFI using a SPX manifold and a Megasquirt EFI system. EFI definitely makes forced induction a lot easier.

    Now, given the inherent structrual defeciencies of the BBB it seems like some can be helped with twin turbo.
    IE: you can get big power and not have to spin as fast nor run a huge cam. A more moderate cam can alleviate lifter bore problems since springs don't need to be super tight(ie: no lifter bore girdle), and you also won't need expensive roller rockers.
    Not spinning it as fast means you won't need a block-girdle as quickly. Granted it'll be pretty easier to hit the ~600hp barrier with twin turbos even on pump gas with decent heads and a moderate cam so eventually you'll need a block girdle anyway.

    Of course there'll be power left at the table using this method, but it helps in not having to build such a crazy motor to jump start you to the 600hp mark especially if you have some DIY fab skills and turbo connections...

    And if you get the boost up there you might start needing girdle+halo, or a new aftermarket block.

    Just some thoughts... :idea2:
     
  16. 69RivieraGS

    69RivieraGS Well-Known Member

    I'm definitely a fan of turbos...

    I put one on my '94 v6 camaro and it took the ~3550lb car, 160hp stock 3.4L V6 from a ~16.5 @ 84.8 to ~14.2 @ 98.8 with running 10psi still on the totally stock motor(stock heads, cam, etc) but with tuning of course with enough fuel and the right spark timing. This motor also has 234,000 miles on it. It has a 9:1 compression and running 93 octane pump gas and careful tuning it has been living for years running this 10psi and being daily driven.

    So taking the same precausions(tuning and oil modifications) with a BBB it should work well. But boost should be a bit more conservative, perhaps 5psi on the 10:1 motors of the late 60's, etc. But with nice heads and big turbos you won't need super high pressure to make good power...
     
  17. bobc455

    bobc455 Well-Known Member

    What do you mean by efficiency? It could be interpreted a bunch of different ways.

    Thanks,

    -BC
     
  18. 69RivieraGS

    69RivieraGS Well-Known Member

    Yea. I would think one way to get an overall efficiency would be to:
    1.)Get a baseline power for the N/A engine.
    2.)Add power-adder, all else equal(nice in theory but not very good in practice...) but leave cold side disconnected from throttle body or carb and get another power measurement.
    3.) Connect cold side and get another power measurement.

    Eff = (P1-P2)/(P3-P1)

    Although that's a bit unrealistic because to realize the real power potential for a FI engine you'd change a lot of things than from the N/A version.
     
  19. Turbo455

    Turbo455 James

    I have a twin turbo buick 455 in my 74 camaro use a small cam and lots of exhaust. it works great. all the cheby guys ask why a buick:Dou: they think torque does not matter until they run me and then say how can i do that
     
  20. 69RivieraGS

    69RivieraGS Well-Known Member

    Would you mind giving any specs on the turbos you're running? Cam specs? :laugh:
     

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