I am thinking of going over my vinyl kitchen floor w/ cermaic tile. I have worked with cement board underlayment in the past and did not care for it.Is there any reason why I shouldn't use a plywood underlayment instead. What would be the downside? The kitchen has the original vinyl floor, so I am guessing it has a total of 1.125" of subfloor (.75" sheething + .375" from the vinyl underlayment). Can I simply add an additional .375" plywood underlayment over the vinyl and lay my tile? If so, do I need to prep the but joints where the sheets touch? Thanks in advance! :beer
NO NO NO, USE DURROCK, OR AT THE VERY LEAST Hardi Backer..I dont care what anyone else says if you put tile on wood you will not get good adhesion.Wood is succeptible to moisture(expansion and contraction) wich is fine under carpet or lineloum,but not ceramic...My advice is suck it up.....and put down the cement board.....You dont want to do this project again.......And the money you save buy only doing it once you can spend on a BUICK......Best of luck
Here's what I remember... Back when I sold the stuff for a living, this was a pretty common question. The only people that really had any problems were the ones that wanted to put ceramic directly on top of their vinyl. That can be done, and made to work, but it is a lot of work and most of the time people do what they want to regardless of what you tell them. o No: Back to the matters at hand, you would probably be fine with that extra layer of plywood, according to the training I got from Armstrong. Admittedly, portland cement does not like to stick to wood. Generally what I recommended was that they screw the new layer of plywood down extra tight with galvanized decking screws (on about a 6-8" grid), and then go over the whole surface with a floor leveling cement. It's a runny, self-leveling cement you spread across the floor with a squeegee. When mixed it has a consistency like wallpaper paste that gets into the cracks between the boards and the lowspots from the screws and provides a good level surface for you to attach your tile to. As a bonus, it also leaves a thin layer of cement over the wood, giving the portland cement a much better surface to adhere too. Chris is right, the cement board is the best stuff to use, and I would recommend it in a situation like a bathroom where there was a better chance that things would get completely soaked and there was a chance that the wood would start to buckle. In a kitchen (a lower humidity area), if you use a latex-modified grout, glazed tiles, and seal all of your grout lines after the grout cures (about a week), you should be fine with plywood. - Freed
I cannot stress enough how much I agree with Chris72gs. I am right now in the middle of renovating my home. All the tile floors in the house were laid over linoleum. They are all buckling, cracking and having the grout fall out. I am starting over anyway, but its still a mess. Supposedly the tiles in my home were laid by a professional. It really doesn't matter who does it, too many variables to control. Linoleum/vinyl is generally perimeter glued, which leaves a lot of air space in the center. When you lay the tile, any little cut will allow moisture (like water used to mix group) to saturate the subfloor. At minimum it causes heaving and cracking, but could cause worse subfloor rot. Even if you have vinyl tile down, the same can hold true. If the seams between tiles have any gaps, or any tiles weren't totally glued down, moisture can and will get in. Your beautiful floor will be a mess within 6 months. By the way, its a bear to try and fix and/or remove if tile over linoleum has been laid as well. Use the Durarock. You will be much happier in the long run.
I've renovated a number of homes over the years as a business, don't use plywood. They make DuraRock in 1/4" thick sheets. It's worth the time and effort to put that down. Is your vinyl flooring glued all over or just around the edge. You may be able to get it up if floor height becomes an issue. But don't put ceramic over wood, it's a recipe for disaster.
Contact "Lee Bacon" on this board. He's a Buick guy and has been in the floor business all his life.:TU:
well,I`m going to go against what everyone else has said.When I built our home 3 years ago I used 1/2"plywood under the tile.Its been 3 years and I`ve had no problems.I by no meens am a flooring contracter but I am a finish carpentry contracter,and I talk to alot of other trades.I would not hesitate to use 1/2" plywood under tile. Keith
the only qualification i carry into this is i work in a plywood mill, but i would say if you are rebuilding the floor from the joists up, go with pul. in the case you are describing you need the most stable medium available you can afford. otherwise you [or the next owner] will be redoing it and cussing out the fool who did it wrong.
Here is something to consider. Ceramic tile is COLD, COLD COLD!! In the electrical department at Menards they sell a low voltage electric in floor heat. Just install it directly in the mud bed. This way you get a shock to bare feet in the middle of the winter. Would be much more comfortable.
I am replacing the floor in preparation to sell the house. I want to avoid using a wood-appearing flooring product. However, I would like to avoid a clunky build-up. Tearing up the existing vinyl (mit subfloor) would really bite. Pulling out the base cabinets is not an option. I found a locking 14" floor tile product I liked. It installs under the same premise as Pergo, but is square (faux) tile. Of course the color I like is recently discontinued. Bummer. Cermaic tile seems to be the best bang for the buck. This is an inexpensive townhome so a big investment is not rational. Many products I find are 3-4 dollars per square foot for the material. I've checked Menards, Home Depot and some odd lot retailers and came up short with an alternative to ceramic. I did find an alternative to cement board, however. The name escapes me, but at first glance it appears to be more of a pressed fiberboard of sorts. Not quite fiberglass, not quite wood. I'll have to research it further.o No:
